Gone too far this evening - advice please

How many of us who were married to/in relationships with addicts felt like we "owed it" to our partners/spouses/family members to do our best to help them recover? I know I felt that way too - you know, I (and countless others in my position) took our wedding vows/commitments seriously. And how many of us stayed way too damned long, trying every possible thing to help our partners/spouses to recover, putting that before everything else? How long do you think we should have stayed? In my case it was just under 7yrs: I know others who stayed longer, doing all they could. Hindsight is an amazing thing, and I should have got out years before I did.

Did I not stay long enough? Did I not do enough? I spent a five figure amount of money to put my ex through private residential rehab, not to mention the cost of countless appointments for counsellors, psychologists etc. He gaslit me, he lied consistently. He blamed me for being boring, or not being supportive enough. He'd go to AA meetings, but then walk out and head to the pub (DC were small then, so I couldn't wait outside the AA place). He then figured that he could drink, but use cocaine to mask being so drunk (I'd smell the alcohol on him, but he appeared sober - I found out about the Class A's right at the end). My career was stalled during that time, as I didn't have the strength to go for extra training/promotions etc whilst dealing with an alcoholic husband, parenting 2DC and being the breadwinner. My MH was shot, and my physical health was starting to deteriorate. I couldn't plan a damned thing as I never knew how he'd be from one day to the next. His antics put my own job at risk - I'd be at work and he'd go awol so I'd have to run and get the DC from school/childcare...or I'd wake in the morning to get ready for work and he'd be gone (so I'd have to scramble about trying to find someone to have the kids so I could be on the ward for a 7am start). Even now, I start to shake when I smell vodka or whiskey on someone's breath. Are you suggesting that I - and others like me - didn't do our best, or have somehow failed?

When I met XH, I fell in love with him, and when I married him, he didn't have these problems. He was an amazing guy (still is, when he is sober). But when he became an alcoholic/addict, there was nothing I could do to help him (despite me being an HCP of over 25yrs, I kidded myself that I could help him). He had to be the one who helped himself. Part of me is still in love with the guy that I met all those years ago, but I couldn't stay with him, nor could I put myself or my DC through what he was doing to us (oh and I did my utmost to try and shield them from XH's drunkeness). So I had to reaffirm boundaries, stick to them and get the hell out.

If helping an alcoholic partner/spouse/family member was akin to helping someone who has a serious physical illness (and believe me, as a nurse looking after some of the most acutely ill patients outside of an ITU, I do NOT say that lightly), then my XH would have been sober and clean bloody years ago, and we would still be married.

OP, the advice I have for you? Look after yourself and the children. Put yourself and the DC first. Don't set yourself on fire to keep someone else warm. You can't change his behaviour or have control over his drinking (ultimatums rarely work, and you have to stick to them), but you can put in boundaries and ensure you get support for yourself and your children. The only person who can address the drinking is him - it's hard work and he has to want to do it for himself (and that involves taking a long hard look at himself and acknowledging the problems). Make plans (plan A, B, C etc), and get yourself to the point where if a boundary you have is crossed, you can act. Also, remember that there is no shame in having boundaries and not wanting to put up with this sort of behaviour. Read some of the threads on here: it was a post from years ago (Pointythings post) that I followed on here that helped open my eyes, and helped me to realise that I had to get out, that it wasn't my shame to carry, and that I wasn't a failure for saying, "enough is enough".

The alcohol is likely to be the root cause of his depression in the first place and there are no excuses for his heavy drinking. You can't make him seek help or get better, he has to do this on his own and without prompting/ultimatums. All you can do here is protect yourself and your children from his mood swings. And that means living separately. Love isn't enough here.

I have been a long time lurker and I have never commented/posted, but your situation OP stuck a cord especially as I think I have a slightly different view which most people won’t understand if it’s not their lived experience.

You mention you have two children, one whom is SEN, you’ve not mentioned their ages or the impact this has on your lives, but I suspect this potentially could be more profound than you’ve written or maybe you’ve realised (apologies if I am making assumptions here).

Men don’t always handle the emotional strain/stress as well as women when it comes to SEN and all the associated extra life admin and they can resent the loss of a perceived normal life, which can lead to using drink/drugs etc as a crutch to escape. Having an SEN child changes us and we are not the fun person they originally knew, how can we be our worlds are suddenly upside down.

Mine, through the toughest of years was the gym (obviously a less destructive option) and I can honestly say that it was my lifeline, a little bit of escapism, me time and somewhere to workout my frustrations and be me, not mum, not mother, not wife, not lover, just me…

Apologies again if I have made too many assumptions reading between the lines, but surviving a broken support system with SEN kids and then add in the kids, pushes the strongest of marriages/partnerships to its limits.

I really wish you both the strength to work this out together or apart 💐

He clearly has a drinking problem which he seems to have vaguely acknowledged. If he isn’t willing to get help for it, there’s little you can do. You can take a horse to water… He’s using it to cope but it isn’t exactly turning him into a nicer character to be around. Some drunks are affable, others turn nasty and he sounds like the latter.

I’d explain the full effects it’s having on you and your family when he’s sober and insist he contacts an AA support group ASAP. Not sure ultimatums will work but you may be left in a situation eventually where he chooses you or the drink.

Even though you are upset today, it’s actually good it got to this stage as it was rumbling on and now it’s out in the open. He has a drink problem and you are not living like that any more. he has to stop or he has to go.

The very best to you I hope you and your children have a happy life whatever happens next xx

Alcoholism is a serious addiction but it's also a spectrum - there are many high functioning alcoholics who never abuse their family.

One of my brothers was an alcoholic. He was the kindest man you'd ever encounter. He was never aggressive or abusive - when he was drunk he cried, telling us all how awful he was. He worked all his life, attended school meets with teachers, and his children, and all of us adored him. But his children still bear the scars of seeing his father being completely incoherent and paraplegic when we picked him up from a bar, and even if they adored him, they never forgot the shame.

He quit drinking when he was told his liver function was at 25% and he'd be dead in 2 years if he didn't quit. He did it cold turkey with the help of medication because he wanted to live.

Alcoholism doesn't affect everyone in the same way but it's a serious addiction with serious impact on the family and children even without abuse.

Apologies for getting off tangent with the OP issues, but alcohol addition is way underreported as a problem. Mostly is because alcoholic abuse with their families is well represented in the press, but there is a much more insidious problem without abuse that goes underrepresented with still devastating consequences for families, specially small children.

Re this specific situation, was there a reason you had to leave together? Personally i think its ok for one person to leave and one to stay later - i am a night owl and love partying until the wee small hours but would have no issue with a partner leaving early if they were tired.

In the wider context though what you describe is an alcoholic, if he isnt willing to get help or try to change then its ok to set your own boundaries and leave if thats the right thing, but thats a conversation to have sober - you cannot rationalise with a drunk person.

It needs to be ultimatum time. He chooses between family life or alcohol as it cannot be both.

And he absolutely needs counselling.

It's not surprising you've had enough. How dare he say you are boring! It's called life changes and the responsibility of being a parent and having fun in different ways.

If he wants to live his life getting wasted like a single bloke does then he can leave.

Also be aware that although some posters rightly said that you may be in for a rough time in the near future, you equally might get Mr So Sorry Sweet Kind Love Bombing Just Like The Old Days I Won't Do It Again husband. That is a facade and it wont last. My brother does this when he wants something or has completely blown it with everyone. It works because underneath it all there's a germ of a really likeable guy and it preys on the hope that things have changed and the future will be happier.

No no no. Alcoholism is an illness, yes. But alcoholism also destroys families. Alcoholics are selfish and cannot prioritise the needs of the loved ones over drink. Living with a parent like this is deeply traumatic. The OP’s number one priority is her children.

There is no way to “help” or “support” an alcoholic. They are in the grip of something much bigger than themselves and they are the only ones who can change it. “Supporting” an alcoholic is basically enabling it: saying its OK to carry on.

OP I’m sorry to be blunt but you have to separate for the sake of your children. You have to protect them from this.

Its possible that when your OH realises what he is going to lose he will take control and get some help but you can’t count on that. Most alcoholics don’t recover.

I am sorry but you and your children come first.

Does he look in on the kids when he comes back from drinking? I guarantee they are already aware or will be very soon. My DF was like your DP. It definitely messed me up in my teen years. I’d pretend to be asleep.

While his wife is "helping" him to recover he doesn't seen to want to do anything to help himself. She doesn't owe him anything.

I really feel for you OP. Some good advice on here. You can’t control what he does, only what you do.

You can’t fix him, only he can seek support to quit. And to do that he needs to want to quit, and it doesn’t sound like he does. So focus now on yourself and kids. Get support yourself. Put your energy in what you can do. There are alcohol support services for spouses and families in your situation, seek them out, today.

He’s on a downward spiral and it’s heartbreaking to witness it, because you love him. But he loves the booze more, and you and your kids deserve better.

Good alcohol support threads on MN, read them, many in your shoes who can advise.🌺

There is nothing anyone else can do to help an alcoholic recover.

You can pour away all the alcohol in the house, stop their access to money so they can't buy any more, and drive them to the door of an AA meeting twice a day - none of that will help if they don't want to stop.
They will beg borrow or steal to carry on drinking. They will hide the alcohol they get hold of and swear blind that they haven't had a drink.
It is hopeless trying to control an alcoholic who doesn't want to stop.

All the best to you OP. Don't blame yourself for refusing to confront the problem in your marriage last night. You can't keep living your life walking on eggshells because your DH has an alcohol problem.

How you deal with it and the consequence of accepting your husband has a serious addiction is something you need to deal with in your own time.

Is there a possibility he has SEND too op? Self medicating for his ADHD?

@Arcticienne the beginning of January is too late honey, he needs to go right now. They’re are meetings going on literally hourly in some areas, daily in most.

Im so sorry you’re going through this. It’s very unfair. Alcoholics are so selfish. I know that you think that your children have not witnessed any of this etc, trust me they have and it’s very very damaging for them. They pick up on the mood of the household and the feelings of their parents. I know this from personal experience.

At present he’s a danger to you and the children. He has no control over alcohol and is unpredictable.

I personally would tell him he has to remove himself from the home.

some of my worst childhood memories are of Christmas’s like this

I was in a fairly similar sounding marriage, child with undiagnosed difficulties, working full time, he always drinking, verbally subside, intimidating, gaslighting, and spending his money on himself and going out . We were always glad he was out! Christmas used to be an excuse for him to drink almost to oblivion two weeks straights. He would refuse to accept he needed to attend AA or any counselling. We’d been married 28 years. His unhappiness presumably deepened as his volatility got worse and one even he attacked our 13yo daughter and pinned her to settee while screaming in her face. she retaliated by kicking him in the stomach. That was the final straw. Divorce was a hurdle but me and DC are now not scared, are happy and in a calm new environment.

What I'm trying to express is that if he doesn’t get counselling or therapy and reduce his drinking, yourhusband might seriously over the step the line and mentally or physically injure you or your DC. He’s probably hoping you’ll ask him to leave,so he can escape without it being his fault(!).

Best wishes and good luck.

My heart goes out to you. 20 years is a big investment you’ve made, not easy to give up on. BUT.. the treatment (abuse) you describe is intolerable. SO.. lay your cards on the table - preferably after Christmas so you can try to enjoy it - either he goes for AA counselling beginning of January, stops drinking alcohol completely, otherwise you are leaving. Full stop. No half measures. No accidentally falling off the wagon. No begging for forgiveness. You are young enough to get an enjoyable life back on your own if he doesn’t respect you enough to share it. Start planning now.

Please don’t blame yourself by saying you should have walked away. Why shouldn’t you stand your ground? It’s his behaviour and response to you which is the issue.

Im glad you’ve got to the point of feeling you’ve had enough. Unfortunately he had an alcohol problem and unless he gets help nothing will change.

Ultimately he's not happy. Whether that's work you, the kids, whatever.

People either recognise that sometimes life will be bumpy and choose to find the joy in life e.g. doing stuff with kids and muddling through, or they let it consume them.

Your choice is really how far you follow him down this path.

He's been a problem drinker for years, not getting could selling, not changing job but instead drinking and raving that his life isn't what he wants and how its all your fault (or works fault or someone else's fault).

Drinking might be his coping mechanism but he's not proactively managing his life alongside.

Breaking up is always a hard choice but it is a choice and it's the only one you really have around his behaviour. You can't make him change. You can change being around him.

Sorry that still leaves you in shit situation xx

I remember the moment when I realised my partner's drinking was making the relationship an overall negative - he went off to Glastonbury and I just really enjoyed him not being around for those days.

Luckily when I told him how I felt he admitted he knew he was drinking too much.

He changed jobs, cut down dramatically and thirty years and one daughter later we're still together.

So it can work, but only if the partner is willing to accept responsibility.

How about her owes it to her & the kids to get help?