To be so annoyed with bloody paternalistic NHS

@Chinsupmeloves It makes far more sense for a husband to have a vasectomy (and far more effective) than his wife remaining on hormonal contraceptives until menopause. I am glad my husband didn't expect that of me.

To the people defending this paternalistic attitude, do you seriously think that various medication doesn't also impact sperm and cause problems for a potential baby?

Really? What about the mirena coil? Lots of us have it in our 40s and even 50s for menopause.

@Paganpentacle But the pill is definitely not failsafe - I've fallen pregnant on it with 100% correct use.

I know you’ve said you’ve tried everything @MyKindHiker but have you tried a ketogenic lifestyle? That completely resolved my migraines and I was dependent upon triptans to just get through.
I do agree that the whole healthcare set up is almost anti women, we endure pain at every turn that men would not tolerate.

Yeah… if necessary we can check fsh/lh to see if you’re post menopausal…

I don’t think that fulfills the criteria required for the safe prescription of the medication she requires.
It’s a medico legal issue- the prescriber is taking responsibility for making sure the patient doesn’t accidentally get pregnant so people get twitchy when guidance isn’t followed. I wonder if they would accept a signed disclaimer from OP…

As you know, a few minutes can be vital.

Vasectomy is considered a long acting contraception.

If the pregnancy is terminated anyway, the danger from the drug is irrelevant.

The same circumstances re migraine; not pregnancy, obviously.

@Paganpentacle The OP doesn't need any form of contraception - her husband has had a vasectomy.

Maybe go and see a Private Consuitant as a last resort at somewhere like Spire Health

Could be expensive but worth it.

I also suffer from migraines but not as serious as you. Really find that Sweet Marjoram Essential Oil helps

Hope you can get this problem sorted soon

Sounds like hell.

Good Luck.
🌻🍀🤞

You're quite right OP.

They do treat us women like we're nothing more than baby machines, goodness forbid we might do anything that affects our chances of reproducing and our lady parts belong to them no matter what we might say to the contrary, or argue.
Are the declining birth rates something to do with this, I wonder?

Get a second opinion, I used to get migraines as a teen so I get how it can be.

Your doc sounds unreasonable you have a right to a ‘ second opinion - is there someone else at the surgery ?

I know it gets used as a mood stabiliser and and for epilepsy, my DS has epilepsy and has been on it. I was on it about 15 years ago, maybe a bit longer and I had to have a coil put in to be able to get it back then. I wasn't on it for long to be honest and even back then they tried to avoid using it as lots of people complained of weight gain and hair loss and it was kind of a last resort even back then. I personally had a degree of both and it didn't help my migraine either, it was a horrible drug for me. However it always does depend on the patient and for some it really helps across a range of conditions that are otherwise hard to treat.

People have Botox/ neuromuscular injections for migraines- is this something that’s been explored?

Oh, meant to add, that despite me pointing out that I couldn't have the various forms of contraception they kept offering me, they still continued to do so! I cannot have a coil at all due to the ruptured uterus but that was still always offered, also. It felt like I was banging my head against the wall.

Ahhh, Toprimate really helped reduce the amount of migraines I had until a different GP refused to prescribe this to me. I cannot have hormonal contraception as I have Intracranial Hypertension. I cannot risk getting pregnant again due to having a c-section rupture several years ago during labour as I was told I wouldn't manage to carry full-term. I am long-term single and carrying for disabled children so have no interest, or time, in another relationship. It did lead to many, many months of severe migraines due to the Toprimate being stopped. Other various meds were tried but I reacted badly to them. I have recently had a med prescribed which has only recently become available on the NHS. It has helped but I find Toprimate worked better. I am terrified still, that the same GP will refuse to prescribe these and I will end up in the same state I was previously. I don't know what else to say, but I'm so sorry you're going through this. Logically, I can understand your frustrations, but I can also understand the position that GPs find themselves in as they do need to be wary when there is always a potential for action against them. At the same time, if only they would think about that the rest of the time when they do tend to make so many other mistakes! (I could be cynical due to the amount of issues I have encountered over the years and the fact my child has had issues since the rupture was dismissed on the maternity unit)

Look at it from a wider angle as well.

I think the point about abortion risk is being overstated, because the possibility of getting pregnant and the possibility of choosing an abortion are not risks created by this medication. They are part of life for anyone who is sexually active and not using birth control all the time. Many women choose not to be on the pill for personal or medical reasons, and many who become pregnant choose not to continue the pregnancy for reasons that have nothing to do with fetal exposure.

Your argument assumes that these women would otherwise keep the pregnancy and that the only reason they might consider an abortion is because of the medication. That simply is not the case for many people. Some do not want a baby regardless, and if they became pregnant even without this medication involved, they might still decide on an abortion.

With this logic, then all women who do not want to be pregnant at all times should be on birth control constantly, and that is not realistic. The medication does not introduce a unique or special risk of abortion. It only affects the potential reason someone might choose not to continue a pregnancy, not the fact that they might make that choice anyway.

Honestly, I would just go to a different doctor and lie and say you’re post-menopausal. There’s no way for them to know. If you’re sure that a possible pregnancy is the only reason why they wouldn’t prescribe these drugs?

@BeAmberMember

The issue is that the risks can and should be explained - THAT's the guidelines. If the risks are NOT explained then of course the GP is at fault. But if the risk is explained and then the woman still chooses to go ahead and do it, taking on that risk, then no, that is NOT the GP's fault. If te GP wants to protect himself by making the woman sign something to say she accepts that risk, so be it.

Instead, in this one case, GPs are saying that they don't trust women to believe them about risks so they won't let them have it at all.

And that IS the same as prescribing strong painkillers. A Gp does so, and warns the patient that if they drive under the influence of these drugs they will be at risk. if the doctor does NOT mention this risk, then they may well be considered to be at fault. But ifthey yhave, the risk is then taken by the person taking the meds.

ETA: if the problem is that women are suing GPs all over th eplace because of this issue, then the issue is how the guidleines are being implemented. And I would argue strongly that any strong medication with strong side effects needs the patient to specifically and formally acknowledge those risks right up front.

Also, there are many women who can get pregnant at any given time and will decide to get an abortion, regardless of being on other medication. Many women may choose to avoid hormonal contraceptives/stick to condoms and ‘risk’ an abortion. Pregnancy itself is risky. Contraceptives and the combination women take/ the option to have an abortion if necessary is a risk women decide for themselves everyday.

I guess my point is that in this scenario, an abortion isn’t specifically a risk associated with taking a medication that causes foetal abnormalities. It’s a risk many women choose to take regardless, as is pregnancy, as is the pill. These choices are our reality, regardless of medication. The important part is being able to have that choice.

And that might work if there weren't numerous examples of litigation which absolutely back up why GPs can't and shouldn't prescribe dangerous medications outside of the guidelines which are based on all the catastrophic outcomes that occurred when the guidelines were not in place.

And as I said before, abortion is NOT risk free. What if a GP prescribed outside of the guidelines which is what OP wants, and has an abortion which she says she would have to have anyway results in her becoming seriously ill from sepsis? Or even dying.

In that case OP or her DP if she died would be able to litigate for medical negligence or malpractice because the GP did not follow the prescribing guidelines.

The guidelines are in place for many reasons including because too many GPs took the word of patients saying they wouldn't get pregnant or couldn't who then did and then sued the provider.

Google sodium valproate or topimirate solicitors - there are many.

If anything were to happen, they’ve fulfilled their part. They’re protected. My GP, in all of this, is just issuing guidelines they have to follow. They don’t make them. My issue is the fact that my GP is given so little to work with- they can’t help me if the framework they’ve been given doesn’t allow them to help me in the first place.

My issue is that I have to lie in the first place, not with every single GP following procedure. My individual GP might not be paternalistic, but the guidelines they have to follow are. That’s where my issue lies.

And that goes back to my original point: the inflexibility and absolutely no regard these guidelines give for an individual woman’s health. There should be a third option. Other options.

I know abortion isn’t without risks. Pregnancy has many risks in general. However, the side effects of the pill are also harmful to me and the main issue to me is that there was no way around that.

I can’t take the pill, I use condoms. In general, the chance of me getting an abortion is higher. But that doesn’t change just because I’m taking medication that causes foetal abnormalities. If I got pregnant, I’d get an abortion regardless of whether I’m taking medication or not. That risk is always there- taking that medication didn’t specifically increase it. In general, as a woman, it’s my right and an autonomous decision to weigh up the risks and decide the side effects I get from hormonal birth control outweigh the added security/further chance of preventing pregnancy. Taking medication doesn’t change that.

I’m not disagreeing with you. I lied. But that’s a symptom of a poor system, not the main problem. The issue of people lying is caused by a much larger issue, which is the more important one. That’s the right thing to focus on. If I hadn’t lied, I’d still be in pain. I refuse to believe that that’s the lying is the most important, overarching issue.

I lied “to get what I want.” Aka, a pain free existence. I lied because the standardised measures failed me. I don’t see how lying is the big issue, not that I had to lie because I was suffering and there were no other options. That is quite literally misogyny.