To refuse to pay this nursery charge

You say that you couldn't understand what reason the manager provided as it made no sense, it was delivered too fast, was word salad etc so maybe in that poorly delivered explanation there was a reason, maybe she has poor communication skills when being confronted in a hostile way etc. So just send an email querying if the £40 or in your case £80 will be refunded at some stage or will it come off the final months activity?

Is this a large nursery? Are all of the families not annoyed over this? Surely there must be families who have more than 2 kids who would likely be causing uproar if they were done out of £120/£160+ ?

And also you keep saying the nature of the activity doesnt matter...but it really does!
Did they have to hire someone in? Buy supplies? Extra food? An external vendor organised? Transport organised? Maybe they paid the activity, it had a no refund policy and for some reason it didnt go ahead, the vendor was a no show and they had already paid? The transport broke down on the way to them and is now refusing a refund? They booked out a swimming pool, but had a high rate of tummy bug and had to cancel but now the pool wont refund (i know this isn't the case...but this is why it matters)

You’re right. It’s so unfair. We are walking on eggshells with them because if they shut down or served us notice we’d be absolutely stuck. We can’t tell our stories walking as you would with any other business.

We had a terrible manager for a while. Bills were all over the place and it took time and energy every month to query them and have them put right. One time the manager sent out a letter outlining a huge price increase which was just devastating to receive, then the same day sent out a message asking if we could contribute supplies such as stationery, spare clothes, crafting items, toys. It truly outlined her incompetence to send these two communications on the same day!
Luckily she left and I feel calmer but I check the bill each month that’s for sure.

Edit: though one final thought, one must be conscious that our beefs with management don’t trickle down to the poor underpaid staff actually with the children. I was so cross with our setting during the drama above but kept reminding myself it’s not the day to day staff’s fault, and I need them to be kind to my kids and look after them well. So I might not dare withhold a Christmas box of biscuits!!!

You're asking whether YABU or if the nursery is. We've heard your side of things but you're not sharing what the nursery is actually saying. This makes me think YABU since otherwise why would you not share the nursery's excuse. If it's a bad excuse, that would make it clear that the nursery ABU.

I'm only half way through my first coffee of the morning and barely awake and I still understood the op. I'm amazed it's caused such confusion. Anyway, maybe follow up the conversation you had with the manager in an email? You can do that perfectly politely but it's harder for her to 'word salad' you. I would consider only paying for the months the activity took place so if it actually runs Dec to March, make your last payment Feb.
Do you know any of the other parents? If you've all been charged for a month you shouldn't have and you all complain then they can't kick you all out...
I must say though, it sounds a bit sinister that you're worried your kids will be asked to leave if you complain about something. That's not right. They have charge of your kids, you should absolutely feel able to speak up.

Yes you are. You have the audacity to say that you wonder how people get through their day when their comprehension skills are SO evidently lacking…. NO ONE understands what you’re saying, you contradict yourself and make very little sense.

if it was 1 or 2 people not understanding, fair enough, but the majority of people have told you that you make no sense and you retaliate by being rude? 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 girl, please.

Double post.

Well fine if that's your stance, it absolutely isn't mine.

Hi OP

You might want to edit your OP to say you've been charged for an activity in novemvers payment but the qctivity didn't take place in November.

I'd be annoyed as well, it's the principle, and also I don't think it's actually legal to charge for a service that hasn't been delivered - it's breach of contract/ misrepresentation. Unless this activity takes a lot of work from their side and they had to buy things in / do a lot of prep in the month then theyve just stolen from you. I'd be considering writing an email pointing this out, but like others I'd be a bit wary they take it out on your child or chuck you out

You mentioned that you usually pay for this activity Dec - Apr.

But what isnt clear is have you paid in advance where normally you wouldnt? Or have you paid in advance as usual but then discovered the activity you paid for hasnt happened/isnt happening?

I agree with the vast majority, you’ve not explained with enough detail and/or clarity what happened or what your problem is. My assumption would be that the payments will just stop a month before the activity finishes.

My guess is that the nursery is struggling with cash flow maybe- which could be why you didn’t get a very straight conversation with the staff about it. Though £40 per child isn’t going to get them far…

£80 is steep for something that didn't happen! That works out a bit less than £10 a week and if you multiply that over all the children in the nursery it's a fair sum of money. The omitted to tell you so that is pretty close to lying in my world. I would be withholding payment.

I don't understand what people don't understand?!

I didn’t say it should be allowed I said it was common in larger childcare settings.

I also said if the OP didn’t like this then she would be perfectly within her rights to remove them from the setting.
I suspect that there isn’t a ton of other nurseries with space and as op has already said she has been largely happily with the service she has received, risking it over £40 per child for one month is a little short sighted.
As I frequently tell my children life isn’t fair we either have to suck it up or change the situation. If OP continues down the path she is on she will lose her places, be unable to work the job she is which must be pretty high pressure/work load not to be entitled to any working tax credits/tax free childcare etc
Would I in her shoes quibble over the £40, no I wouldn’t because the effort and energy would be wasted.

Billing from nursery’s was like some sort of mystical art. We did the same number of hours each month and every month the amount came out differently! The explanations were always bonkers!

problem is good nurseries are hard to come by and they k ow that you will be loathed to mchange if your kids are settled, or that they have a waitlist so don’t care if you leave or stay.

its shocking customer service and in any other situation most people (because this post shows me that clearly it’s not all!!!) would be cross about it. Communication from nurseries is key but they can often be so blooming awful at it.

i guess you have a few options. If the activity is normally paid dec - Feb, I would be tempted to wait to the final payment in Feb and not pay it. I would also email your complaint to them and explain this wanting an explanation. Having it in writing is always best because I also found that staff would unexpectedly have amnesia about conversations.

alternatively don’t pay December, but they then may prevent your children from doing the activity.

clearly looking for a new place is an option but I imagine locally that will be challenging (and they know it)

or, sadly, suck it up reframe it as a Christmas present and don’t get the staff anything next month.

sadly they often have the upper hand in these situations.

If you paid for a service that wasn’t supplied then you are entitled to a refund. Small claims court?

A couple of simple questions OP which I think will clear up what honestly is a mess of an explanation.

Was the activity actually planned to happen in November this year and then for some reason didn’t happen in November?

If that is the case then are they going to offset at the other end of Winter, ie: take the last extra payment on 1st Feb but continue the activity to the end of March?

In actual fact this is fraud but they know they've got you over a barrel and can't do anything about it without risking your nursery place. And £40 multiple times, added to all the other financial 'errors' in their favour they no doubt make, will be a tidy little sideline for them. They know it's small enough that most people won't challenge it. I'd be furious, as you rightly are.
Is it possible to get together with other parents and visit the nursery owner together? They may back down if faced with an angry mob. Or phone your local council. I know that sounds extreme but I'd be so mad that I'd want to explore the options.

unless you are actually prepared to swap your DC out of that nursery I'd suck it up on a direct level.

i would also consider notifying my local trading standards team though... presumably the nursery have charged everyone the same so it's a not insignificant amount?

You honestly have not explained this clearly at all

I understand that you paid in November for the November activity which you somehow found out didn’t happen.
What I don’t understand is the blatant lie she told. Specifically, what lie?
Did she tell you it had happened when you know for sure it didn’t, or was it just general defensive bullshit which made no sense ?

In any case, if you are absolutely certain, with solid evidence, that the activity for which you paid did not take place and will not take place later, you should put your case very clearly in writing and mention that you were not satisfied with the verbal response given to you on xx date. Tell them you would be very grateful either for a full explanation in writing by the end of next week or the refund of November’s £40.