Right to bear arms

There a whole load of ex pat US citizens who do shorts on how US messed them up when they live in other countries - not jumping when a car back fires because they assume it's gun fire and they may need to find cover to stay alive - is a common one.

As PP mentioned:
BBC:Gun deaths were the leading killer of US children in 2020

Data from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) shows that over 4,300 young Americans died of firearm-related injuries in 2020.
While suicides contributed to the toll, the data shows that homicides form the majority of gun-related deaths.

...

In past years, gun-related deaths were second only to car crashes as the leading cause of death among young Americans. Car deaths, however, have fallen over time and in 2020 approximately 3,900 Americans under 19 died in vehicle crashes.
...
Gun violence in the US has increased since the Covid-19 pandemic began in early 2020.

There are many countries that also have low gun deaths that aren't as restictive with guns as us in UK - but there is no public support for US style gun carriage or ownership in UK that I've ever seen.

I lived in a rough part of Dublin and was so glad I didn't have a gun as I'm a wee bit hot tempered

I do hope that you don't have any decision making capacity or responsibility in your life or work.

I was talking to an American friend a few months after we'd had the riots here.

Fox news was still reporting the riots as though they were happening, and pretty widespread, so he was concerned how we were holding up.
I said they'd finished weeks ago, and the last ones had been damp squibs, and he commented that our riots seemed pretty quiet.
I wasn't sure what he meant so I queried what he meant.

"I didn't hear a single gun shot. Ones round here that's a big part of riots you hear."

Brought me up short what a population owning guns means. It means that people take guns and are prepared to use them to things like that. People will be shot on purpose/by accident in that sort of thing. His reaction was "yeah, that's normal".
Really hit him when I said that wasn't our normal. He's quote pro-guns but he said that made him think about what difference it could make. He's still popping questions from time to time about what not having guns means, and reconsidering his stance.

I don't want the UK to accept that for us.

I think you lived too long in the US. Their gun culture is not a normal way to live

An armed society is a polite society.

As what considered polite is hugely culturally based and very nuanced not sure how this could be measured objectively and thus compared against gun law and ownership.

The implication is people are polite in countries with high gun ownership because they could get killed if they are not - but there would be huge varraible with that if you part of a huge gun carrying group againt no gun carry indidudals wouldn't the biggerest group get away with being rude still.

It also implys shooting someone has no come back -ie police and legal routes don't work - which I can see in US TBH but while our police and CPS have issues - sometimes for unfortunate people huge ones - shooting someone in UK does come with massive blow back - ie being charged with murder or attempted murder - so the be polite or get shot doesn't really work and shooting carries serious implications - even armed police doing their jobs get their actions thoughly vetted.

Where are you living that you think an actual gun is the answer!

We have the right to bear arms in the UK. You just need to apply for a licence to do so. You might not be successful, if for instance, you are known to be a violent criminal. The US notion of a "right to bear arms" is actually the right to bear arms without record and without scrutiny, and the wholesale endorsement of a culture in which preventable gun deaths are completely normalised.

In the US, it's more likely that someone you will love, your partner, your child, maybe you - will use that gun to kill themselves, intentionally or by accident than it is that it will ever be used successfully in self defence. The majority (58%) of all gun deaths in the US are suicides.

And bringing out a gun in self defence in a country where gun violence is completely normalised like the US, is just increasing the likelihood that you will be fatally shot by your assailant, in their self defence.

I wouldn't like to own a gun and keep it in my house, because I value my children's lives. I wouldn't like to live in a culture which normalises preventable gun deaths because I value my children's lives, and human life in general.

The leading cause of death for children in the US is gun violence. I find that absolutely shocking but it would seem that their culture does value guns more than children's lives. Removing guns would save more children's lives in the US than curing cancer.

Lol, then there was nothing to say in the first place, was there? You saw an opinion that got up your nose and you felt compelled to dunk on it.

An armed society, where everyone is carrying a firearm, is a polite society because everyone knows they'll get shot up if they try anything stupid.

You agree that a car is unassuming, a tool and a great way to get around independently, yet it can also be turned into a deadly weapon when misused/abused, yes?

Right-o. Settled. Have a nice evening.

How old are you OP? Have a read up about the Dunblane school massacre and the subsequent gun reform in the UK.

Absolutely not and it will never happen in this country, thankfully.

I don't need to get a rise out of you. If you truly think that "an armed society is a polite society" there is no more to say.

Well, I don’t agree with us having guns in the UK and the place then ending up like the USA with regular mass shootings (there’s enough nutters and knives on our streets already).

However, there’s a very big problem because, like you say, we can no longer count on the police.

Can you at least elaborate? I know it's all too easy to dunk on a statement and hope the person doesn't have the patience to engage.

I amicably agree to disagree in any case, so good luck getting a rise out of me.

Not in favour of everyone being armed. Mind a fully automatic assault rifle would be a bit of a laugh as a Christmas present this year. Much better than socks ?!

Guns give an illusion of safety but in practical terms they increase the danger for most people, as well as making society less safe

I’d rather take my chances with a knife. In close conditions it’s faster and deadlier than a gun, and you’ve a better chance of injuring an assailant before it’s taken off you than with a gun.

A gun is only more advantageous when there is distance between you and an attacker, and then your best chance is to run.

What utter rubbish.

An armed society is a polite society.

I can't think of any situation I have ever been in where I would have felt safer if I had been carrying a gun. However, I can think of plenty of situations where I would have felt a lot less safe if someone else had been carrying a gun so no, I don't agree and YABVU

You want British people to have guns?

Sorry, was typing quickly. Yeah I see what you mean, I feel like we are at a disadvantage either way really.

Absolutely YABU

If guns were available in the UK think about how many domestics, neighbourly disputes and road rage incidents would end in tradegy.

We have too many nutters about to arm them.

Being armed against nutters is not as effective as having no guns for said nutters.

Durrrh

What's making you feel unsafe exactly?

I do see why so many feel unsafe in USA - high crimes rates - lots of guns - but also seen you tube clips where it shows how easy it is to kick their doors down or generally break in - construction in rest of the world - even standard UK doors just aren't as flimsy.

I don't see why everyone having hand guns makes anyone safer? Plus you can have guns - more types than most realise but you'd have to have a good reason and pass vetting.

Sorry, I wasn't clear, I did see you said that (and it wasn't my post you originally replied to). My point was really that levels of male on female violence is high enough in both countries that gun availability should not make women feel any safer. I agree with you that is a valid reason for women to feel unsafe (everywhere?)

ETA Sadly, whilst I understand the sentiment of women wanting to carry something non lethal for self defence I worry that in fact it may be more likely to be turned upon them than effective in protecting them.

You need to get some perspective - it's not half as bad as you make out. There are multiple things you can do to increase your sense of safety, none of which involve firearms. Take a self defence class. Carry a personal safety alarm. Plan your journeys and update other people. Carry an item that you could lawfully use as a weapon if need be. Get a dog. Use a tracker app with a trusted friend or family member. That's just for starters.