What is the Mumsnet consensus on P&C spaces?

This thread is making me feel very old as parent and child parking spaces really weren't a thing (I think maybe they existed in a few places but certainly weren't at all common) when my kids were babies (now adults) and we managed just fine. The difference I think is cars are so, so much bigger and wider now, massive SUVs are the norm for most people particularly for transporting kids, and it's normal to drive everywhere, but car parks have exactly the same number of spaces and same width as 20 or 40 years ago. When mine were little we didn't have a car at all for a lot of the time, and then we had a tiny 3 door hatchback - we walked to every day shops, and if/when we drove further afield I honestly don't ever remember struggling with car seats or getting kids in and out of the car in normal car park spaces - car seats definitely were also much smaller back then and people were less strict e.g. about holding the baby in your lap while you drove off which I know today would be an absolute no. If I'd really needed to I also would have felt fine about giving the baby to a passing stranger to hold/keep an eye on in their pram while I manoeuvred the car in/out of a tight space, again I don't think you'd do that today.

I do completely agree that people shouldn't use them if they don't have kids with them, but I do also think they need to be treated as a a nice to have as there's never enough of them to guarantee every parent can get one. So if you have a big wide car and a huge bulky car seat that you truly cannot get the baby into/out of in a normal space, and no other means of carrying the baby e.g. pram, sling, someone else to hold, you probably need to be prepared to not drive to the shops alone, or not at busy times anyway?

Indeed.

I wonder if the P&C spaces should be a bit further away from the shop so they aren't seen as premium spaces. It's an offence to park in disabled spaces but there is no sanction for pillocks. Parents with disabled children will have blue badges and can use the disabled spaces, other parents could just walk a bit further.

I’m not disabled enough for a blue badge, but I am mobility impaired. On a bad day, if I can’t park near the supermarket entrance then I can’t use the supermarket. And all the spaces near the entrance are either blue badge (which I legally cannot use) or P&C. So yes, I sometimes park in a P&C space in a bad day. Do I have less right to be able to access the store than someone who chose to have children?

Ours was fully lie flat, it's a shame they are rare they're extremely safe and better for the baby's breathing.

Well if you own a big SUV you genuinely need extra space so…

Honestly Tesco couldn't care less. I don’t know why you’re determined to know what they’d do. Nothing.

Oh. I thought I was entitled to park there!

It definitely doesn’t say your children HAVE to be young or even with you. Mine are young adults but meh - I’ve still got ‘em

That depends on the car seat.

Lie flat car seats are still really quite rare, plus many lie flat seats are still subject to the two hour recommendation as they are not truly flat in the same way as a carrycot or crib.

The irony is, I was TOLD by Tesco customer services to park in the P&C space until I got my BB when their security man saw me struggling.

Either make all spaces bigger or move the P&C spaces away from the front entrance. You got a child not a disability. You can walk an extra 20m. Problem solved.

There are no fines for P&C spaces as they are not a legal requirement, unlike BB spaces.

Some supermarkets will send out invoice fines, and the enforcement of them in the UK will very much depend on which part you were in.

Generally shops don't care who parks in the P&C spaces as they are a marketing gimmick designed to tempt people into their shop. As long as the person parked in the space is spending money they have done their job.

If you want the overwhelming consensus on MN go read any of all of the million other threads on this rather than starting your own. You know what you are doing.

I’m entitled to a reasonable adjustment on the grounds of my disability regardless of whether or not I have a BB. That would be an interesting court case and I would love to take it.

I dont know why you are being snippy. You expected there to be an exemption for you. You asked how parking enforcement would handle you parking in a p&c space, with no blue badge and no children...
My answer was they'd deal with you as if you were a person parking in bay with no right to do so - because you were.
That's not to say you didn't need to, but from an enforcement point of you it is black and white.

But what difference does your situation make really? A stranger challenges you or doesn’t. You respond accordingly. You haven’t really made a point because you have a reason to be there.

can you really not see why a busybody wouldn’t question someone in a p&C space with no children? Some people live for this opportunity to be righteous

I have a BB NOW.

Can you understand that I said “whilst I was waiting for my BB”.

I have. One. Now.

but no one said there would be an exemption for BB holders.

It’s more likely to be a “why are you staring at me you strange person” look.
Surely the thing with hidden disabilities is that they are hidden so no, you don’t know that someone is able to walk from further away.
its a parking space, get over it.

I makes no odds to me either way on who parks where, disabled bays are a nessacity p&c are not so as long as people aren't using the disabled spots when they shouldn't im not fussed.

As someone whos kids are grown up I dont need to use them. When I was shopping over xmas there were only p&c spaces available and I did see people using them without kids but suppose they didn't have a choice as it was the only spaces available.

Parking spaces have been the same size for years and were absolutely fine, in the last decade the average size of cars has increased massively, should car parks have to redraw their lines every 5 years because people keep buying cars that are too big for them to park?

A marketing gimmick.

I used them when I broke my foot and needed the extra space.

People feel pretty vile and selfish in general at the moment and I feel like using P&C spots if you don’t need them is a good example of this. But people who clearly do it will come on here and kick off about ‘why shouldn’t they do what they want’. It always gets nasty you could probably read back over them for all the different views.

Presumably if you parked in one with a blue badge you'd be exempt from the fine.
But if you parked in one without a blue badge you'd get a fine the same as if you parked in a disabled bay without a BB.
There isn't a 'I'm waiting for my blue badge' exemption from displaying a blue badge in a disabled bay so far as I'm aware (BB holder here) so why should it be any different for any other space?

How would they police me as a lone person parking on one as a result of my disability whilst I was waiting for my BB?

I had to park on one yesterday as there wasn’t a BB space.

Of course p&c spaces should be left for those who that really need them. Same as disabled spaces should be left for those with a blue badge.
Anyone who says otherwise is justifying their selfishness.
But it's not worth getting worked up over. There are an increasing number of self centered people around these days. They don't lose sleep over others thinking they are unpleasant people so you'll only wind yourself up by getting frustrated.
Do the right thing yourself as much as you can and let them show themselves up.