Schools asking for parental contributions

I know of an educational establishment that did this, at enrolment. It was only £10 but was 30 years ago.
Helped the institutions enormously.

I went to a Catholic primary school in the 90's in what was a pretty deprived area. We had a 'school fund' of 20p per week. I remember paying it regularly despite not being very well off. I don't think it's as usual as you think.

I have no idea to vote using your ‘IABU or YABU’ but it may just still be too early for me!

We get asked for £15 per child in our infants per year. Happy to pay it as the school publishes what they do with it and it all goes to enrichment activities and things over and above essentials. Seems to be the norm round here (SE London)

It depends how much they are asking for. I seem to remember my sons school asking for a contribution of £1 per week.

@ButamIwhoyouthinkIam your poll makes no sense

IABU: it’s reasonable for schools to ask this and for parents to be happy to pay

YABU: a different option eg lobbying gov or showing the deficit would be more reasonable. Contributing financially allows the funding problem to be hidden

Whichever statement I agree with you are telling me to hit the "YABU" button despite them being opposite. Anyone who hit YANBU didn't read the post properly but you have no idea which direction they are agreeing in.

I agree with the 2nd statement. State funded schools are criminally underfunded. If the naice schools in leafy posh areas get their funding topped up by voluntary contributions from well-heeled parents and the schools in grotty poor areas don't, inequalities widen, the most vulnerable children suffer and there's less political pressure on the government to resolve the problems. If there's a proportion of parents willing to make voluntary contributions like this then what is needed is a general rise in taxation for everyone with an income level that brings them significantly over the point of "just about making ends meet" so that the funds can be distributed to the schools where the need is greatest rather than the schools that wealthier children attend. If the standard tostate education provided by the government is inadequate either campaign to change government policy or opt out and send your children to private school funding the full cost without taking state funding. A state funded system that ends up with affluent children getting a better set of circumstances than disadvantaged children is abhorrent.

We had similar in my son's primary school a few years back, it was in a nice middle class area. When some parents questioned why there was no government funding we were told as it's a school in a nice area the parents are deemed to by wealthy enough to contribute so the school got less funding from the government.

Our local school has reserves of -55k. Yep minus.

I knew it was bad, but seeing it in black and white is quite shocking.

I'm in Scotland. Parent Council was quite active, but we were never asked to pay additional contributions direct to the school

I wonder if this is more an English thing?

It's true that pp can't be used to pay the electricity bill etc. It needs to be used to address the specific challenges faced by pp children. But there may be some interventions paid for by pupil premium which also benefit some or all of the other children. As long as the school can genuinely demonstrate that it is addressing specific needs/areas where the pp children need more support, there is nothing to say that other kids can't benefit as well.

But other schools won't be doing special interventions for PP kids if they don't have any. PP funding has to be spent on things 'above the normal offer'.

Some non PP kids can 'piggyback' onto things but PP can't be used on eg an intervention for a group of 5 non PP kids, nor on utility bills.

I think the point is @TeenToTwenties , other schools will also be running similar interventions, but have to fund it themselves, taking money from another budget.
My DD's primary used to send out reminders to people to check with the LA if they were entitled to PP as many stopped checking with the universal FSM for infants.

You are correct. PP can’t be spent on a new roof.

It’s the same when a child has an EHCP. The funding is a significant lag to need having been identified and will almost certainly not cover the cost of the TA. Parents are often unaware of this.

The council doesn't fund it, though - so they aren't going to suddenly step in to pay the bills. It's an academy. Pretty much all of the schools in my area were practically forced down the academy route a decade or so ago.

You're right that the school won't close. The most likely scenario is that it would be forced to join an academy chain. We have considered going down this route voluntarily, and we keep this under constant review, but we have concluded that it wouldn't be in the best interests of the school to do this - we already have all of the advantages of being part of a chain through existing partnerships with other schools, including shared procurement, shared resources, mutual support for school improvement etc. And we have been carefully monitoring what has happened at a number of other local schools which have joined multi academy trusts in recent years, either voluntarily or because they have been forced to do so. We are clear that, while there may be benefits for some schools to go down this path, it would be very damaging for us to do so. Ultimately, of course, we may have no choice, but there will be an impact and parents will notice it.

As a teacher I’m a bit cynical - there often seems to be money found when it’s of interest to the right people.
Id be more willing as a parent to pay if there was a specific project. As you say ‘ongoing costs’ is vague and unhelpful in making a decision plus the pressure on parents is very difficult especially asking mid year; we do at least cost out parental contributions for trips etc across the year and don’t add to them.

parents not paying wont help change the systemic shortfall though. The govs well aware schools are underfunded and that due to changing numbers the funding will change significantly. There not going to increase it because parents won’t pay

DC primary school did this 10 years ago via direct debit. Nice catchment area. They did a lot with the funds.

Flip side is at the same time I was a governor for 4 years at a deprived primary school who was in a deficit budget. We had to cut teachers and merge classes. We fought tooth and nail for funding due to massive spike in SEN and other particulars of the schools that made it challenging. I wrote letters to our MP, the Minister for Education, Director for Children’s Service - the lot.

If I was a Head I’d ask for it because budgets are so tight parents have no idea, but it does make the disparity between catchment areas that more stark.

Education has been under-funded for years, so if you think it should be funded by govt you’d be right, but wrong to think it actually is.

Those saying it is OK for disadvantaged schools as they get Pupil Premium, I'm not sure that's correct?
Pupil Premium has to be spent on the Pupil Premium kids as things above and beyond the normal offer, for example English and Maths intervention. It can't be used for general resources or paying utility bills.
So they may be 'awash with money' as I think a PP said, but that money is ringfenced.

I remember all the year 7 parents being asked to an introduction meeting at my daughter's Secondary school 20 years ago . They used it purely to put pressure on the parents to sign up for a monthly direct debit to help fund the school . Not saying I agree with it , but surprised it's taken other schools this long to do the same if I'm honest.

My DS1 secondary school is asking for donations specifically due to extra cost for SEN funding. The govt does pay for this but apparantly it's not enough. I don't think any parent who doesn't have a SEN child will contribute- that's the talk among parents atleast. They would have been smarter not to specify SEN because it reduces the parents who feel concerned and it also singles out us SEN parents as we are made aware of what a burden on the system our children are...

I think there's some misunderstanding about school budgets using that calculator. In our local authority (I assume similar elsewhere) we have to budget on a three year rolling budget. It's not allowed to go into debt in any of the years. However, you also have to keep reserves for building upkeep, large refurbishment projects etc. So the school can be almost in debt but have a large reserve because they have to redo the toilet block or whatever.
Some money is ringfenced e.g. a certain budget has to be kept for building upkeep, ultilities etc. Staffing is always the largest cost but there are only so many ways you can keep that down.
Not only have school budgets not increased with inflation, they haven't increased when pay has increased. This involves cuts in other areas. If you consistently underspend in resourcing then you'll end up in a position where you need to replace lots of things at once and can't afford to do so.

I don't disagree that lobbying the government should be done but it woukd be more powerful if parents led the charge as schools are ignored.

One of the primaries DS was at asked for £20 per term and the took out the trips from this. So panto at Christmas, swimming in the summer etc. If there was any left it went to the end of year party.

the next primary asked for everything individually. A couple of quid for the bus fare for the library trip and so on. That was a pita. I preferred the first way, but that was convenient to me. I appreciate others wouldn’t feel the same.

The council won’t let it go under though. As long as the spaces are needed it will be funded. Being in a deficit doesn’t mean the school is going bankrupt in the traditional sense. It’s on paper. The bills still get paid.

Reserve means they’ve underspent in previous years and carried it forward

This is a good idea. I suspect many parents would want to know that their money is going to their child’s class rather than into a general pot. From my involvement with my children’s school I am aware that some parents are asking the school to pay for their child to go on trips when the Head is confident they are plenty able to afford it themselves (e.g. child has had a brand new iPhone confiscated at school) and I would not want to be funding things like this when finding an additional contribution is not easy for me. I’d be much happier buying supplies for my children’s classes to use to enhance their learning.

You can look at school funding/spending here https://financial-benchmarking-and-insights-tool.education.gov.uk/find-organisation
Trusts will also have their annual returns on their website sites.
School funding is tough.
There may be enough to have kids in the classroom.....but there are struggles to fund the additional staff that add value, there are struggles to fund the enrichment activities - especially if parents don't fund it.

Schools and trusts are crying out for governors to support schools. If this interests you there will be opportunities locally.

If you want to campaign you need to write to your MP and tell them your view.

Is this school in the NW by any chance?