Decision taken from me about dangerous driving

I’d feel the same as you. We once dropped my dd at so eone’s house for 4 of them to be taken to cinema, only a sibling went too and the party girl was laid down in the boot (estate car so not “closed”) - I was livid! But as we only knew after (we could have taken dd straight to cinema) the only way we could deal with it was to make sure there was never a plan for dd to be in their car again.

I don’t know what you mean by cavalierly. Having an extra person in the back of the car bears no relation to the extremity of that crash.

you might be theoretically insulted but I know your friends parents are incredible grateful I was there.

Happened to a girl here, went through the windscreen although the driver was drunk, and young - no excuses obviously, but it was life changing.

I knew one of the people killed in that accident. While it was extreme, it is the same thinking that is in the op’s scenario of seat belts and overloaded cars both being fine. Until they’re not and there is a horrific accident.

I’m surprised you treat it so cavalierly and find that very insulting to the memory of my friend.

I mean I used to love sitting the boot of a Volvo with their cute little “seats” in the 80s but time has moved on and it’s not generally considered ok any more.

seatbelts are now expected and common and used.

If someone offered my child a lift i would presume they had enough seats! Its tough when they get to this age as you don't necessarily know the friends families... or what cars they have!

Never trust that family again really. And make sure your DD hasca way of contacting you if she feels unsafe

sorry was so taken a back by those comments I forgot to say of course YANBU OP and obviously make sure your daughter never travels with them again

You’re not wrong but I think people will have different attitudes to this because it used to be so normal 20-30 years ago when we were kids and some people will carry that over with the ‘we were fine’ type attitude. The lesson I’d take from this is that DD needs to have a phone so she can call you if ever put in a position like this again.

I was actually involved in that (as a worker not a passenger) and it bears incredibly little relation to the scenario the OP describes, insultingly so tbh.

The thing is she is 12 and will be going out more and will not alway be under your protection, there will come a time v soon when you are not organising her social life

also this is a situation where a phone would have swiftly solved the problem

YANBU. Even if the person driving is the best there can be, remember that at least 25% of those with a licence are unfit to hold one and could have crashed into the car.

Yes. It was twenty years ago and still haunts me though I didn't know anyone involved. It was also for a birthday party and several children died, others were seriously injured. Absolutely horrific, and another driver was killed when the car with the children rolled over the central reservation.

Agree my level of angry would definitely depend on the road conditions and level of risk taken, but I’d still not be happy

Does DD's friend's mum's friend have DC? I am thinking that we used to do this in the back in the 90s with friends and nobody ever seemed to think anything of it at all. Either kids on adults' laps or 4 of us across the back seat - my mum used to drive round the roundabout on our housing estate multiple times and we'd all squeal in delight as the leftmost person seemed to lift up in the air If she doesn't have her own DC I can see someone thinking back to this and not realising social norms have moved on.

I would not dream of doing it today and would be really shocked to hear of anyone doing it for more than something like an unexpected lift around the corner in torrential rain.

Sharing a seatbelt renders it useless at best and can cause life threatening injuries to the lighter person at worst. Not everyone is aware of this but I wouldn't hesitate to share it if someone was suggesting doing it. It's safer to have no seatbelt at all than to share one, which is the opposite to what people tend to assume.

If you know your friend has form for doing this, why on earth would you trust her to drive your DD?

I do think it depends how far and on what kind of roads, if it was a mile away on quiet 20mph roads, then I don't think it's a huge deal, but if it was dual carriageway or motorway then it's awful.

I think An adult parent drove the car that had someone’s child loose in the back ( I presume on another child’s lap)

I wold not be happy and make note of who did what for future reference but it probably not say anything unless directly asked for my opinion,

I’d also focus more on empowering my child to be able to stand up for herself next time and make it clear to her what you want her to do next time , ie if your daughter is shy maybe a code word she can text you or say down the phone so you know to come get her ( obviously she would need a phone when going out in future )

upsetting but I’d be grateful nothing happened and focus on what needs to happen next time

When I was young it was a treat to be allowed to sit in the boot (hatchback) and not even sure if seatbelts were a thing in the back seats. Doesn't change that it's wrong but that may be why some people see it as 'meh'.