To say that women look bloody weird ….

This is all up for a reasonable debate and had the op posted in this manner - I don't think they would necessarily be getting for much backlash. But the fact is they did not. The post was bitchy and nasty and they should be called out for it.

How is making women feel rubbish about themselves because they've decided to have a procedure going to advance feminism or address the fact that so many feel the need to do this. This in my opinion is completely unacceptable and will not help at all.

Totally agree with you, I frequently have to check myself not to stare at how some women look like a balloon with a drawn on face. I think older women who have aged naturally but well are beautiful.

Botox to get rid of elevenses etc I can see is fine as it means you stop looking worried or angry. Its the bursting lips and fillers that do look weird and obvious and that's just a fact. You can tell straight away. If that's the look people are going for that's totally fine but like someone who is trans, most people can tell its not natural. But presumably the person who has had the fillers etc done knows that.

There must be a word for that thing where people line up to tell women what they should do, how they should feel about their own bodies, and how they're allowed to spend their own money they earned... all so they can be good, obedient girls. It's on the tip of my tongue. Miso-something, wasn't it? Sounds like a lovely Japanese soup, but I'm fairly sure it isn't.

It's not women bashing to point out that it's wrong and weird to inject poison and plastic into your face. Women who criticise this are criticising not individual women, but a culture that pressurises young women into thinking any of this is normal. It's not normal, and it looks uncanny, and that does affect us all. Facial expressions are essential for proper human interaction and for babies to get feedback from their mothers. Women who get these treatments are financially and visibly supporting a culture that cannibalises them. Call me judgemental and mean for acknowledging this truth if you like, I don't care. It is what's happening.
In the words of Gail Dines, imagine how many billion dollar businesses would fold instantly if women all just woke up one morning and decided that actually, we're satisfied with how we look. We are fed insecurity every day and then these businesses sell us the "solution", often at real physical, emotional and spiritual cost to us.

You're very welcome!

Thanks for that enlightened input.

I agree with you 100%. I hate the duck lips (when they just get the top done) and the trout pout. What on earth do they not see when they look in the mirror???

Why do women get cosmetic procedures, do you think?

When I see 40- and 50-somethings do it, sorry not sorry but I feel sadness mixed with a bit of contempt. Like I said I know what being insecure about one's looks feels like. You're meant to grow out of that. You're meant to realise that there are a million more important things than your looks (particularly when it coems to what you spend your money on). The penny should have dropped that these beauty standards are a misogynist scam and can go fuck themselves. You're meant to have learned to love your face and its signs of aging for what they are. You're meant to be mature enough not to want to compete with 20-somethings (who will always look younger than you).

So, you think the answer to removing the judgement of women's aging and to promote natural aging is to look at people with "contempt" and tell them what they are meant to be doing eh?

Wow- sounds like that will work a charm- that strategy worked super well for people who are overweight didnt it?

I agree. Im in my 50s and people are starting to have a few tweaks here and there. There is pressure to look a certain way and its depressing. What's the saying...comparison is the theif of joy. I don't really want to be the oldest looking just because all my friends have had plastic surgery. But I suppose that's the way things are going.

And is it for the male gaze?

(One thing I will never do is criticise other women about how they look with Botox etc, though. It's not the point. I don't care how they look. I am, however, extremely happy with how I look - even though I objectively look older than I did 20 years ago, when I was much less happy with how I looked...)

No, it's not, it's actually questioning why women feel the need to look a certain way to not be judged

LOL what bollocks. If the OP had merely questioned why cosmetic procedures exist then maybe, but she specifically said everyone looks "weird"- therefore she is just as guilty as judging and no better than anyone else

I'm always amazed that MN is so pro-Botox, tweakments, cosmetic surgery etc, given that its demographic is so eager to proclaim itself feminist at every other opportunity. The plastic surgery and Botox industries are fundamentally misogynist in that their existence is based on reinforcing sexist beauty standards and extracting money from women who then feel they need to live up to them.

I feel sad in different ways when I see younger and older women pump shit into their face. When I see 20-somethings do it, it's honestly a bit devastating - they have so little need of anything to enhance their looks, but at the same time I remember how insecure I was at that age and how I rarely felt as gorgeous as, looking back at old photos, I actually was. I thought society would have progressed a bit further in terms of young women not being judged on their looks by now.

When I see 40- and 50-somethings do it, sorry not sorry but I feel sadness mixed with a bit of contempt. Like I said I know what being insecure about one's looks feels like. You're meant to grow out of that. You're meant to realise that there are a million more important things than your looks (particularly when it coems to what you spend your money on). The penny should have dropped that these beauty standards are a misogynist scam and can go fuck themselves. You're meant to have learned to love your face and its signs of aging for what they are. You're meant to be mature enough not to want to compete with 20-somethings (who will always look younger than you).

And the cost! I've seen the prices. I'm not into skincare serums but if people want those as a little treat to make themselves feel better, fair enough. But the sums people spend on shit like Botox just make me think they must be incredibly self-absorbed - of all the things in the world they prioritise that? It could never be me.

And our girls

Thanks OP- could you post a photo of your face so we can see a "non-weird" one please? I am sure it would benefit us all to see what we should be aiming for.

Photo?

How you must suffer 😂

Yeah its a shame when beautiful woman take it too far but at the same time i find it fucking annoying when people assume ive had stuff done just because i look a bit younger than my age and my lips are naturally full. Think we should go back to if we have nothing nice to say dont say it at all.

Not to be judged???? Are you kidding 🤣 Missed the bit where the OP was not judging. Turns out they will be judged anyway. Lose lose.

This and Mumsnet would take this thread down if they had any decency.

It's all a huge con to get money out of women. If the surgeons were responsible they wouldn't offer these procedures to people who are showing no more than the natural signs of ageing, or have 'normal' lips but want exaggerated ones.

I'm not against cosmetic surgery where someone has a feature that is outside typical parameters and wants it brought within typical parameters because it's making them unhappy or causing physical pain, but it shouldn't be offered for the reverse reason - where someone looks typical and feels healthy but wants to look more 'beautiful'. It often doesn't work and people lose sight of what a face/body should look like, leading to repeated cycles of surgery, and the patient eventually looking grossly distorted and ridiculous.

Surgeons who do this are irresponsible.

No, it's not, it's actually questioning why women feel the need to look a certain way to not be judged.

There are a number of women in my workplace that have had botox and fillers (most also have russian lashes) & it is very obviously not natural in many cases. I don't think they want it to look natural though?

Its a very specific look but if it makes people happy I really don't care as it has no impact on my life whatsoever.

They may be eyeing up those of us that haven't had anything cosmetic done and take pity at my sagging jowls and crows feet.

I do agree it hits a bit differently when very young women overdo the treatments as it can change a perfectly lovely face into a mask with no expression.

A bit of an overdramatic parting call there, as I said, you do you, but be realistic regarding how natural all this work actually always looks.