To think that no racist ever admits they are a racist

An interesting post that suggests to even question levels of racism in a country is in itself racist as it is viewed as minimisation or denial.

So you wanted objective evidence:
A Sept 2025 survey showed that 37% of people in the UK believed that there is a great deal of racism in the UK, rising to 48% of 18-27 year olds.

Whereas the World Population Review of ranking of racist countries places the UK 16th out of a 100 (by comparison Denmark is 1st and China is 75th).

So the perception that the UK is a racist country is at odds with the evidence of its ranking of racism by country.

Do you deem pointing this out to be racist?

I'll put my head above too and say I don't believe immigration is the problem. There are good and bad people of all races / nationalities. I believe its wealth inequality that is the root of the problem.

I'll put my head above too and say I don't believe immigration is the problem. There are good and bad people of all races / nationalities. I believe its wealth inequality that is the root of the problem.

The comment 'actual racism is less prevalent than assumed' has no validity unless it is made as a result of a study that objectively evidences:

1. The assumed prevalence of racism
2. The actual prevalance of racism
3. That 1 is greater than 2.

OK - I'll put my head above the parapet and state that there is something wrong with people that aren't concerned that a 22% increase in UK population since 1990 largely driven by immigration has created a problem in the UK.

Note: it doesn't matter if it's legal or illegal and it doesn't matter where the migrants come from - all that matters is numbers and whether they are net tax contributors or net tax beneficiaries.

I've answered that already in my second paragraph. Perhaps you're failing to understand what I said? I'll try again.
Disadvantaged people do not have enough resources to enjoy the life they would like. This means they are more likely to be concerned about where the resources they need are, and how they could get more of them than advantaged people.
Sometimes this leads them to question things like wealth inequality and lean to the left. However sometimes they can come to believe that the scarcity of resources isn't because the wealthy have them, its because other groups (immigrants) are taking them away from them. Then they may move to the right.
Where education comes in is two fold.
Firstly the better the persons education the greater the liklihood they can elevate themselves to a better life, where scarcity of resources impacts them less.
Secondly, their education is likely to have honed their critical thinking skills, so they are more likely to take a wider view of a situation. For example, to question whether getting rid of immigrants is really going to be life changing, particularly when the price to pay for a party who promises this is a further reduction in resources they may need, such as health and welfare provision.

I've answered that already in my second paragraph. Perhaps you're failing to understand what I said? I'll try again.
Disadvantaged people do not have enough resources to enjoy the life they would like. This means they are more likely to be concerned about where the resources they need are, and how they could get more of them than advantaged people.
Sometimes this leads them to question things like wealth inequality and lean to the left. However sometimes they can come to believe that the scarcity of resources isn't because the wealthy have them, its because other groups (immigrants) are taking them away from them. Then they may move to the right.
Where education comes in is two fold.
Firstly the better the persons education the greater the liklihood they can elevate themselves to a better life, where scarcity of resources impacts them less.
Secondly, their education is likely to have honed their critical thinking skills, so they are more likely to take a wider view of a situation. For example, to question whether getting rid of immigrants is really going to be life changing, particularly when the price to pay for a party who promises this is a further reduction in resources they may need, such as health and welfare provision.

No but the poster I said sounded racist didn't say anything like that. She said there was something wrong with people who weren't 'concerned about illegal immigrants'.

The correlation might well be there, but you’re failing to understand or even consider why, why do you think that correlation exists?

That's disingenuous.
Having concerns about immigration doesn't entail having a personal dislike for potential immigrants, any more than objecting to a housing development in your village requires a hatred of the people who might move there.

The correlation between education and liberalism isn't bigotry, its a fact supported by emperical evidence. The patronising slant you gave that, by suggesting that clever and educated people can see the left wing light is your work, not mine.
The correlation I am making is that the more advantaged a person is (and high education is an advantage) the better their lives are likely to be. The less need they will have to fight over scarce resources with other groups, the less impacted they will be by social problems, the less likely they are to be personally angry with the world, look for a scapegoat and punch down.
The point being that disadvantage needs addressing at its root so that people have no need for the discontent that leads some to these behaviours.

Ok fair enough. I'm not racist against them either, I hope!

My point about people saying 'racism is overused' is that most people who say that have never actually experienced racism. It would be like a man saying 'misogyny is overused'. It's like well if it doesn't affect you in a negative way then you may not think it exists or minimise it. Doesn't mean it isn't a major issue for those suffering from it.

No feeling of superiority here whatsoever.
Infact I usually despise the sort of person who corrects grammar.
I suppose I'm just so fed up with openly racist people hiding behind immigration issues that I resorted to belittling them.
I don't actually like that I did that, it felt a bit like eating a dirty McDonald's tbh.
I am in lots of pain after a horrible ski accident and have a horrible racist misogynistic neighbour who is really really getting to me.
I am so fed up with the lack of compassion lots of people can have and how easy they find it to blame immigration for everything.
I shouldn't have done it, but it comes from a place of frustration rather than superiority.
I say all this as someone who has concerns about immigration and the sort of people who come here un vetted. I just don't think this justifies racism.

@BillieWiper

So OK - in your view does the following statement sound racist to you :

Since 1990 the UK population has increased from 57 million to 70 million by 2025 (an increase of 22%.

This has led to an increase in pressure on existing infrastructure (roads, water, education, healthcare, housing , environment etc etc ) and the economy.

The increase has been driven primarily by high net migration and, to a lesser extent, natural change (births minus deaths) and increased longevity.

Whether the migration is legal or illegal is irrelevant, the skin colour / ethnicity of the migrants is also irrelevant. What is relevant is the net migration numbers and whether those (including their families) migrating to the UK are net tax contributors or net beneficiaries.

'have concerns' about an entire group of people you never met en masse just because they're from a different country or race sounds like to me she's not fond of them. Sorry I forgot the exact words she used.

Your posts are myopic and off topic.

Also, “how dare you?”. How dare I what? Express my opinion? Not bow down to your deflection? That is not how it works here.

What I have posted is “not that deep”
because it does not affect you and you have no empathy for other people’s experiences; even if we type it out till kingdom come on this thread.

Other posters have validated my comments / experiences but you refuse to acknowledge that.

I do not care AT ALL about your heritage. I have my own heritage, life experience, family experience, professional experience etc which is heavily coloured with racism. I don’t need your sign off to speak my truth.

This topic is about racism and despite your numerous posts you have not addressed ONE single point that I have made about the experiences of black/brown people. Not one.

I listed some discussion points and you immediately dismissed it as a rant. So condescending.

You wrote a whole paragraph about how I dont know you (well duh - why would I know you? This is an anonymous internet forum).

Typical revert to victim mode.

I made a very direct point to you which is that:

Black / brown people have been disadvantaged for centuries. White males should get into universities based on their qualifications and merit. Just like I did, just like all minorities have to. Why is this news to you?

I ask you again: why were you quiet when black/brown people were being excluded from opportunities they were qualified for and a lot of times were OVER qualified for?

Why can’t you have a sensible discussion about this?

It is only NOW that you have a voice about this - because it is because it is NOW affecting white males.

You did not give a jot when it was black/brown people who were being marginalised.

You have NOTHING to say about how black/brown men fought and died in pointless wars on behalf of the Colonialist Empire.

You had nothing to say when it was mainly black/brown people being pushed to live in horribly disadvantaged areas, never encouraged to aspire to higher level jobs, exposed to crime for survival, not given any assistance to break this horrific cycle.

It is only NOW that you care to post, because it is now affecting your ilk.

White males should get out and do the jobs and make the sacrifices that black/brown people have been making for years.

Your posts suggest that you inherently believe that diversity initiatives - to LEVEL the “playing field” marginalise white males, and they deserve their “position” above others.

This is because you inherently believe that white males or white people are more deserving of life-enhancing privilege and opportunities than black/brown people.

That makes you a racist.

If I was wrong, you would have engaged in this discussion in an entirely different way.

No one is lucky in this current environment. No one at all.

There is a thread that has been running for many years on Mumsnet of witches talking to other witches 😊 I think it was started by a Mnetter who asked 'Any other witches on here.' And it turns out there were LOADS. I know a couple of witches too and have done in the past too.

Its nature based religion.

I don't think witches exist do they? And don't see what they've got to do with racism?

That poster said "have concerns" and you changed that to "despise". Why was that?

Your posts are myopic and off topic.

Also, “how dare you?”. How dare I what? Express my opinion? Not bow down to your deflection? That is not how it works here.

What I have posted is “not that deep”
because it does not affect you and you have no empathy for other people’s experiences; even if we type it out till kingdom come on this thread.

Other posters have validated my comments / experiences but you refuse to acknowledge that.

I do not care AT ALL about your heritage. I have my own heritage, life experience, family experience, professional experience etc which is heavily coloured with racism. I don’t need your sign off to speak my truth.

This topic is about racism and despite your numerous posts you have not addressed ONE single point that I have made about the experiences of black/brown people. Not one.

I listed some discussion points and you immediately dismissed it as a rant. So condescending.

You wrote a whole paragraph about how I dont know you (well duh - why would I know you? This is an anonymous internet forum).

Typical revert to victim mode.

I made a very direct point to you which is that:

Black / brown people have been disadvantaged for centuries. White males should get into universities based on their qualifications and merit. Just like I did, just like all minorities have to. Why is this news to you?

I ask you again: why were you quiet when black/brown people were being excluded from opportunities they were qualified for and a lot of times were OVER qualified for?

Why can’t you have a sensible discussion about this?

It is only NOW that you have a voice about this - because it is because it is NOW affecting white males.

You did not give a jot when it was black/brown people who were being marginalised.

You have NOTHING to say about how black/brown men fought and died in pointless wars on behalf of the Colonialist Empire.

You had nothing to say when it was mainly black/brown people being pushed to live in horribly disadvantaged areas, never encouraged to aspire to higher level jobs, exposed to crime for survival, not given any assistance to break this horrific cycle.

It is only NOW that you care to post, because it is now affecting your ilk.

White males should get out and do the jobs and make the sacrifices that black/brown people have been making for years.

Your posts suggest that you inherently believe that diversity initiatives - to LEVEL the “playing field” marginalise white males, and they deserve their “position” above others.

This is because you inherently believe that white males or white people are more deserving of life-enhancing privilege and opportunities than black/brown people.

That makes you a racist.

If I was wrong, you would have engaged in this discussion in an entirely different way.

No one is lucky in this current environment. No one at all.

That your comment that anyone stating that the word racist / racism is being overused or that actual racism is less prevalent than assumed is something that a racist would say is clearly incorrect.

In your view to even question the level of racism in society is in itself evidence of racism.

It's a medieval mindset where anyone questioning the level of witchcraft in society is in itself suggestive of evidence of witchcraft by that person.

That your comment that anyone stating that the word racist / racism is being overused or that actual racism is less prevalent than assumed is something that a racist would say is clearly incorrect.

In your view to even question the level of racism in society is in itself evidence of racism.

It's a medieval mindset where anyone questioning the level of witchcraft in society is in itself suggestive of evidence of witchcraft by that person.