Dodgy Church Pastor

Def not Cof E. Some bizarre self defined thing, Inthink.

Brilliant post, @CraftyGin

So, it appears there was a stipend to the pastor last year of nearly £30K. How does that compare to CofE?

Charges for phone and internet of over £3K for the year seem high. My bias is showing but I would happily bet the pastor is charging the phone he uses for personal calls to the church.

Travel costs of nearly £20K and vehicle costs of £25K are very high, also television costs of £30K seem high to me.

Perhaps others closer to the sector can correct me.

Dodgy as fuck.

tbh I don’t think any religious organisation should (more or less) be considered to be a ‘charitable organisation’. They should only get taxpayers money for activities which truly benefit their communities. There’s a local Buddhist organisation who do organise their finances on this basis - they don’t expect the general public to subsidise their ‘internal’ activities.

but that’s a wider discussion - this particular couple seem to be committing financial abuse.

Hi OP, I'm a Christian and am really disturbed by this. Being blessed by God is not linked with giving money. After the pandemic, I was looking for a new church to attend and found one near me in the UK, run solely by a married couple of pastors and there was a whole section on the website about the expectation of giving 10% of one's income. I think this is in line with some churches in the US but it is not an amount I can afford. I found a nice, quite formal Anglican church where there is a collection during a hymn and a pouch is passed down the church with no expectation whatsoever to give. Some people give and many don't and both are fine.

I would urge you to leave and find another church.

It won't be a C of E church. C of E priests have a salary and aren't called 'pastors'.

Okay, I found the ‘church’ on the Charity Commission website.

They are claiming annual expenditures significantly in excess of what they claim to take in. Someone might be interested in this. But it wouldn’t be against the law for the pastor to have an inheritance, for example.

The statement of purpose is waffly. I am enough of a cultural mainstream Christian to find it, together with OP’s description if a coercive element to the giving, highly distasteful.

Some PP are correct that all religions encourage - and need - donations - but when it slides into coercion, it has raised a red flag.

OP, I think there is enough to be going on with. PP’s idea to contact a journalist is good. Or the fraud squad, or perhaps Citizens’ Advice in the first instance. CA could advise on your best option.

Here's a breakdown of where the money goes:

THE ALPHA APOSTOLIC CHURCH

He literally says you will not be blessed unless you give to this altar and this church. Word for word, three services a week.

he’d be getting told where to shove his “blessings” and swiftly reported to the charities commission if I were you..

it’s clearly shady AF not to mention deeply unchristian….

The congregation are probably either people who've grown up with this sort of church so think its normal or who are a bit vulnerable

If people are silly enough to think God looks at your giving before deciding to bless you that’s on them. If it is a registered charity they need to submit accounts and annual report - the Charities Commission tend to be on top of places that don’t make regular submissions.

If Trustees aren’t having regular meetings or seeing financial accounts they’re in breach of their duties and need to deal with that. Assuming everyone involved are adults they need to take responsibility for their choice to give or not give. While tithing is actively encouraged, it’s still a choice of what to give and who to give it too - and whether to attend church or not.

Not anymore, search with what’s been provided and you can find out trustees and financial info in seconds.

Well I don't see what the fact he may live in social housing has to do with it?

But yeah, if you suspect he's dodgy report him and stop going. But be careful. I don't want to sound dramatic but he may have links to crime and criminals and might try and scare you away from ruining his dodgy plans.

Blessed by God, not by him.

He's trying to make his congregation think they need to give him money or God won't like them.

OP,

Start by going to the Charity Commission website to see whether the church is registered using the tips above.

Please let us know the answer

Police, write a summary of what you have said here. It really does sound like fraud.
Try a local journalist, a real one who checks sources, publishes in print not a wannabe who puts garbage on Soc Media.
Do both OP. Journo will be pleased if it develops into a court case.

Why are you giving us this phone no, OP?

Only you know the name of the church and the pastor, so only you can make the call. You have the evidence.

We can help you work out what to say.

It’s a personality cult, not a real church.

join a real one Methodist , c of e, catholic, Quaker, urc, so many good ones.

The real ministers get paid very little (many have to use food banks as the stipend is so low).

Just wanted to add that financial giving to a church should be a personal thing, between you and God. In my church, only the treasurer knows how much you give (if you give through your bank account or gift aid). No plate is passed around.
I know of some churches (independent African churches) where people have to walk up to the front and place their money in a box in front of everyone, which isn't right.

In my experience (of main stream Anglican churches), encouraging regular giving is a completely normal part of being part of a church. The 10% is also known as tithing - giving 10% of what you earn. This means different things to different people - before or after tax? including other charitable giving?
Some people can afford to give more, some less but 10% is the figure we are encouraged to prayerfully consider.

Phil Collins nailed it

What are they going to do? Just stop turning up. If they harass you call the police.

You don't know where his money has come from, and I think you are unreasonable to expect a pastor to be poorly off financially.

I would have an issue with him saying that no one can be blessed unless they give money to the church. That sounds medieval to me, like when people gave money in exchange for forgiveness of sins.

Find a different church.

!!!

Stop going and report them. Block any contact. It does sound like a cult and needs to be shut down. There are lots of other places you can get support. I’d try to aim for one that isn’t going to target vulnerable people and actually wants to support people. A church might not be the best place for help around relationships etc