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AIBU?

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to think no one can define living as a woman

306 replies

funtimess · 27/12/2025 15:34

if you are a biological man.

Or indeed define living as a man if they are a biological woman.

What is the definition, how do you define a person ‘living" as the opposite sex?

AIBU to think that nobody is going to be able to define this unless they resort to regressive stereotypes.

YABU - I can define this for you without using regressive stereotypes.
YANBU - You are right, you can’t define this without using regressive stereotypes.

OP posts:
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15
BoxesBoxesEverywhere · 28/12/2025 16:02

Firstly, all women know by instinct it's not safe for us to go walking alone late at night

The post I was referring to was saying it's not safe for women to walk down a road by themselves.
Nothing about at night. Just not safe to be walking down a road.
Also - should women stay at home or only be allowed out with a chaperone? As one logical conclusion to your way of thinking is to "keep women safe by reducing them to victims and unable to be out by themselves.
Which is far more harmful to women's rights than trans people.

ProudCat · 28/12/2025 16:01

Helleofabore · 28/12/2025 11:12

And yet, why would you add to someone’s trauma and distress by having accommodation or support groups where male people are being included and the female people there are being told that those male people are women?

We are fully aware that most sex offences are committed by someone they know. This doesn’t change the fact that female people need single sex provisions and that not one male above about 8 years old should be included.

It also doesn’t change the reports from women in supposedly female single sex shelters where male people being allowed in have caused them harm including sex abuse within that shelter.

This is a hypothesis, not a fact. You don't speak for all women. In the same way that just because Donald Trump says something a million times, it doesn't mean that it's the truth.

Talking of which, some men are vile, I accept this, but that doesn't mean every trans woman is a danger. You can't go from the particular to the universal, otherwise you're back in Trump land.

ThatBlackCat · 28/12/2025 15:59

ProudCat · 28/12/2025 15:56

You're wrong. You've started this thread and you literally don't know what you're talking about. This really exemplifies the type of people pushing the anti-trans rhetoric.

Rape is about consent and penetration can be with anything.

You claim to be representing women and safety and you don't understand the basics.

Rape is legally defined as sexual penetration with a PENIS without consent.

What you are describing, is sexual assault ie penetration with an object.

But RAPE is a crime that entails a P.E.N.I.S.

You, are the one that is wrong. And that is what those like yourself with an anti-women rhetoric get wrong.

Talkinpeace · 28/12/2025 15:58

ProudCat · 28/12/2025 15:56

You're wrong. You've started this thread and you literally don't know what you're talking about. This really exemplifies the type of people pushing the anti-trans rhetoric.

Rape is about consent and penetration can be with anything.

You claim to be representing women and safety and you don't understand the basics.

Not in UK Law
and this is a UK site

ProudCat · 28/12/2025 15:56

funtimess · 28/12/2025 11:09

Women can't rape, what on earth are you talking about.

You're wrong. You've started this thread and you literally don't know what you're talking about. This really exemplifies the type of people pushing the anti-trans rhetoric.

Rape is about consent and penetration can be with anything.

You claim to be representing women and safety and you don't understand the basics.

ThatBlackCat · 28/12/2025 15:43

BoxesBoxesEverywhere · 28/12/2025 14:53

Yes, I agree women would be more impacted by the issues you mention.
I definitely don't agree with people on here saying "until you've experienced" or making out we all have those experiences. We don't.
It's always reducing women to their bodily functions or to victims (too scared to go out by ourselves/,it's not safe etc) on here. Which is so far from feminism to me, and imo much more harmful to women's rights than trans people ever will be.

Firstly, all women know by instinct it's not safe for us to go walking alone late at night. We know that by instinct. Secondly, you don't get it. It's not about 'trans people'. It's about MALES. MALE vs FEMALE. And women may not be defined by our bodily functions, but we are oppressed by them, and our sex-based rights are based on them. Denying that the female sex is the oppressed sex is more harmful to womens rights than anything else. You are denying reality here, because you think women are not vulnerable, to be a 'cool girl'. It's just not reality. Women are the vulnerable and oppressed sex. Males are the predator and oppressor sex. That doesn't change if you put some feathers on the fox and stick it in the hen house.

Helleofabore · 28/12/2025 15:11

Helleofabore · 28/12/2025 15:00

“It's always reducing women to their bodily functions”

Female bodies are the only shared aspect of being female that all female people experience.

What part of female sex based oppression does not start because of them having a female body?

“Which is so far from feminism to me”

Just adding, what kind of feminism is not based on liberating female people from oppression? Particularly oppression based on them having a female body?

ARunByFruiting · 28/12/2025 15:03

KimberleyClark · 28/12/2025 11:16

So these things are only gender stereotypes if worn by men?

Yes because they think that's all they have to do to be a woman, forgetting the fact that women are born completely biologically different.

Helleofabore · 28/12/2025 15:00

BoxesBoxesEverywhere · 28/12/2025 14:53

Yes, I agree women would be more impacted by the issues you mention.
I definitely don't agree with people on here saying "until you've experienced" or making out we all have those experiences. We don't.
It's always reducing women to their bodily functions or to victims (too scared to go out by ourselves/,it's not safe etc) on here. Which is so far from feminism to me, and imo much more harmful to women's rights than trans people ever will be.

“It's always reducing women to their bodily functions”

Female bodies are the only shared aspect of being female that all female people experience.

What part of female sex based oppression does not start because of them having a female body?

OriginalUsername2 · 28/12/2025 14:59

I think the difference is the expectations put upon you. Women are generally expected to be kind and nurturing, be okay with looking after other people’s children, etc. We’re expected to behave ourselves. Men are expected to be strong and provide. They get away with being blunt more than women, not remembering to buy Christmas presents. Things like that.

Helleofabore · 28/12/2025 14:56

BoxesBoxesEverywhere · 28/12/2025 14:37

No, childbirth and periods for example doesn't cover all women.
Neither does being too scared to walk down a road by ourselves.

“childbirth and periods for example doesn't cover all women.”

The ‘potential’ for childbirth and periods do cover ALL female people though. They are uniquely in the position where they have the body that was born with the potential to have childbirth and periods unless a medical condition, injury or medical choices prevents periods and / or pregnancy.

No male people have this potential.

BoxesBoxesEverywhere · 28/12/2025 14:53

AccidentallyWesAnderson · 28/12/2025 14:47

What sex do you think would be mainly (mainly being the word here) affected by the two issues you’ve mentioned? Go on, have a wild stab..

Yes, I agree women would be more impacted by the issues you mention.
I definitely don't agree with people on here saying "until you've experienced" or making out we all have those experiences. We don't.
It's always reducing women to their bodily functions or to victims (too scared to go out by ourselves/,it's not safe etc) on here. Which is so far from feminism to me, and imo much more harmful to women's rights than trans people ever will be.

AccidentallyWesAnderson · 28/12/2025 14:47

BoxesBoxesEverywhere · 28/12/2025 14:37

No, childbirth and periods for example doesn't cover all women.
Neither does being too scared to walk down a road by ourselves.

What sex do you think would be mainly (mainly being the word here) affected by the two issues you’ve mentioned? Go on, have a wild stab..

BoxesBoxesEverywhere · 28/12/2025 14:37

ThatBlackCat · 28/12/2025 14:19

A Scottish study show that 97% of women and girls have experienced sexual harassment. Add on periods, childbirth, and all the rest of it, I would say those would cover all if not 99.999999999999999999999999999999999999999999% of females.

No, childbirth and periods for example doesn't cover all women.
Neither does being too scared to walk down a road by ourselves.

Helleofabore · 28/12/2025 14:30

Whether or not a female person experienced menstruation during their life, they are the people who have the body formed for the production of ova regardless of whether that body does or does not produce those large gametes.

Even the fact that a female person doesn’t produce gametes is part of the female experience. Because no male people need to have their bodies investigated or treated for lack of menstruation, no male people menstruate. Only female people - ever.

Hence the only way to ‘live as a woman’ is to be born a female person with a body formed around the production of large gametes regardless of whether they will ever produce those gametes or not.

There are also no way a male person can live ‘more’ like a female person and ‘less’ like a male person. There is no way this works. They will always be ‘living’ as just another way for a male person to live.

Tomselleckhaskindeyes · 28/12/2025 14:30

I know not everywoman have/will experience all of that list but every woman will have experienced something on the list.

Talkinpeace · 28/12/2025 14:28

The whole Gender mess is centred in rich western countries
where people have too little real stuff to worry about.

Transing kids is an upper middle class thang
(they want to rebel and long hair / drugs / being gay no longer does it)

AGPs are a western fetish

Affirming trans identitities is as daft as
affirming anorexia
(who else remembers the "Pro-Ana" panic 15 years ago)

Soontobe60 · 28/12/2025 14:23

SoftBalletShoes · 27/12/2025 19:50

If you are a man who wears dresses and heels and makeup etc then you are living more like a stereotypical woman than if you dress and present like a man. Isn’t that really obvious?

Some women choosing not to present as stereotypically feminine doesn’t change that or have anything to do with it.

Edited

A man can never live ‘more like a woman’ because he will never be a woman. There isn’t such a thing as degrees of womanhood. It’s not a sliding scale - that’s like saying the ‘genderbread’ scale from Barbie to GI Joe shows how much someone lives ‘like a woman’.
Here’s a lesson plan from an online website ‘The Safe Zone’ that produce LGBTQ “educational” resources. Have a look, it’s hilariously dangerous to think our children have been taught such utter nonsense in our schools.
https://thesafezoneproject.com/activities/genderbread-person/

ThatBlackCat · 28/12/2025 14:19

BoxesBoxesEverywhere · 28/12/2025 14:09

That's a list of things that aren't every woman's experience though.
So saying "until you've experienced these" is 🙄

A Scottish study show that 97% of women and girls have experienced sexual harassment. Add on periods, childbirth, and all the rest of it, I would say those would cover all if not 99.999999999999999999999999999999999999999999% of females.

Soontobe60 · 28/12/2025 14:13

BoxesBoxesEverywhere · 28/12/2025 14:09

That's a list of things that aren't every woman's experience though.
So saying "until you've experienced these" is 🙄

It’s Christmas - have a day off 🙄

BoxesBoxesEverywhere · 28/12/2025 14:09

Tomselleckhaskindeyes · 28/12/2025 14:05

Until you've had periods, are at risk of being and getting pregnant, being afraid of walking down a road by yourself, being leered at by older men, being touched inappropriately, dealing with childbirth, going through the menopause, having and dealing with endometriosis, breast feeding your child, being raped and sexual assault, domestic violence or all female experiences of that a man will probably never experience "living as a woman." So yes it's reductive stereotypes.

That's a list of things that aren't every woman's experience though.
So saying "until you've experienced these" is 🙄

Tomselleckhaskindeyes · 28/12/2025 14:05

Until you've had periods, are at risk of being and getting pregnant, being afraid of walking down a road by yourself, being leered at by older men, being touched inappropriately, dealing with childbirth, going through the menopause, having and dealing with endometriosis, breast feeding your child, being raped and sexual assault, domestic violence or all female experiences of that a man will probably never experience "living as a woman." So yes it's reductive stereotypes.

Helleofabore · 28/12/2025 14:03

ThatBlackCat · 28/12/2025 13:51

As you're a doctor, you should know both that male vocal cords are different from females, and that the male skeletal structure is different from females. Hence the 'tells'. You would also know that it has been shown in university studies that women (and young children) can identify a male in 96% of cases.

It's really, really not difficult to tell a male body from a female body. It really isn't. And nobody had any real problems for centuries/millennia that civilisation as reproduced and flourished. Seemingly until the last 10-15 years. Maybe as a doctor you could explain why we can't suddenly 'know' something we've known for multi millennia. (and sans medical tests).

Edited to add that that is if you are a medical doctor, you don't say, but perhaps I presumed wrongly.

Edited

Iirc there was a study that showed if people are shown faces without skin tone and hair that people were very successful in correctly identifying the sex of the faces they were shown. Based on bone structure under skin.

ThatBlackCat · 28/12/2025 13:58

SoftBalletShoes · 28/12/2025 06:56

OK, so forgetting about the NHS requirement, I did write a post about what it means to me to live as a woman. I said that there are some commonalities to women's lives that make it quite easy to define. Stuff like periods, sexual harassment, etc. This is not to say that this is the sum total of every woman's life, of course not. Individual women live billions of lives which are all different from each other. But those are two things that I would say almost all the women on the planet have experienced at some point in their lives, plus there were other things in my post.

Does the NHS specifically require a man to actually wear dresses and skirts, in order to qualify?

ThatBlackCat · 28/12/2025 13:51

Clonakilla · 28/12/2025 06:09

I’m a doctor - I don’t use my title outside of work but even if I did, my drivers licence and other documents record that my name is one of the most common girls names in the western world. I have multiple pieces
of ID that refer to me as female. I can certainly see how someone could make a case that I ‘live as a woman’ in that this is how I present myself to the outside world - not by wearing a dress, but by the name I use, the documents I carry, the titles I choose from etc.

It interests me when people say there’s no such thing as presenting as female but in the same breath say they can ‘always tell’ if someone is trans. The thread about a trans actor in which the OP refers to a trans actors ‘booming voice’ as a giveaway was very interesting as it bought into some very misogynistic tropes about how women speak - women with loud or deep voices are often criticised for them.

I’m gender critical and consider gender
to be a social construct that damages both men and women. I have no problems understanding biological sex. But I do find some of these arguments disingenuous or blatantly misogynistic. There’s no need to resort to that sort of wilful obtuseness to discuss this - there are plenty of clear, logical points to be made.

As you're a doctor, you should know both that male vocal cords are different from females, and that the male skeletal structure is different from females. Hence the 'tells'. You would also know that it has been shown in university studies that women (and young children) can identify a male in 96% of cases.

It's really, really not difficult to tell a male body from a female body. It really isn't. And nobody had any real problems for centuries/millennia that civilisation as reproduced and flourished. Seemingly until the last 10-15 years. Maybe as a doctor you could explain why we can't suddenly 'know' something we've known for multi millennia. (and sans medical tests).

Edited to add that that is if you are a medical doctor, you don't say, but perhaps I presumed wrongly.