To say that women look bloody weird ….

Nah, I don't know about during her appearance on I'm a Celeb but I was watching an ep of her podcast the other day and she had a lot of the facial paralysis thing, I guess Botox-induced. I wondered if she looks that all the time but maybe she'd just had it done. Perhaps in preparation to go into the jungle.

I was going to say the same, We've been to France, Amsterdam, Barcelona and Munich recently and you just don't see this in those countries. The only time we saw the big eyebrows, big lips, hair extensions and loads of make up was on British tourists. They seem much more natural over there.

A few acquaintances have obviously had Botox and/or filler. Yes, they look younger but for me it's the lack of expression that I find difficult. The subtle non verbal communication signals that people use is missing, makes them appear quite robotic and lacking in personality although they are probably not at all like that. I understand that people want to look and feel good but in my opinion, an expressive face is always more attractive. I hope it's a trend that dies off as my daughter gets older.

OP is commenting on women actively making a choice to inject botox in their faces thinking they will look better. I agree @GoingbackwardsForwards it looks weird. A new trend in the US is the maga look when you are supposed to looks weird.

I will add that I watch a lot of German content, while there are obviously some folk who get 'work' it's definitely less of a trend than in some parts of the UK.

There is a huge difference in Tv/film work about what is looked for in men and women. There’s continual outcry that women’s presenting career ends earlier than men’s due to their appearance. This drives women to have work done for the wrong reasons. Then they are on TV shows which starts making the public feel this is how it is.
Absolutely an individual can do what they like to themselves but I also struggle with how unfair it always is. Men are seen as aging handsomely and women get ugly as they age and need to stay youthful.

I have regular botox in four spots, lip and dermal fillers, a full breast redesign (not just implants), permanent makeup, veneers, lash extensions, and a seven-hour grey-covering hair colouring procedure every 4 months. And somehow… no one has ever clocked any of it. Some women ask if my lashes are natural, i guess they are noticing the shed-and-refill cycle - and immediately ask for my technician's details.

My last ex was genuinely proud of my "natural beauty," always saying how fresh and young I looked straight out of the shower in jeans and a T-shirt, attributed it to clean eating and good exercise (which I do). He was vehemently against any surgery or hardcore cosmetic improvements, and I just didn’t have the heart to tell him he was admiring the combined efforts of half the aesthetic industry... only if he saw the service log.

It really is all about proportion. When you get the balance right, no one notices a thing.

I can no longer watch anything with Nicole Kidman in for this reason.

It's a shame that everyone is so reluctant to have the conversation about embracing natural ageing/looks and this expectation or pressure for women to do this to themselves.

There's a lot of money in the beauty industry and it is quite insidious how it relies on women feeling insecure about how they look.

But you have launched a vitriolic attack on other women? And one solely based on appearances to make it worse. You can’t claim a moral high ground here

Nah, he would still be considered extreme.

It’s a shame as most looked better before. I’d say fine to have subtle work, but some go too far.
I know people who have had Botox and it is quite obvious but they don’t have that ‘alien’ look.

I do hate the pressure to conform so if you don’t look a certain way you won’t get roles/jobs/followers etc.

I have two thoughts:

1. It is none of my business what others do, and wouldn't ever offer a random opinion when not asked.
2. Botox, fillers etc are pretty much always obvious, and I do feel sorry for anyone who feels they have to change their face just to be accepted.

But it does affect other women, especially young women, who are spending money on it and using dodgy sources of injectables to get ‘the look’. Watching films from just 15 years ago, women looked more normal.

This does not make any sense. Why would a woman with Botox, fillers and the like tell another woman with Botox etc that she looked awful? To do so she would have to break out of her own denial and acknowledge that she too looks awful. That’s why it ain’t happening, not because it looks nice.

As for the rest of us being jealous: we have a choice. Grow old gracefully or get work done. I personally prefer to accept the ageing process and allow my face to do what it will do as I age. Growing older isn’t easy but IMO surgery, Botox and fillers look worse than the ageing process.

Sorry your ability to count is so poor. You could use your fingers to assist you, at a pinch.

It's a person - usually female - whose face is so destroyed by unnecessary procedures they look like a robot designed for the pornsick, or a space alien. A person who no longer looks like a normal human, but pathetic, desperate and freakish.

But you already know that :)

Jealous! Most of us are too polite to tell someone what we really think about the results of their procedures. I've known two people to have work done. The first was the seller of a house I viewed and honestly all I can remember about the visit was those lips because it was the first time I had seen anything like it in real life. Ridiculous. I have a family member who's had botox and fillers and honestly my first thoughts when I saw her new face on IG was that she looked so puffy and shiny she looked like someone unwell with heart failure or kidney disease but I would never say this to her.

Absolutely, I think you've hit the nail directly on the head there. It's absolutely narcissism and sadly it's an "acceptable" brand as it's usually flaunted under the flag of "Be Kind".

Quite. There is an implicit level of narcissism to assume people are jealous of your choices.

It's a very school playground kind of argument.

"She doesn't like me so she must be jealous of me."

Or the fact in childhood some parents have told their children that the reason a peer doesn't like them is down to jealousy, in order to spare their young feelings. This kind of belief perpetuates throughout life in some people, despite the actual reasoning for jealousy never making sense. It's a way for these people to self soothe; I don't believe they know they're doing it, but it's a mindset that's deeply entrenched.

Very possible that the people who say it are deeply jealous people themselves, and so they're projecting that out on to others who are more stable in their emotions. It's a way to dismiss legitimate comments and questions so that they don't need to examine their own behaviours.

i would like to be like kiera knightly who has clearly had some kind of neck work and famously does plump her lips but looks great with other wrinkles going on. But I'm guessing that look doesn't come cheap!

But we are supposedly jealous if we dont do it we are told

I've lost count how many times she's written 'pornbot space alien' .

Few people set out to look ridiculous so either the procedure has gone wrong or they are delusional and have lost all perspective of how they appear to others. I see it as big badge of low self esteem and just feel a bit sorry for them that they felt the need to do that to themselves.

I agree with you. It's such an odd accusation - why would I be jealous of people who need to inject toxins into their face to feel happy. It would be like being jealous of people who need antidepressants to live a normal life.

It's not a look I particularly like but each to their own. I've never had botox or anything but did have Invisalign to improve my teeth and it made me feel so much better about myself so can see why people do it.

I do wonder how people afford it though, these things are so expensive!