Is this admission fraud? AIBU to report it?

This 100%.Lots of kids who are smarter than yours will never get a chance to go to those schools because their parents can’t afford the fees or to live in those areas. You’re taking the spot of another talented kid. There’s always someone richer who can buy their way in. That’s the unfair reality and the system that allows it to happen.

Did you read the rest of my post or just that bit 🤔🙄

Among the thirty or so houses around us, some children got in last year and some didn't, literally a difference of a few yards.

That surely has to be based on scores though, not on distance.

I'm struggling to understand how a grammar school which is very high in the league tables can having children winning or losing places based on distance from the school when we are talking about such small distances in the first place. In a very high performing grammar you'd not expect to see several children all having to fight over the same places within thirty streets, let alone thirty houses.

Most highly selective grammars have huge catchments, or no defined catchment area at all. It's all about the results, not where they live. They want only the brightest children and they'll take them from absolutely anywhere, so long as they can physically get themselves to school each day. They wouldn't care if they were helicoptered in, so long as they were the cleverest to take the test.

Distance from the school is only usually a factor in the case of a tie break on scores for the last two places, after the higher scoring children have all been allocated a place. If the next two were a dead heat on test scores, it would go to the child who lived closest, but even they might live 15 miles away.

I moved house into the catchment area of 1 of the best schools in Scotland when pregnant with DS1
i accept that this was gaming the system and as given my political views was hypocritical
I don’t care as my DC all did well,but I do own it for what it was

So because she’s a single mother she can’t be a high earner?🤔🙄

Do you know what Op, I’ve had a few drinks tonight and this thread keeps popping to the top of my “threads I’m on.”

of this is your biggest concern in life, count yourself very lucky. Even if it’s not, what a sad little life you must lead to care. In less than 100 years, you’ll be dust and no one will utter your name again.

This is just bollocks. Let it go, said Elsa, that silly tart was correct.

Watford Grammar School for Girls https://www.watfordgrammarschoolforgirls.org.uk/admissions/year-7-entry-forms/

An address is presumed not to be a genuine address if:-

• the address has not been the girl’s normal home address since 1st September of the calendar year preceding proposed admission;
• the property is rented and the tenancy agreement is less than 12 months, or
• if a parent/carer with whom the girl is resident for the majority of school nights, owns an alternative property further from but within 20 miles of the school which has been the main family home within the last five years.

In these cases, further evidence must be provided to demonstrate that the address given as the girl’s normal home address is genuine. The school may require additional evidence of residence qualification if there are reasons for casting doubt on the accuracy or completeness of an application. The trustees may refuse to base an allocation on an address which might be considered to be only a temporary address. If an address is found not to be a genuine address, the trustees may withdraw the offer of a school place or refuse future applications made on behalf of the girl’s sibling under the sibling or cross-sibling criterion.

West Berkshire

The child’s permanent home address is where he or she lives with his or her legal parents/carers and are living at the closing date for applications in the normal admissions round (31 October 2024 – secondary; 15 January 2025 –primary) Future addresses must not be used on the application form. In the majority of cases, applicant’s rent or own one property, however, family circumstances vary so we have identified below how we will consider different cases.

If you own a house or a flat and are renting and living in another property, we will consider the rental address as your permanent address if:

1. 2. your owned property is rented and you have been living at the rented address for at least 1 year (we will require proof) In some cases we may consider a rental address where you have lived for a period shorter than a year as your permanent address if your owned property is a considerable distance away from the rented accommodation where you are living. In these cases we will decide what evidence you should provide us and we will review it and make a decision.

If you own two or more houses, the permanent home address is where you live and we may ask for evidence to determine which address is the permanent home address.

If your permanent home address is not owned or rented (for example living with parents) we will consider it as your permanent home address if you do not own or rent another property. We will require evidence to show that you do not own or rent another property. If you cannot show evidence that you have lived at the current address for more than 1 year we will need to see documentation that confirms what the previous address was and that you do not own or rent the property.

If you own or rent a property and have moved because of an emergency, for example fleeing domestic violence, we will consider the address where you are staying as your permanent home address. We will require evidence such as a police report. Where parental responsibilities are shared and the child/children live at both parent’s addresses during the school week on a permanent arrangement, either address will be considered the permanent home address. To establish where the child resides we may ask for the following information:

1. Any legal documentation confirming residence if such an agreement exists.
2. Information on the actual pattern of residence.
3. The length of time the residence arrangements have been in place.
4. Information on the actual pattern of residence. The length of time the residence arrangements have been in place. Council Tax bill and other utilities bill

i haven’t read the full thread but I used to work in school admissions for an LA.
To see if a place has been allocated fraudulently you would need to look at the schools published admissions criteria and the information on what is defined as a place of residence.
You can complain to whoever has administered the schools admission criteria and they will look into the case but there is no guarantee a place will or won’t be withdrawn.
Ultimately the decision on if you report this lies with you OP.
Ahhhh this thread takes me back to national allocation days…

I don’t think you are a minuscule figure, I think you have a lot less experience than others posting on this thread. Including @PanelChair <waves>. I’m sure that in whatever your own area of specialism is, you have more knowledge than the average bear solicitor.

Anyway, this is pointless. I know whose posts I trust more, you have your own views, do enjoy them and have a great evening

I just don’t get why you care.
Bright kids do fine at any school. My DD went to a proper shit show of a school and is at an RG uni. Doesn’t matter!!

Yes, me. So minuscule a figure, and yet not wrong.

I have no definitive statement on whether this would or would not be considered fraud. What I have said is that this is not a clear cut case of fraud, and it may very well stand up to any scrutiny by the school.

What are your local authority boundaries. Who do you and this women pay Council Tax to?

You can check who owns houses and lives there by checking with the Land Registry and Electoral Register.

Back in the day. Where l live. If children moved out to another local authority . They were asked to leave the school and find another school within their new authority asap.

This rule applied to all Schools including Primary, Secondary and Top State Grammar Schools.

Noted the remarks about ethics and morals. Which are a real thing of the past now. To me this sort of school place grabbing is really wrong.

Good Luck
🫰

The answer to your predicament is quite simple. Mind your own business. You do not have a crystal ball - will they move back into the old house after they get a place in the school, will they not, who knows, and most importantly who cares…this is not for you to predict, let alone to start “reporting” your predictions. Take a chill pill Sherlock. Technically she has done nothing wrong. We all want the best for our kids. You paid top dollar for the house to get yourself in the catchment, you managed it because you had more money than some others. She has more money than you, so did the same thing but slightly better playing the same game. C’est la vie. The concept of snooping and investigating what other families do is nauseating. Concentrate on your family, create a back up plan regarding school and try not to interrogate your child after they have a playdate with another kid pulling information out of them about other families. Not cool.

It will be much cheaper to spend £40k on renting a second home for 12 months than it will be to spend £30k every year on school fees between years 7-13. Which is why people do it.

Agree! Ive never heard of this happening in Scotland (could very well be wrong) but the English system has always sounded whackadoodle to me 😂

exactly,

That's crackers. If they've got that much money they could pay for thier kid to go to private school.

And don’t forget (dare I say it) that people who have sat on appeal panels for aeons, and have attended numerous training events led by eminent specialist lawyers, may be more familiar with the law and admission codes and their interpretation than some solicitors who deal with an admissions case once in a blue moon.

This sounds an awful lot like the Birmingham grammar schools (who have a pass score and do everything on catchment).

I get it OP, the senior schools round here are dire….and I say that as a mom of 4 who only had 1 get into the grammar system. I’d be pissed at the blatant piss take of the rules too.

This thread is weirdly fascinating. Mostly what I’m learning is that it’s ok to prioritise your own child’s needs by breaking the rules it is not ok to prioritise the needs of your own child by reporting the people breaking the rules and making the admissions footprint smaller. I’m assuming we can call this policy snitches get stitches.

What if someone else with a child who intended to make it their home had rented the place who had no idea about the catchment area issue? Would you have been upset then?

The story has come from a child and may not be completely true or accurate.
If you report a story from a child you would look vexatious - and if it was untrue you could be in line for consequences of some sort in the future if your reporting was ever known about
Even if it was all true does it breaking any rules? Check the rules. Are second homes allowed? I think that is the only dodgy aspect in that it is a second home not a main residence.
Its not unusual for folk to move into a catchment area by purchasing or renting a property. Thats what most people do. Catchment areas do change - thats life.

What seems morally questionable to me is your desire to interfere in the boy’s life, the mother’s life, and for what? It’s really not your problem.

It’s called “playing the game”.

No different to all the people who know how to wangle benefits they don’t really need - I’ve known plenty of them in my life, including very good friends. The same applies ot all the silly labels people want attaching to their kids to give them an advantage such as extra time in exams. Pathetic really imho.

This thread is really “life is unfair because someone else has more money than me and is therefore able to play the game better”.

OP could just have easily bought a house closer to the school herself if she was bothered and able.

It’s better to focus on your own life and move yourself forward rather than moaning about other people and what they do. I’ve known people make themselves ill with stress over things like this.

It kind of comes across that you are bitter about it… it sounds like you are desperate for your child to go to this school, would you do the same if you could afford it? She’s trying to give her child the best possible chance. You can tell on her but is that the reputation you want to have amongst your neighbours and fellow parents? That’s the way with these schools, it’s a postcode lottery but money helps.