Is the renaming of Dublin’s Herzog Park antisemitic?

I am very sorry about what happened. I know lots of people who were very unhappy about the speech, but they’re not in government of course.

I find the government refrains from public criticism of the president.
It would be like the British government officially apologising for a speech given by King Charles. (Maybe they do that? I don’t know.)

President Higgins should have apologised. Well, he should have refused the invitation/kept his mouth shut actually imho.
I’m sorry.

Really? So please explain to me, a Jewish person who walked out of that event, why no one in the Jewish community has received an apology from anyone in the Irish government about it. Or the board of the HMD for that matter. They should apologise for MDH and the overreaction of the security guards.

Nothing.

Still debating if I should attend this years HMD. My dh refused to attend last year and this year.

No, we don't get people physically attacking us for being Jews. But its sad that many of us don't feel comfortable attending HMD.

Sorry, haven't been on this thread for a while. Just want to correct you about the demographics of the Jewish community in Ireland. Many (I would say a vast majority now) are recent immigrants, often from Israel but from other countries too. Mostly educated people working in tech jobs so they speak english as well as Hebrew or other languages.

@OpheliaIsntMad its been revealing!

Oh, I don't know!

👏 👏 @Oinseach and you certainly are not. 😀😉

Yes, I think many people dont really understand the depth of hatred for Jews & Israel in MENA and how it manifests itself. They tend to see things primarily through the lens of Palestinians, which is only part of the story.

Some people see Israel positively and see how its culture and values aligns with aspects of Western culture and values. But generally Israel's culture and values are Jewish, not Western, and Judaism is a Middle Eastern religion and Jews are historically a Middle Eastern people. Today, still the majority of Jews in Israel are Mizrahi.
What has become really predominant in the discourse is to see Jews as western in order to delegitimate their indigeneity and support the idea that Israel is a European colonial settler state. So some might naively think calling Israel 'western' is a compliment, but its misguided and conceals a multitude of sins.

Tbh I don't understand your last sentence. The more links with Israel the bettter as far as I'm concerned. One of my colleagues just came back from a visit - she had a wonderful time.

As ever, the ever so (not) subtle undertones soon give way to full on mask slipping. I really do wish some would stop pissing about and show their hand earlier. It really would save everyone's time. If you're so precious about your country being accused of bigotry maybe try calling them out on it if you're really that opposed. The whole world can see which particular nations have an antisemitism problem.

I was referring to deep antisemitism in the MENA. I dont think the extent of it is 'basic knowledge' & you didnt know Morocco didnt compete because of it.

You think the position of MENA countries re Israel and Jewish people is coming as a surprise? Seriously?
(I didn’t know Morocco competed at all. It wasn’t that I was somehow confused about their reasons for not competing.)

You don’t think there might be more positive reasons why Israel is often seen as part of the Western World?
No doubt if I denied the close links you’d say I was othering the Israeli people for anti-semitic reasons.

No I was referring to deep antisemitism in the MENA. I dont think the extent of it is 'basic knowledge' & you didnt know Morocco didnt compete because of it. As I say, education has nothing to do with it.

Yes I know why some people consider Israel part of the ' Western World'. I wanted to know why you do.

For some its because it supports their false view of Israel as a white colonial settler state. Those people dont usually know much about the history or that Israel is majority Mizrahi.

For others its a form of racism against others in the region, as I referred to above.

Israel is certainly the only democracy in the Middle East and democratic values are arguably Western but its odd when that is used as a stick to beat Israel with, rather than something to admire.

If you know anything at all about Israel it is definitely a Middle Eastern country but with capabilities e.g. technological, more often associated with Western ones, and a mix of ethnicities. A veritable melting pot.

I dont think Israel is considered part of the Western world by anyone who knows much about it? Its a ME country, with a ME language, ME food and culture, surrounded by other countries in the ME.
Perhaps you think its part of the Western World because its a democracy?

‘Are you starting to see it now?’
About basic knowledge.
Don’t play games please.

You can look up why Israel is often considered part of the Western world if you’re really interested. I’m certainly not going to go into it all here.

@DaisyDenise also Lebanon was due to take part once but withdrew because it was illegal in Lebanon to broadcast Israeli content.

Oh come on, How did I imply you were uneducated? Im trying to understand what your definition of the Western World is and you're not being very forthcoming. You cant guarantee on here that people will recognise antisemitism, I dont think its anything to do with levels of education. Just up thread someone said criticism of Israel isnt antisemitic! When of course it can be, like when Morocco wont compete in Eurovision.

Please give me some credit. I can do without questions implying I’m uneducated.

They only competed once - a year when Israel did not. They dont compete because they hate Israel and wont take part in a singing contest that includes Israel. Are you starting to see it now?

I didn’t know Morocco was in the Eurovision. I haven’t ever seen them compete. I don’t follow it though.

Most of what I say is twisted on here.

Or @DaisyDenise are you getting at that weird racism of low expectations that Jews are held to a higher standard than the Arabs and other ethnicities in the Middle East? You know Morocco is also eligible to participate in Eurovision but doesnt because of Israel? Is Morocco therefore in the Western World?

So in what way is it in the 'Western World'?

Oh for heavens sake I know where it is 😂
It’s also in the Eurovision. Not even going to get into all the rest as I know you know!

Nope, and no matter how many times it's called, won't change that stance.

Israel is in the Middle East.