Elder daughter father giving rules about my younger kids

I think asking a twelve year old to censor herself to a level, where she can never, ever mention her mum, home or siblings in any context while in conversation with her father would be anxiety inducing.

I don’t know how happy my son would be to share his piano, he’s 17 now, we got him a significant upgrade of a piano when he passed grade 8. He’s teaching my 7 year old nephew on it twice a week with no issues, but honestly I don’t think he’d be happy for young children to have free rein on it without supervision.

I dont believe I swore.

What the hell. Are there honestly people who are this petty-minded ? Glad you aren't with him anymore OP.

Is there an element of older daughter not wanting to share?
Maybe it is special to her that her father bought it for her and she doesn’t want to share it.
Although initially I thought how ridiculous, actually I think it might be fair for her to have sole use of it - it is hers and it’s hard being a child with split parents.

Yep, calling his bluff may work. He doesn’t want yet another piano cluttering up his house … and pretty much no one wants a baby grand or grand.

This with the added layer of being the oldest and it being a nice thing, as well falling behind in her learning due to Ops distraction (op has said this herself) so feeling anxious about practicing etc.

most older siblings don’t want their precious things being used by the younger ones. Let alone when you’re the odd one out in the house.

it’s all to easy to jump to her being mean and selfish or Ex being controlling. When he could just be advocating feeling she has expressed.

If there is another good piano owned by the ex in one of his multiple houses then this really just sounds petty. What damage does he think is going to be done by a younger one playing it for 15 minutes a day?

Realistically grade 5 at 12 she’s not destined for a career as a musician, as I said. There’s a lot of enjoyment to be had from amateur music nonetheless.

From that perspective it doesn’t matter terribly whether she plays a baby grand or a good upright. It’s certainly worth starting the younger one on a proper piano not a keyboard.

But honestly, if you call ex’s bluff and ask him to pick the piano up my betting is that he will back down and then everyone can enjoy it.

I think most people would either respect the wishes of the person that owned the item, or decide not to have it in their house. A piano can be personal property regardless of the size. I said earlier in the thread that my mother had and has her own piano that was/is for her alone - it really wasn’t/isn’t a difficult concept to struggle with.

It would OP could do something different if the situation were different. It isn’t though. OP has said she and her ex chose together to facilitate their joint child having a piano to use at OP’s. She didn’t say that he gave the piano to either or her daughter, or that she was ever under the impression that it was to be used communally.

As far as aims go - well, that depends very much on 1, the blended family, and 2, what is realistic in a specific situation.

If the DD doesn’t want to share, she’s being rather mean, isn’t she?

Thing is, it might be mean.
It could be a response to knowing how things end up if the younger siblings are allowed to use it.
It could be a cry for help that she feels less important than the rest of the family.
It could be that she feels that anything she does her siblings have to do too and just wants one thing she can do - her music - without feeling her feet are being trodden on.

Op is in the best position to find out, and calling her dd mean without knowledge of the situation isn't helpful.

I was called mean for not letting dbro "share" my things. That was because what "share" actually meant was:

1. I either paid for it, or got it as a present (often on that sort of thing more than one present); he was never asked to contribute in any way.
2. He was less careful, and the item would be spoilt; there was never any consequence for him, nor was it ever replaced if totally broken, even on the time he threw it in a temper and smashed it.
3. I would be subjected to comments about how much better he was at using it than me at 3 years younger; even when looking back this wasn't true - and could be measured objectively at the time
4. I would be told that it was "mean" to keep it in my room so he'd have to ask to use it, as it was needed for "both of us" so It would be "suggested" that it was better keeping it downstairs (where his room was) so he didn't have to come upstairs.
5. It would very quickly migrate into his room. If I wanted to use it I'd have to ask Mum to get it, and inevitably the answer would be that he was just about to use it and so I'd have to wait.

So was that mean objecting, or a response to the inevitable happening. I will add that I very rarely bothered objecting; simply gave it up. Any attempts to stop this happening would be met with "oh he just looks up to you so much and wants to do what you do, so it's unfair not to let him".
Many of the things this happened with, I just stopped doing because it wasn't worth trying.

Oh man - I’ve just seen that the piano is a baby grand. Seriously? The ex has installed a baby grand piano in someone else’s house?

If it is locked, how will you tune it?

It’s a bit off topic but if the daughter doesn’t want others to play on her piano then what happens to it when she moves out? Even if it is a brilliant piano, almost no one wants a baby grand - it won’t be worth very much at all if it is sold. And good luck getting a baby grand up the stairs to a second floor flat or house share.

@InterIgnis I don’t think anyone on here would disagree that people can have their own belongings and shouldn’t have to share but that most normal people wouldn’t consider that large , usually one item things should be shared ie pianos , trampolines , swing sets . I’d be interested to know if @Dazedandconfusec would insist the piano was shared if all her children were full siblings and the piano had been given as a gift by a godparent / grandparent . I realise that is hypothetical but surely in blended families where the children all share one parent the aim should be they all get treated equally in the home of the shared parent .

That’s fine. I don’t need you to agree with me. Personally, I think it’s fine to respect other people’s belongings, and their autonomy. I also don’t think that children, particularly girls, should be taught that feeling compelled to say yes when they don’t want to is positive quality or ‘moral value’.

I don’t think a parent has ‘no hope’ of instilling their own values. Of course they do. They cannot however force their child to share those values, or prevent them from being exposed to different ones. Furthermore, a parent coming in with ‘I’m right, you’re wrong, and you’ll do only as I say!’ diktats, especially when it’s something said parent cannot actually enforce, doesn’t teach the lesson you seem to think it will.

Op knows her child. She is the one intimately familiar with the family dynamics, and the one best placed on this thread to judge what the likely outcomes of the suggestions made would be. She’s based her decision on the reality as it is, not the reality that that she, or anyone else, thinks it should be.

I've just realised you posted the first post about age and ability and care, so essentially saying same thing as each other, apologies.

I disagree. It IS mean. Why do you think it isn’t?

And why do you think it’s ‘realistic’ that a parent would have no hope of instilling decent values into their child? Do you just let your kids bimble on uncorrected if you see them going astray? Most parents don’t, they see it as a fundamental part of parenting to guide their kids into being a decent person, instilling values and morals.

Yes, I do play and I have musical siblings, some of whom play professionally.

No, she’s not ‘mean’.

It’s not defeatist, it’s realistic. Trying to force your will onto someone, even when you unequivocally can (and OP cannot), rarely results in them coming around to your way of thinking. The daughter is a person in her own right that has her own perspective and opinions, and they don’t have to be the same as Op’s. Op can influence her, but she cannot force her to think or feel as she may want her to.

Op actually knows the people involved here and what is likely to happen, so I doubt her fears regarding her daughter voting with her feet are unfounded ones. Of course she can ‘flounce’ and choose to spend more time with her father/at her father’s house. At 12 she is not without autonomy, or options she will be very aware of.

Op has said her daughter doesn’t want to share, and she hopes that in a couple of years that she’ll be ‘less precious’ about the piano. Clearly she believes this is not actually driven by her ex, but that her daughter has gone to her father for support.

Well DD can take it with her thats not the issue beibg discussed. OP didn't agree to not allow others to touch it, where was that said?

You dont have to agree with me, we're all allowed our own opinions. My post is no more aggressive than yours, "no"?!

This!!! You can't exactly have 2 pianos in a house... waste of space and expensive.

Irrelevant and no need to be verbally aggressive

Its hers, its her belonging. If she moved out for any reason no doubt it would go with her no?

So its not a shared thing. Its unfortunate its so big but then OP agreed at the time to house it.

If the DD doesn’t want to share, she’s being rather mean, isn’t she?

Trying to force her to share her father’s/her piano won’t make her want to share, or feel anything other than resentment towards her mother and siblings

Why do you think this? I find it quite a defeatist attitude. It sounds like you think it’s a hopeless task to instil some thought and care for her siblings into the elder DD. Why?

People can change at any age, and a child of this age in particular is at a point in time where change can happen relatively quickly and easily. I wouldn’t give her up as a lost cause.

Removing the piano means that her daughter would choose to spend more time with her father/at her father’s house

We don’t know this for sure, it’s a fear of the OP’s. How much justification there is for that fear is unclear (would the daughter really flounce over this?), but what is clear is the OP is being manipulated into a situation that is damaging the family dynamics because she’s being controlled by this fear. Who put that fear there? . Probably the ex, deliberately, with the elder daughter being damaged in the process.

There’s no solution that doesn’t risk damage to the relationships between them all.

This is the nub of it, and this situation is being created by the ex. Most likely very deliberately.

If OP wants to be a decent parent to her kids, she needs to make sure elder DD doesn’t develop into a spoilt brat with a superior attitude to her siblings, and the younger siblings don’t grow up resentful and feeling inferior.

This is crazy. A 12 year old grad 5 pupil does not need a brilliant piano. A decent fb marketplace one for free would do, for the kids to share. My three learn, ages 11-6 though ‘only’ grade 4 for the eldest and the piano we have is fine. It was free secondhand, survived a building project where it was utterly freezing and dripped on.
A ‘good’ piano is going to divide your children.

OP’s husband’s proposed solution was to get another piano, so apparently they do have the space.

Op’s daughter doesn’t want to share the piano, and it seems that she went to her father because he could tell her mother what she couldn’t. Removing the piano means that her daughter would choose to spend more time with her father/at her father’s house, which Op is categorically unwilling to have happen.

Trying to force her to share her father’s/her piano won’t make her want to share, or feel anything other than resentment towards her mother and siblings. There’s no solution that doesn’t risk damage to the relationships between them all. Op’s eldest daughter is the only one of her children that has a wealthy parent, and as such she is always going to have more than her siblings. There’s no getting around that fact.

Anyway, Op already decided to get a keyboard for her younger children and leave the piano alone.

I would be also telling dd that if she insists on things being very much her sole private ownership

That this works both ways.
When she visits her father she doesn’t mention anyone else or anything to do with her life at home. You don’t want yours or your dh or her siblings name mentioned to him. As he didn’t want you to move or have more children it is kinder to him to not mention these things to him.

You need to cut the control by starving him of the oxygen of news about your family.
Equally I would be asking your dd not to post anything about you all on SM.