Is this just getting ridiculous! UNIVERSAL CREDIT

It was the general principle of posters saying it was ridiculous providing so much documentation and I was pointing out that it’s often the same for jobs as well.

No. I've never been asked to provide a full-length photo of myself next to the sign for my street when I've applied for a job. I live alone, so that was impossible.

No I don’t get paper statements either but you can download them and print them.

Not with paper bills or statements, no. Which is the usual requirement, despite the country being largely digital.

So you don’t have any bank accounts or pay any bills?

For example I needed an enhanced DBS for a job, for which you have to supply a specific set of documents. I had to fill in the details of all adults in my house. Then wait for the DBS form to be accepted (I had no reason to believe it wouldn’t be but even so it was still a relief when it came through) so that I could start the job. I accepted that this was a necessary and important safeguarding task, I didn’t complain. And it has to be renewed regularly.
When I started my current job I had to take in all sorts of forms of ID, GCSE certificates etc.

I wouldn't be able to provide those specific documents now - not passport, not driving licence, not paper bank statements, not paper electricity, gas or council tax bill. I was, fortunately, savvy enough to add my DBS to the update scheme so my employer can just look up the certificate and see there have been no changes.

Exam certificates, my ex burned them to stop me getting a job. I could chuck a load of money at all of the exam boards to search for my records, but it's a lot of money, as is getting a passport. If I weren't already in a job, I just wouldn't be able to do it.

I know I don't have the documents possible to pass an online dole office check as I used to claim years back and it failed, but because I still had a passport at that point, they decided it was probably me in front of them and not anybody else. And as an aside, I only had that because 9 and a half years previously, the headteacher at my kids' school countersigned as a favour despite only being in the role for 6 months (in exchange for me coming in to facilitate a big activity where the booked person had cancelled at the last minute).

I've also had an NHS job offer withdrawn because my previous employer didn't have a company domain for his email, despite having payslips, as it didn't meet their rules for references - and the employer before that didn't count as it was outside their five year cutoff for references.

I did, however, get a job somewhere else. If it were failing to provide information for UC, with no money and no job (and no money to keep the phone and internet going, never mind pay for documentation), it would have been completely different, as you can't just claim from somewhere else instead.

I understand a lot of posters are saying it feels like a lot of stress for their UC claim, but isn’t it the same as the things you have to do when applying for a job or working?

For example I needed an enhanced DBS for a job, for which you have to supply a specific set of documents. I had to fill in the details of all adults in my house. Then wait for the DBS form to be accepted (I had no reason to believe it wouldn’t be but even so it was still a relief when it came through) so that I could start the job. I accepted that this was a necessary and important safeguarding task, I didn’t complain. And it has to be renewed regularly.

When I started my current job I had to take in all sorts of forms of ID, GCSE certificates etc.

Previously I have worked for a government department and the identity checking and form filling is quite full-on.

I wasn’t offended that they ‘didn’t believe me’ who I was. I didn’t think ‘surely they could just look all of this up online’. I accepted that they have procedures to follow - to ensure that I have a legal right to work in the U.K. - that be sure I have not faked my identity to avoid disclosing criminal convictions - that I have not lied on my application form. If I wanted the job, that was the deal.

DD had similar when applying for temp work, she had to upload various documents and then do on online camera check of her face so that they could verify that the documents belonged to her.

Surely providing evidence for UC is similar, you are asking for financial support because your income isn’t high enough to support your living costs. Therefore, you need to provide evidence.

It’s an issue now that with AI and computers it’s so much easier for people to forge documents hence more checks. And due to GDPR documents can only be held for a specific purpose for a specific amount of time hence having to upload things again.

Yes

@dizzydizzydizzy Do you receive financial support from the government due to your condition?

Honestly, the training for UC reviewers is woefully poor and completely lacking. The rules are also really strict on what can and cannot be accepted. If the reviewer lacks a bit of critical thinking or doesn't have a lot of life experience, it can lead to ridiculous questions like the ones you were asked. Unfortunately, there is no set list of questions, so reviewers are expected to make them up from the information given.

If there are no obvious suspicious transactions, it can lead to silly questions like what you were asked. The reviewers are on MW and graded on productivity. If they're found to not ask about something (even if it's something really obvious), it can lead to being marked down, which then leads to being called into a capability meeting. It's all really ridiculous.

Careful, your kindness is showing. 🙄

This is the thing. People say it's only if there's genuine concerns raised that you'll be hassled, but that isn't true. The levels of incompetence, in both the computer systems used and the staff themselves, is appallingly high.

Yes you can, just not housing costs; support for mortgage interest after a certain period.

You can get UC if you own a house.

Both of these.

Thanks. As a single mum I even had to pay back child benefit for my youngest child before he turned 18 just because my income hit 50k. But then again, I have a mortgage so would never be entitled to anything anyway....

Sure. So, as I mentioned it depends on individual circumstances. I'll tell you mine first of all.
UC is composed of multiple "elements". They add them all up to get the total award amount then deductions are made for income and sometimes for repayments of certain loans, debts and advance payments. The remaining amount is how much the claimant will receive that month.
Each month long period is based on circumstances and income during the claimant's assessment period. This period depends on when the first claim to UC is made. For example my assessment period is the 10th of the month to the 9th of the next month. The amount is calculated and I then receive my payment on the 16th.
For earned income, there is something called a work allowance. This is not a payment which is added to a claim but is the amount of income per claim that can be earned before any deductions will start to be made from the UC award. If there is no housing element on the claim the work allowance is £684. If there is housing element then work allowance is £411. Over and above these amounts, deductions are made at the rate of 55p per £1 of earned income. This is based on net income. For example, the last earned income on my claim was £2300 per month and we don't receive housing element. The calculation is £2300 - £684 which leaves £1616. Multiply this by 0.55 to get £888.80. This is how much will be deducted.
My UC award is made up of the following elements:
Couple over 25 - £628.10
2 Children born after April 2017 - £585.62
Childcare - £515
LCWRA - £423.27
Carer (this is a different payment from Carer's Allowance which is paid separately. Carer's Allowance and the Carer element of UC can both be claimed at the same time but if someone receives CA the monthly amount is deducted in full from their UC. We do not claim CA) - £201.68
Total - £2353.67 before deductions
Minus the £888 for earned income which leaves £1464.87 and that's our UC payment for the month.
This can be tweaked to fit many different scenarios and circumstances. Yes, we receive elements for health related issues but equally if didn't but we received housing element or had a higher childcare bill we could be looking at a similar amount. For a salary of £50k the deduction would be in the region of £1435 so we would still receive £918 UC.
For a basic award of a couple with 2 children, no housing element, no childcare and no disability/carer elements then no a salary of £50k would mean no payment of UC as the deduction for income would wipe out the total UC amount.

Sure. So, as I mentioned it depends on individual circumstances. I'll tell you mine first of all.

UC is composed of multiple "elements". They add them all up to get the total award amount then deductions are made for income and sometimes for repayments of certain loans, debts and advance payments. The remaining amount is how much the claimant will receive that month.

Each month long period is based on circumstances and income during the claimant's assessment period. This period depends on when the first claim to UC is made. For example my assessment period is the 10th of the month to the 9th of the next month. The amount is calculated and I then receive my payment on the 16th.

For earned income, there is something called a work allowance. This is not a payment which is added to a claim but is the amount of income per claim that can be earned before any deductions will start to be made from the UC award. If there is no housing element on the claim the work allowance is £684. If there is housing element then work allowance is £411. Over and above these amounts, deductions are made at the rate of 55p per £1 of earned income. This is based on net income. For example, the last earned income on my claim was £2300 per month and we don't receive housing element. The calculation is £2300 - £684 which leaves £1616. Multiply this by 0.55 to get £888.80. This is how much will be deducted.

My UC award is made up of the following elements:

Couple over 25 - £628.10
2 Children born after April 2017 - £585.62
Childcare - £515
LCWRA - £423.27
Carer (this is a different payment from Carer's Allowance which is paid separately. Carer's Allowance and the Carer element of UC can both be claimed at the same time but if someone receives CA the monthly amount is deducted in full from their UC. We do not claim CA) - £201.68

Total - £2353.67 before deductions
Minus the £888 for earned income which leaves £1464.87 and that's our UC payment for the month.

This can be tweaked to fit many different scenarios and circumstances. Yes, we receive elements for health related issues but equally if didn't but we received housing element or had a higher childcare bill we could be looking at a similar amount. For a salary of £50k the deduction would be in the region of £1435 so we would still receive £918 UC.

For a basic award of a couple with 2 children, no housing element, no childcare and no disability/carer elements then no a salary of £50k would mean no payment of UC as the deduction for income would wipe out the total UC amount.

That's awful. It really does all sound excessive.

I had a UC review last year.

They asked me to take a photo of myself holding my passport next to my face.

Sent one in. Rejected as couldn't see all four corners of the passport (one corner had a about a mm missing from the photo).

Sent it again. Rejected because it was using the selfie side of my camera not the front facing camera.

So I rigged up a makeshift tripod for my phone camera and set the timer as I've no one in the house to hold it to the exacting conditions they needed, and took a third photo. 🙄

I then had to send in three months worth of my bank statements for a random set of dates, from all of my bank accounts in a certain file format, jpg.

Sent in. Rejected. They didn't have the address on. I'd not even noticed this, if just downloaded them from my online banking and sent them all in.

I tried to get them through my online banking with my address on and couldn't. I tried the online chat and it was very "computer says no".

So I tried telephone banking and after a 30 minute phonecall I got them all sent to me for the set dates, from all my accounts, with my address on.

I then had a phonecall appointment where they asked me questions like:

"I can see a standing order for £5 that says Xmas savings and goes to your other account, can you tell me what it's for?."

"I can see a direct debit for sheilas wheels insurance, can you tell me what it's for?" 🤦

And so on. I'm autistic and struggle with phone calls/ auditory processing. I also have anxiety.

They finished the call by saying they may or may not call back within two weeks for another telephone appointment.

20 days later I had ANOTHER phone call appointment which was very very similar to the first one.

I actually cried with relief when they said my review was finished and fine. I spent almost a month so so stressed and anxious.

I'm a single parent carer and have conditions myself. I know they have to check things but it seems such a farcical long winded process!

If it happens in future I will be asking for more support with it.

I dread to think how my son will navigate these things when I'm gone. He needs a LOT more support than me and is so anxious and vulnerable. It's scary to think if he doesn't manage a review check like this he'd be thrown into financial crisis.

Having caring responsibilities and claiming carers element would boost the UC claim but could just as easily be because of high rent or having numerous children on the claim but yes usually there is a good reason for it being high or them still being able to claim on a high income !

Right so when people wang on about people on middle incomes claiming benefits it's because they have caring responsibilities and are likely to be struggling to make ends meet. I have no problem with that.

The wait for a decision for DLA can be very long too. Especially if it goes all the way to tribunal. Then you also get back payments for UC elements related to claiming DLA as well which can also be very large.

In my case, it was never queried and I never received a letter about it.

But then in almost 2 years, I've never had a UC review either.

It really only takes a high rent or a couple of disabled children on the claim ( child disability elements hugely increase a claim). Or carers elements for the parents which they can claim even if earnings a highish wage. There's no earnings thresholds on carers element. You could have one of a couple claiming carers element for an elderly parent , one for a disabled child. That immediately boosts the UC claim by £400 a month. The higher the total of all the UC elements then the more chance of getting some UC even after deductions for earnings. I think we'll see the UC system being further scrutinised in the near future. They are already cutting the LCWRA in half from April.

I think you'd need to have a quite a high rent and a few kids on the claim to get UC at earnings of 50k. When you have kids or someone on LCWRA it becomes quite a generous benefit with the work allowances and taper rates.
I came across a couple this week. No kids .One of the couple couldn't work due to health. The other working part time earning £1200 a month with a social housing rent of around £400 a month. They were getting around £1000 UC per month UC plus PIP etc.
It's the single people with no work allowances that struggle. For them it's a very basic amount to live on or a small top up to help with rent. If you are single and have a mortage and lose your job you are pretty stuffed.