Time for Women with Talent to Take Back Older Female Roles in Pantos

Panto Dames have been a thing since 1806 when a certain Mr Simmons decided to play Mother Goose.... I think it's time for talented actresses to take back elder female roles from the tired tropes played by men since the Victorian era.

That 1806 was part of the Victorian era would have been a surprise to Her Late Majesty as she wasn't born until 1819 and didn't ascend the throne until 1837.

Theatre is in a dire situation and its attitudes towards women and working class people is shocking. Women are massively underrepresented on main stages and interesting female characters are few and far between. Pantomime dames are the last of women’s problems in theatre. If you really care about women start a campaign that women should write women’s stories. Same applies to TV.

I’m not sure I can see Emma Thompson or Judi Dench lining up for these roles.

Slightly off topic but I have never seen a dame played by a gay man. I didn't realize it was even a thing.

And while we're about it, let's have a real horse or a real cow, none of these two actors in a costume, one as the head and front legs, and one as the arse and rear legs. Plenty of real livestock would be glad of the work.

Oh yes, don't go to see Les Ballets Trockadero de Monte Carlo either.

It's not ridiculous.
You've been brought up with this norm and find it "normal".
It's not.
And it's not funny.

The script can be written differently with a lot more imagination for a female playing the role.

Panto Dames are based on a tired old misogynistic trope of women.
They allow the audience to laugh at (often older) female figures.

Where are the equivalent older male figures we all get to laugh at in pantos?

There aren't any because panto dames are misogynistic sexist tropes.
Just like the women in Benny Hill sketches.

In my honest view? Yes.
I never liked women playing prince charming - I find it weird.
It was started in Victorian times for the male gaze.
Get a young actor to do that - plenty out there.

What are your thoughts, OP, on Glenda Jackson having played King Lear? Michelle Terry playing Richard III?

Should men also take back the Prince Charming role which is traditionally played by a woman?

The principal boy was played by a woman for the titillation of Victorian men at a time when women had to cover every part of their body except their face.

"Allowing" a slim young good-looking woman to prance around the stage in a pair of tights with a tunic barely covering her backside must have been quite the pleasure ride for the male half of the audience. It was a gimmick to get bums on seats, that's all and for all the wrong reasons.

Really? I must admit I haven't been to a pantomime for a long, long time.

Best pantomime dame I ever saw was Les Dawson in "Babes in the Wood" at the Palace Theatre, Manchester in 1985. My what a cast that was! Ruth Madoc played Robin Hood and John Nettles, then at the height of his Bergerac fame, played the Sherrif of Nottingham. Oh and John Noakes was playing whatever the comic male part was.

Panto Dames have been a thing since 1806 when a certain Mr Simmons decided to play Mother Goose as a Witch (how original) rather than as a caring grandmother figure. Nowadays panto dames are mainly played by gay men in drag.

I think it's time for talented actresses to take back elder female roles from the tired tropes played by men since the Victorian era.

But most of the time, it just isn't. Where I live there are always posters for the pantos at four large venues. I always notice there is one female name/face on each poster and between four and seven men. I'm sure this doesn't represent every panto in the history of time, but I've noticed the pattern in all four venues posters for the last decade (since I started noticing).

Take them back from what, exactly?

The pantomime dame has always been played by a man. It was originated as such. And pantomimes themselves are descendants of the traditional mummers' play in which all the roles were played by men.

Panto Dames have been a thing since 1806 when a certain Mr Simmons decided to play Mother Goose as a Witch (how original) rather than as a caring grandmother figure. Nowadays panto dames are mainly played by gay men in drag.

I think it's time for talented actresses to take back elder female roles from the tired tropes played by men since the Victorian era.

@ErrolTheDragon we go every year and weirdly enough I was just thinking about this as he was the King in 2025 in wonderful costumes and full make up. I’m sure he’s been a more traditional dame at points but I’d have to think back. He was married to Jane MacDonald for 2024 so not then.

i don’t care about dames being played by men but what I hate is interesting roles for women being played by men for laughs. Like Trunchbull or Miss Hannigan.

In what way/ways is theatre in a dire situation? I ask that as someone that has worked in theatre for 30 years.

Your opinions are not universal. Stop telling people what they’re allowed to find funny.

You sound pompous and patronising. .

You might enjoy ‘Into the Woods’ OP - obviously not a panto for the kiddies but very funny without cross dressing.

pantomine ‘Dames’ are grotesques - I’m not sure if older women actors would want the parts. They’re often played by quite masculine actors - they’re not really that much like drag queens.

I’m curious if anyone had been to one of Julian Clary’s pantos - afaik he doesn’t play the ‘dame’ but instead some sort of fabulously clothed ‘spirit of something’ inventions - not sure how the dynamics of that works?