Feeling really awful about myself and my son.

Do you or your son suffer with sinus infections?
Ask your GP for a referral for both you and your child if nothing else can resolve this problem.
it’s not great to be permanently on acid suppressants, it can also reduce your intake of vitamin and minerals from your gut, whether you use probiotics or not

If your GP is unsympathetic, get another one.

Have you tried oral probiotics for dental and mouth health. Like BlisK12 but there are other salivarus ones specific for the mouth.

Op sorry to hear this. Personally if it was me id book myself into a specialist dentist and start a referral for yourself that involves identifying the issue rather then focusing on the issue being related to your gut. Im not saying its not that but I think at this stage you really dont know what the cause is so I wouldn't focus on one reason and I would instead insist the health system gets to the bottom of it all. Get online and find a good dentist or go to your own. They too can make referrals to ent on your behalf. Good luck and i really hope you sort it out.

I was going to say tonsil stones, but not sure about your son having it from so young 🤔 have you checked your tonsils for white lumps? They absolutely stink! Once I figured out i was getting them I flush the holes in my tonsils with a syringe and gets rid of any nasty build up of bacteria 🤢

A close friend suffered with this in secondary school and it was very clear it was not a hygiene issue, she was so self conscious about it. She was open with us about it and used mints but truthfully it didn't bother us and we tried to comfort/ reassure her. I am sorry it is not a solution but I would at least confide in a couple of friends as the issue is bigger in your head than in real life.

Practical suggestion would be to make sure you eat and drink enough as I know from dieting my breath stinks when fasting or if I cut out carbs

Try that CB40?? Mouthwash

Breath more through your nose when talking or just keep a bit of distance, I think you need to be very close to smell someone's breath

I am sorry you feel this way and I hope you can find a solution. I would try herbal or Chinese medicine too, have literally nothing to lose by giving it a go

Good luck and I hope yiu find a solution or find peace xxx

Both Yakult & Kefir will give initial stomach camps - it helps to only have a small amount & gradually build up.

The best Kefir can be made yourself at home - you only need some grains.

https://www.yemoos.com/pages/milk-kefir-overview

It sounds like you have been very thorough though OP - hope you find some more info to help.

I know you have had a barrage of tests. Have you been referred to an ENT consultant? Is that who ran the tests? Have you had an endoscopy? I wouldn't let it go, someone has to know what this is and help you and your son.

I’m just going to say see your gp again with your child.You need to be referred onto a specialist who can start ruling out and ruling in what’s wrong.You shouldn’t be suffering like this.please tell your gp the impact it is having on you and your son.If you don’t get anywhere then definitely try going private, even if it means asking family to lend you the money.Also write down everything you have already done yourself without success.good luck

Can you breathe through your nose? Mouth breathing can cause terrible breath in otherwise healthy, clean mouths?
Do your teeth bite together correctly? Or are your teeth/ or jaws misaligned? Do your lips meet easily at rest? Do you need to engage your tongue to seal your lips to effectively swallow?
if anything here is abnormal I would consult an orthodontist.

All the people recommending mouthwash and flossing etc. - don't you think the OP will have tried this?? 🙄

No advice OP but I'm sending my sympathy. It sounds like such a hard situation and heartbreaking for you to see your little boy suffer too. Really hope the root cause is found soon.

Fasting to reset gut health?

I am sorry, this sounds extremely difficult.

When you were tested for helicobacter, were you on omeprazole? If so this can give you a false negative result.

You mention GPs saying nothing can be done. I agree with a PP that this sounds out of their scope and you need to demand to be referred to specialists.

Tbh based on my own experience this year, i would really recommend seeking a private consultation with a GP and also getting appointments with private consultants eg ENT, digestive etc. Expensive but worth it. Good luck op.

Has he tried using a mouth spray - very often

Have you ever seen an ENT / ear not throat consultant? There are ones that specialise in halitosis. You can get colonies of bacteria that live in the nasal passage / tongue / sinuses that produce a foul sulphur / poop smell. This may explain why diet has little impact on your breath if it’s not coming from the gut and also why your son has the same issue as he may have inherited the same susceptible structures plus families share microbiomes particularly in early life. An ENT will work to locate where it’s coming from and then treat it accordingly. I don’t have personal experience of this btw I just asked chatGPT (I had liver inflammation which caused this problem for me - the poop smell in mouth made me think of this - and wanted to check with chatGPT before I sent you up the garden path!). Make sure it’s an ENT that specifically specialises in halitosis

I would say given your DS’s issues and yakult giving you stomach cramps that you need to look to your gut. That doesn’t just mean balancing the health of your gut but actually looking at where everything is leading to and from the gut.

Could you have a hernia / hole in the stomach wall or in that area which is somehow having the bowel smells leaking through to your stomach and then up your oesophagus into your mouth

It isn’t unheard of to have a familial weakness in areas of the body.
The yakult thing needs time for your body get used to the change. But if it doesn’t get better maybe look at lactose intolerance

This worked wonders for my daughter when nothing else worked - we get it off Amazon but I’ve seen it in boots. No bad breath anymore more - ever

UltraDEX Daily Oral Rinse

Have you had an endoscopy & colonoscopy?

If your breath smells like poop then there is something going on somewhere along your digestive system.

I’m on omeprazol for gastritis. But I didn’t get the drug until I’d had a colonoscopy and endoscopy.

It could be bacterial.

i would suggest having your tonsils out.

For some people it only affects the breath, not everyone with it has body odour of fish.

Good thinking. This should definitely be tested for as it could have been passed from you to your son.

This might do nothing at all but it's worth a go - these are probiotics for the mouth https://uk.biogaia.com/products/prodentis
You could try them along with VSL#3 probiotics for your gut.

I would also make sure you are cleaning your tongue several times a day. I find the plastic tongue scrapers do a much better job than brushing the tongue or metal scrapers. Obviously a good electric toothbrush, dental floss + a water flosser might help. I suspect, like you do, it's a condition rather than an oral hygiene thing. Some people cannot breakdown the components in certain foods and it makes them smell bad (TMAU). Perhaps a diet of exclusion is worth experimenting with to see if there are certain foods that make it worse.

It might also be worth seeing if you can get a prescription for pilocarpine or cevimeline (used to treat dry mouth in Sjögren's Syndrome).

I would try things on yourself 1st before trying on your son. Best of luck.

I’m so sorry that you have not had help with. You said you haven’t you have talked to your doctor regarding this do you realise that this may be a problem not in the mouth itself but from perhaps the stomach if you don’t mind my suggestion I think you should have a check with the doctor as there may be some acid or or a problem in the digestive tract I’m only saying this because I had someone with the same problem and it actually was constipation how strange you might say but check it out. You seem to be at the end of your together and I wish you all the best.

OP I know you use a tongue scraper but I find that a) only certain kinds work and b) you have to push it all the way to the back of your throat (to the point where you’re literally gagging) it’s the only thing that works! Mouthwash straight after to rinse out the bacteria. My dd had the same problem but now she’s learned to use it properly she has v seeet smelling breath!

Hi OP,
Not sure what the root cause is and I have RTFT and not seen this mentioned so worth saying. Have you ever tried peppermint oil capsules to see if it helps to mask the smell for you. Only thinking it as whenever I’ve taken them and burped all I can taste is mint. Random but worth a shot!

You sound like a lovely, caring mum.

My little boy when he was about 3, kept borrowing my perfume and putting a squirt on his neck. Eventually I bought a bottle for him, he's now 7.

If the problem is causing his school friends to say he smells bad, could a squirt of a carefully chosen, non overpowering fragrance before school help? It might help his confidence too.

Just an idea, sorry if it's no good.