Time to get over blaming parents

That said both my great grannies were apparently nightmares but they were literally Victorians so think we can move on !

100% agree with you

Theres a thread on here at the moment about being given UPFs as children years ago and what a failing their parents were and theres a poster on there who emphatically denies that their child will be critical of them when they're an adult.

Talk about in for a shock!!

I hate that poem. So negative and awful. My parents didn’t “fuck me up” and neither did my parents parents. All lovely people doing their best - not perfect but who is.

Are you saying the way you were brought up is exactly the same as you brought up / are bringing up yours ? I'd guess no as things change across the generations and what your parents worried about for you is surely very different to your own ?

Do you think so? I'm 40 and always curious about continuity and change, I feel like we're so often told that things are really the same as they ever were, but I'm not sure. I suppose there is no way to really know, but the best way to get close is to ask those who were around for longer

Fair enough! I am overly.literal some times. 🙂

As remember this poem was published in 1971 , nearly 55 years ago , different times .

I think the poem has elements of truth based on the fact that no-one is perfect and when we become parents we are really just winging it . As I said I had a good childhood , no abuse etc .
What the poem is basically saying is that parenting is partly passed on, the good bits and the not so good . And for some we can learn from our own parents how to replicate bringing up a child or not if someone's childhood was not so good .
I think you are being quite literal about the poem , in life we make good choices and sometimes not so good and those chooses can be because of our upbringing which in parts is determined by our parents ( or caregivers ) own experience of their own childhood .
Philip Larkin was trying to say its ongoing the good and the bad and if you have a problem with that , stop it by not having children .
It's quite a deep poem if you really think about it .

I see you know the type. upper middle class. professional jobs. pillars of the community. active in the church. school governors. Never was there a collection or charity that they hadn't been seen to give to.
But behind closed doors: cold, coercive, manipulative, and always the threat of violence behind their demands for compliance.

I think the current thinking is gone even beyond blaming parents. Its also shouldering massive responsibilities as parents and being very self critical, and also judgmental about others. We don't just accept the cards life dealt us anymore. I had a poorly behaved young child, I spent my life apologising and feeling so ashamed that I was failing as a parent, I felt I was judged all the time but I see how the harshest judge was me. I work with children now and I see it over and over again with mothers, they question where they are going wrong, they immediately blame themselves. If child is anxious, or clingy, or boisterous, or too quiet or too chatty or anything really that is a bit of an issue, they immediately assume they are doing it all wrong. In a way it's a bit of a God complex. We are just people who birthed people, why do we think we are responsible for it all? so much of a person's character is innate and the society will live in moulds us. Family is obviously very important too but it isn't everything.

I agree, none of us are perfect. My parents certainly weren't but like us all they were of their time. I always felt loved and secure at home. I also know they were doing the best they could.
That doesn't mean that each generation shouldn't try to do better than the one before but I don't think adults should blame their parents for everything wrong in their lives.

I don’t think I was the best parent to my older kids (I have a younger one who was born when the older ones were teens), though I certainly did my best at all times. Likewise, my parents let me down plenty of times in my childhood and also as an adult. Now I’m middle aged I completely agree with you OP: no one is perfect and most people do their best, with the emotional tools and baggage they have. I love my parents and am grateful to them. I hope my children will extend the same understanding to my failings.

May I ask why? If I believed that poem, I wouldn't have any and risk handing on misery.

Yes I did and they have now had their own .

Whoops sorry I didn't fully read your post and have quoted and shown the poem !
Great minds .

Did you have kids @WinterBerry40?

Yep and often these type of fuckers appear so wonderful as they actively perform and deceive anyone watching publicly.

I haven't get read the whole post but there is a poem by Philip Larkin that comes into my head whenever I see posts like this .
To a degree I can see some truth in it and whilst I had a good childhood with parents that loved me , I think we can all think of occasions when it might not have been so idyllic .
Sorry to those that had a hard time .
Here it is .

They fuck you up, your mum and dad.

They may not mean to, but they do.

They fill you with the faults they had
And add some extra, just for you.

But they were fucked up in their turn
By fools in old-style hats and coats,

Who half the time were soppy-stern
And half at one another’s throats.

Man hands on misery to man.
It deepens like a coastal shelf.
Get out as early as you can,
And don’t have any kids yourself.

Define abuse OP?

My mother was and would continue, if i wasn't NC, to be very emotionally abusive towards me. It was very middle class abuse, so always a nice warm house and an expensive roof above my head and food on the table, and little very physical violence (certainly no more than was common then). But she really messed me up and it has taken me years to come to terms with and i will never recover completely as my life and relationships are defined by it.

I can however forgive my dad, he was a bit useless, chose to ignore my mother's behaviour, and on occasions actively enabled her/ joined in, but times were different then and if he had taken a stance and left her, in the late 80s/ early 90s when he was by far the main breadwinner (my mother was a SAHM until i was 9 then very part time minimum wage after, DF earned 6 figures), he would have had EOW at best and my childhood would have been far far worse.

If my mother could gain ANY insight into her behaviour, let alone treat me with just a degree of basic respect, I'd forgive her, or at least work with it, afterall we are all preprogrammed to want motherly love. My mother's childhood was hardly ideal and it's easy to see where many of her issues came from, but that doesn't change the way she treated/ seeks to continue to treat me and the harm this does, i have a right to protect myself and my mental health. Also, she is only getting worse and harder work with age since i went NC 7 years ago (i get exasperated updates from my Aunty).

Oh and I'm terrified of getting it wrong with my own DD, absolutely terrified!!

My parent hit me and allowed other adults to hit me (teachers, in a religious school where corporal punishment was still used liberally).
They allowed an older sibling to bully me for years
They indoctrinated me into their religion and forced me to continue to practice that religion when I no longer believed it as a teenager, also under threat of violence.
They sent me to the worst available schools because their convenience and religion took precedence over my education and wellbeing.
As a young child they moved us to a country in which the climate aggravated my (known) health condition. There were two occasions when I was so ill, I should've been moved to intensive care, but they'd left it so late they couldn't risk moving me. Other health conditions they dismissed when I was a child were identified and diagnosed when I was an adult.
They put me in harm's way and kept me there for 18 years. If you wanted to destroy a person - their health, their sanity, their future - you wouldn't behave any differently.

Do I blame them? Fuck, yes. Will they go to their graves unforgiven? again, yes.