To dislike male cleaners in female public toilets?

Laughed out loud at the thought of a male sexual predator going out to buy some 'spray and a cloth' (and a mop, presumably!) to go predating.

Unlikely doesn't even cover it.

Did you Google the case at New Street Station? When arrested the sexual assailant was asked why he was in the women's toilets. He responded that he was trans.
This is actually really pertinent as if he was believed to be trans, then the case would have rested on his word against his victims, because as a 'transwoman' he was considered justified (at that time) in being in that space.
In a case where all men are barred from using women's toilets, his defence would have been weaker, as he would have no business being in there in the first place.

The SC didn't set out to provide a comprehensive list of who could go into women's toilets. It simply clarified that if a space is designated single sex it's for the use of people of that sex and not the opposite sex. The judgement was long enough as it was without several appendices to say when it would be permissable for male cleaners, plumbers, locksmiths, paramedics, police officers et al to enter a women's toilet in the course of their jobs.
Which isn't at all the same thing as the unfettered ability for men declaring themselves women to go in and out as they please.
I agree female attendants are optimum. However keeping male ones while barring all other men is far better than the direction we were headed in prior to the judgement.

Frankly, my dear, I don’t give a shit.

I had to stop a woman trying to eject a man from the Unisex loos in the National Portrait Gallery yesterday. She looked pretty bloody foolish when I pointed out he had every right to be there.

Just as ridiculous as thinking men would pretend to identify as women to enter women’s toilets and assault women, when they could just walk in off the street to do that anyway.

You’ve probably hit the nail on the head here, to be fair. I think for me, in terms of offsetting any risk of women feeling uncomfortable and of men with ill intent accessing the space, I’d probably put the benefit of allowing another oppressed group (trans women) to access women’s toilets so that they can also feel safe above ‘having slightly cleaner toilets’, even though that’s not a group I’m actually a part of (as a cis woman) and so it has no direct benefit for me, and a clean toilet would have a slight personal benefit.

Some trans identified men have an extremely feminine persona, are exclusively attracted to men, and would pose no risk to women at all. I'm not saying that they are the only trans women to go to women's loos, but they are far less likely to be a threat to women than a random male toilet cleaner. I am GC but I don't understand why people are ok with a cleaner being male but not a service user. I actually don't understand why the supreme court ruling didn't put an end to male attendants in women' loos.

.

That's ridiculous. Those guys are doing a very difficult and necessary job, do you really think they're there to just put you in your place? You're crazy.

Just let them get on with it and show cleaners (whether they are men or women) some respect for the important job they are doing.

This doesn't bother me at all.

Don't be silly.

Just I've seen 3 "keep men out of teaching/caring for young children roles" and now "keep them away from cleaning toilets" within nearly as many days.
There's definitely something going on with MN nowadays.
I've been seeing it for a while, but it's more overt now - more of a push to get women and men back into traditional roles/ a right conservative push.

Agreed.

I didn't want to be alone with a man I didn't know on my own

How do you manage ordinary daily life without ever being alone with a man you don't know? Do you go around with a chaperone all the time or what? Do you have to have someone take a day off work and come round to supervise if you have a man doing work on your house? What about things like a lift in a hotel or an office?

I can think of five occasions I've been alone with a man I don't know this week already, and that's just off the top of my head.

YANBU. Women should do all the cleaning and caring work, not men.
Men doing it must be dodgy for wanting to go anywhere near women in the first place.
Best we stick to the good old traditional "natural order" of women if they do any work it should be in the home or the cleaning/caring roles. Men stick to their "roles."
Disclaimer sarcasm
Just I've seen 3 "keep men out of teaching/caring for young children roles" and now "keep them away from cleaning toilets" within nearly as many days.
There's definitely something going on with MN nowadays.
I've been seeing it for a while, but it's more overt now - more of a push to get women and men back into traditional roles/ a right conservative push.

I'd argue that you are being a bit ridiculous now.

I'm getting so tired of seeing nonsense like this on Mumsnet! Going by the name of the site, I'm guessing that most of the people on here have had at least a passing acquaintance with a man, and most of them aren't that scary. The cleaners have just got a job to do. I doubt they're taking much notice of random women coming in for a pee. Plus, there's generally a sign warning you 🙄

What work is required to assume a trans identity? I was under the impression all that was required was to state one was the opposite sex? As far as I'm aware, there are no requirements to do with modifying appearance or behaviour. Or indeed any requirements to be consistent. Swapping from 'boy mode' to 'girl mode' at will is acceptable. A simple statement that you 'are' the opposite sex suffices. Something any man is able to do merely by saying "I identify as a woman".

We're repeatedly told that there's no lengths men won't go to to access women, including assuming a trans identity.

So surely any man off the street could put on a high vis, carry around some spray and a cloth, tape a piece of paper to the door saying "male cleaner in attendance", and go in. In a big busy place it could be a good while before he was rumbled.

I'd argue the above is easier and requires significantly less commitment than assuming a trans identity.

Because a male cleaner in a female space will have signage up to inform people of his presence.

Because a male cleaner will not actually be using the facilities.

Because a male cleaner will be known to the business operating the facilities and so contactable/traceable.

I mean, i can keep going.

I have never seen a male cleaner in or around women's toilets where there hasn't been a sign indicating that possibility.

Well the world doesn't revolve around you im afraid, what if the next person doesn't want them to be doing the non urgent work and the next ,when would it get done?

They used to put a sign up and try to be quick. Nowadays they just send men in willy nilly since they decide women who want same sex spaces are evil. It's annoying.

Its entirely valid for you to feel the risk from male cleaners is too high. I respect that and would happily support a campaign for female only cleaners.
I'm simply trying to answer your question as to why people see male cleaners as different from men who identify as women accessing women's toilets.
There is nothing women can do to completely remove our risk of assault from men. So all we can do is risk assess different situations and decide whether the risk is acceptable to us when balanced by the benefits and the mitigations.
For example, we could decide a clean toilet wasn't worth the risk of a male cleaner. But would likely decide our life was worth the risk from a male paramedic if we needed emergency care whilst in the women's toilet.
When it comes to allowing males to access the women's toilets for no other reason that their own desire to do so, there is no mitigation or benefit that makes that risk acceptable, so is viewed differently.
Do you know of any benefits to women of allowing men who ID as women into the ladies, or ways that we could remove the risk of any man with ill intent accessing the toilet under this guise, that I've overlooked?

What makes you uncomfortable about them being there? Do you perceive yourself to be more at risk from these male cleaners than men in other contexts?

Can you explain why

I mean, it's obviously not the same thing at all.