To teach my kids to say no to their dad

IME, the most valuable thing a parent can give their child/ren is their time.

Experiences are better than endless items. Not necessarily overwhelming or expensive experiences (e.g. lots of soft play or fun parks, though they can be great fun occasionally). But simple things like walks in a park or countryside, where you can chat and explore things (nature) together, sharing your experiences of being a child. Or playing cards, dominoes etc on a wet day. Those are the special childhood memories people look back on as adults.

Could your DH be persuaded to put most of the ‘treat’ money aside for a special tradition each season? Pantomime or theatre show every winter, day out at a favourite beach or outdoor place every summer, including a special lunch out? Doing things more than once helps build memories of a special place or activity, which they’ll tell their grandkids (if they have them) about. Most sticker books and clothes will be long forgotten.

If one problem is you’re accumulating too much stuff, which is cluttering your home, your DH should take responsibility for this, given he brings most of it in. He should apply the ‘one-in, one-out’ rule if you’re full to the max. Even if (initially) ‘out’ means packed in a plastic crate in the garage, shed or attic, to be parted with at a later date, when the items have less meaning.

If he really cannot control himself it sounds like a compulsive behaviour which he could benefit getting some help for.

I would be going mad with it. My DH is always buying bits and bobs (whilst often complaining about how small our house is).
But adding the kids to the dynamic makes it a different kind of stressful as you now need to factor their feelings in too (and yeah, definitely don't give them the responsibility of saying no). You have my sympathies if not any actual advice.

If he’s anything like my friend’s husband he might not want to do these things/ can’t be arsed. The constant purchasing of junk is a way to feel like a good dad.

Because as usual Mumsnet goes totally bonkers on threads like this. One person has a shitty reply and the rest pile on.

You are clearly just at the end of your rope and trying to think how to solve this ridiculous problem your husband has created. I would hate this too OP. He’s wasting money buying utter junk they don’t want, filling the house with shite, and teaching them bad habits with money.

But you can’t put it on them. It’s not their responsibility to help you fix his problem. The pair of you need to have it out and come to some kind of compromise.

But I feel for you- quite honestly I couldn’t live with a man who did this. My friend’s husband is the same. Any time I’m at her house with my child, he’ll come home after work and her kids rush to him, scrabbling about in his pockets. He always has some junk he’s picked up on his way home. She’s demented as her house is full of crap the kids play with for two seconds and discard. He also buys a ton of food they can’t possibly get through, or random bargains of food they don’t want.

I simply couldn’t live like that.

I think you just need to reprogramme your DH into an “experiences” vs stuff man. So he should take them to activities, the quirkier the better and take a photo and make an album, but avoid buying stuff!
So lots of trips to beach, cinema, ice skating, forest, toasting marshmallows, baking/cookie making etc etc - use recyclables at home to make things. There are loads of insta and websites he can follow for ideas.

This works for both my 7 yr old and the cardboard boxes my husband cannot seem to throw out. The man loves a good box

My mum had hoarding tendencies. I had a box on top of my wardrobe where I'd put things that she hadn't used or even looked at for decades (we lived together). If she hadn't missed them in a certain timeframe I got rid of them. She never once missed any of those things. Completely oblivious. You could try this with the 7 year old.

Could you calculate the cost of some of the stuff and present it to your husband? Like "just the things in this box cost over £300"? and point out what could have been done with that money?

Try to keep anything that might be valuable in the future - I know it's hard to predict, but I see things selling for crazy prices that I used to have as a kid. I know you can't keep everything though.

This. Don’t put the children in the middle. It’s for you and DH to sort out. You can speak to your children about waste, landfill etc and explain why you disagree with dad but mustn’t put ANY pressure on them

@Bloodyscrooge how much time does he spend with DC, and what is he doing if he is not with them? Why does he snap at them?

Sorry, but this x million. This was quite an uncomfortable read.

I appreciate it may be hard to step back and see it when you're in it but doing this is putting your adult disagreement onto your children to solve.

I realise this is stark but what I see happening is as below:

You "don't want to keep nagging" so you're putting something very difficult onto your children (the tortured look in the eyes of the one who tries to please you) as an alternative to your discomfort that you would feel trying to get your husband to listen to you.

I think you either need to risk a proper fall out with your husband if it's worth it, or file it under, "slightly annoying things my spouse does that will never change so I may as well embrace".

Personally I'd choose the latter and have a regular system of tidying all things that haven't been used in ages into a box and hiding it somewhere for 6 months. If children haven't asked for it in that time, they never will and you can get rid. Keep practising the message of giving and donating at the same time with single items so they work the muscle!

Yes, I think so. You can stop history repeating itself though.

You could enlist your husband to tidy up and declutter. When he feels how much effort it has taken and sees how nice it is he may stop buying for a while. It may be a cycle that has to be repeated a few times.

I have a similar problem and apparently I can’t tell him to stop. At one point he was taking dd to the shops and cafe both Saturday and Sunday. Both days he was buying a magazine for her (with all the associated plastic tat), chocolates, sweets and ice cream. Once he bought her an ice cream in the cafe then another for the way home. It got to the point I couldn’t take her to the shop as she’d tantrum when I said no. Yesterday, we were at a fair. She had a turn on a tombola. And didn’t get a prize. Oh well, you don’t win everything (and she’d already won elsewhere). Ten minutes later I realise she and dp are back and he’s letting her have multiple goes until she wins. There was no need. She’d got over her disappointment and had been distracted elsewhere. He didn’t need to take her back again.

And don’t get me started on the amount of junk food he hides in his den and sneaks to her with the words “Don’t tell mum!” Treats are fine. Multiple times a day (to the point she then won’t eat dinner) are not.

I agree- would be fine with a book. Also something like a small lego set will be incorporated into a big box of lego so it wouldn't be extra junk that can't be sorted. It's the indiscriminate buying that needs to stop, from his end. And environmental impact wise if it's second hand its not bringing new junk into the world.
He definitely needs to be more responsible for the whole picture- sorting and passing on unwanted things and tidying up in general. It's hard to tell without the whole picture- you could be trying to impose an obsessively minimalist lifestyle on your family or if he's a crazy over-buyer with no boundaries.

Interested in your comment about him snapping at them. Does he buy them gifts to alleviate his guilt over that? And how’s your relationship with him?

Vipers or not, there’s a lot of good observations on this thread. I personally think that your discomfort over giving things away because it upsets your kids is just as big a problem as your husband buying them in the first place.

Tell him it’s making him look as if he's trying to buy his children's love. It’s sad really.

And even the OP’s response on this thread ie calling us vipers for goodness sakes! Would indicate that there are issues in both sides that need to be addressed

Are you always this controlling?
.you want to control your children's interactions with their dad in something entirely non harmful.

Can you have a good look at this part of your personality?

If it’s “lain discarded for months” would your child even notice it’s gone? Why hve a conversation about giving it away, just take it.

If he still persists, could he be directed into buying accessories or bits for something they already have and use (like Lego). Also, pre-Christmas, and ASAP, why not do a ruthless trawl through the kids' clothes and toys using the keep/donate/bin method, but WITH your husband. Let him actually appreciate how much excess stuff they have, and how much outgrown or unused stuff is being given away, that cost good money out of your household income. I know you said you can afford it, but that money could go towards a family holiday, or even something long term, like upping mortgage payments or pension contributions. At the very least, if he insists on treats, try to make it experiences (bowling, ice-skating, whatever) instead of more STUFF. Honestly, reading some threads on MN about spendthrift men, there was something to be said for the Victorian system of the man giving his wife his pay packet, she budgeted for the family and just gave him pocket money back...🤣

Would encouraging your DH to put the money towards experiences and days out for the DC be an option? Annual membership to a nearby zoo type of thing. That way he still gets to treat the kids and you don't have the tat cluttering your house.

The lack of his time and his snapping is the bigger issue.

I would ask him why he feels the need to constantly buy stuff. Whether he feels he needs to buy their love, does he feel guilty for lack of time etc, how confident does he feel as a parent.

Discuss these things calmly. Ask what he thinks his kids most want from him. How he feels when he snaps.

Suggest some things he can do with them.

They're not responsible for managing his behavior, but they will grow into people responsible for managing their own wants and expectations. The sooner they learn how to do this, the better. It's good to learn how to say No even to desirable things.

You do know children aren't adults, right? They [...] don't get to decide how much stuff they can keep in the house.

This.
You don't ask a 7 year old about giving away stuff - you just sort it and dispose of it. Especially if it is crap like half-used sticker books and broken plastic tat.

For the proper toys which are still in good condition, you might ask him about donating something occasionally, say once a month, so that the idea gradually sinks in.
You can also bag up the good stuff and put in a cupboard, or in the loft if you have one, for six months and see if he misses or asks for a specific thing. If he does, tell him you will search for it, then next day retrieve it without letting him see the bag. If not, donate the bag after six months.

It is your job to tidy and sort and dispose of their stuff. They are of an age that you should be 'helping them' tidy, teaching them tidy habits, but the decisions over disposal are all yours.

This with bells on. You’re messing with your own child’s head for your own benefit. FFS, give your head a wobble and realise how wrong this is!

You need to address this with your DH. Start by piling up all the crap that gets discarded by the children, all the broken stuff, games and toys with bits missing, everything and anything that they no longer want/use/need and point out that it is all destined for landfill …..pretty much all plastic toys are uncyclable! Then estimate the cost and simulate that to a holiday, special day out for the family etc.
He is an adult, same as you, and it is not the children’s responsibility to be saying “but dad, we don’t want it”!

Maybe he felt deprived of such things when he was growing up and this is his way of compensating?
Also, why not look at all the toys, games etc as a family and decide what could be donated to a toy bank, surely they aren’t all damaged and Leading up to Christmas they’ll soon be snapped up and no doubt loved by a child who has next to nothing.