Have we got nothing better to think about than Greenland??

It's going to affect you and me, but ok.

So this rant is all about you then?

OP fucked off then? There's a shock.

I'd send him the Knob prize. It's close enough, right?

But Vance doesn’t have the charisma or the TV career that Trump did, that lead people to think ‘He told someone they were fired on TV, that’s the kind of decisive leadership we need’. He won’t have the Trump ability to freeze his own party into cowardly immobility.

I don’t really mean to sneer about that impulse, after all his TV career is a big part of why Ukraine elected Zelensky, they’re just a lot luckier with the character and intelligence that went along with it. We like faces we know. But not Vance, not in the same way.

I do think he will pick Erica Kirk as his VP which is a risk of its own.

Donald Trump is fucking up everything. He's old- why can't he just go and play golf or something. And why isn't the American people reacting??

Sadly I think it's a wider issue than just him - it all the white house bunch and if Trump goes is Vance really any better - he said awful things about Europe and seems similarly uniformed about Greenland.

To be fair to the OP, you're just as deluded as they are if you think the NHS is improving.

I haven't but have seen a lot of food item comparsison between US and UK/European products - US is always inferior and often more expensive.

I was more thinking about lower welfare standards and the high rates of food poisoning - each year roughly 1 in 6 Americans (or 48 million people) get sick as a result of foodborne diseases - so that would only add to NHS burden.

There was whole chlorinated chicken drama in Trumps first term where there were concners he'd try and force it on us - and read recently there were issues with new trade agreement aorund us not accepting some US food already.

NHS has issues - but then most aging populations with part insurance part state most of world goes with also have issues - US is just dire if you can't access the top level of care and their rural hospitals are closing at an alarming rate.

We are involved because we are part of NATO. We are also part of Europe albeit in a different way now we are out of the EU. And possibly we may be concerned when some megalomaniac ignores international law, threatens to impose tariffs on his allies and destabilises the world.

Im sure it’s a downer for you Nigel, but when you Orange Baby Friend behaves like a massive buffoon, you have to expect people to be at least a little bit upset…

"Let Europe work it out"?? What can you mean? As many have said, we are in Europe. And in NATO, which is as a whole obliged by treaty to oppose incursions into the territory of any member. That would include us in those who have to "work it out" therefore.

You are a part of Europe. Your ignorance is staggerimg.

It will though. If Europe does what Canada has done eg gone to China for trade deal as the US is "not a reliable partner" for the moment then US will feel it economically and also in terms of power.

These are crazy times. We basically got 3 giants (US, China and Russia) wanting to increase their territory. China- Taïwan and then.. Russia- Ukraine and now US(Trump)- Greenland- (Canada, Cuba etc)..

Donald Trump is fucking up everything. He's old- why can't he just go and play golf or something. And why isn't the American people reacting??

The UK is in Europe. We - like many other European countries - are not in the European Union, but we are still in Europe.

You cannot seriously be so ignorant of world affairs that you think an invasion of Greenland by the United States would only affect Denmark. Do you genuinely, honestly have no concept of the impact and implications of a nation like the USA simply taking over large chunks of the world through force, and what the breakup of NATO would mean?

You are being unreasonable and incredibly stupid.
The implications of Greenland and it's Trump problem are immense and global and they will affect the UK if things go bad. We can't just sit by and 'let Europe sort it out'.
You know we left the EU not the continent of Europe. We're still in the same geographical position as before. The threat to Europe in this case includes us.
Besides, today Greenland, tomorrow who knows? Global stability is literally at stake here.

I notice OP has retreated - mission accomplished in the click bait stakes ( which I acknowledge I'm cobtributing to in commenting, but the popcorn worthiness was too good to miss).

Or they're ordering a wheelbarrow big enough for the arse that's thankfully been robustly handed to them.

BTW latest updates from some quarters are that negotiations will continue at Davos at the annual WEF beanfeast. Now THAT bothers me even more..... greasy corporate palms meddling in defence strategy. Brilliant.

Well, I have. 🙄

I think the really scary thing about the US is that the people controlling him behind the scenes are as bad if not worse.

Does anyone think that he will be stopped? Like I'd prefer a big dramatic show down that leaves him under NO illusion that he has to quit now, but behind the scenes do you think it might just be a case of 'Donnie, say something tomorrow - pretend you've lost interest. We will give you this little Lego model of Greenland if it makes you feel better'...

No, NATO won't declare war on the USA. If the USA takes Greenland, it'll spell the end of NATO and then the world will get infinitely more dangerous for everyone.

Women are famously known for multitasking, so we can think of a few things at once.

To be fair (ok, generous) to OP, simple answers can look appealing if you don't have a very good level of exposure to...wider issues

I mean, the OPs post is the sort of thing I hear my parents say to their friends and everyone nods vigorously. Absolutely, we should sort out the NHS before Greenland! No brainer!

And the unappealing response to that is, actually, it's more complicated than that... history, NATO, economics blah blah - no-one wants to listen and they've already moved on discussing how illegal immigrants get free council houses and an iPhone.

I'm afraid I don't know what the answer is, and it's bloody depressing.

If America invades Greenland, we are obliged to defend it under the terms of NATO.

This can only lead to two things:

1. We declare war on America. Tricksy, for the reasons you observe.

1. We do fuck all and let America take it. Allowing the likes of Russia to see NATO as toothless, and opening the door for hostile expansion along the eastern border of Europe.

All roads lead to war.

Hard agree. The NHS has looked after me and my family so so well over the last few years. I am so sick of voices seeking to talk this country down - no, life here right now isn't perfect. Yes, services could be improved. But we are so lucky to live here. Especially right now, given what is going on in America.

We are lucky to live here. I love this country.

Which is why it's so important to make sure that Greenland maintains its independence. If the OP can't see why America's stated intention to 'own' the Western Hemisphere and his actions in Greenland directly affect us, they need to think a LOT harder before gobbing off online.

Oh please.

NATO is not going to declare war on the USA.

Whatever else happens that will not happen and it's just hyperbolic to say it will.

For one thing European governments know they can't win. We can't even effectively defend Ukraine against Russia, which doesn't have the firepower of the USA.

For another nobody wants to go to war with the USA.

Can't believe Mumsnet sometimes.