AIBU to be so shaken and upset by this WhatsApp message from my ex-husband?

I would help you do this. It's taken me nearly 3 years to get to the point where I no longer justify, argue, defend or explain. It still takes restraint, but I can do it. Getting out of that cycle was SO hard.

One day I'm going to figure out how to create training materials for women who are in relationships, or have been in relationships, with these sort of men.

The materials are going to be about giving women the tools to look at the situation objectively, without the gaslighting /Darvo commentary in their heads from these men, while simultaneously adjusting for the irrationality/disordered thinking that these men display. Maybe I'll have to use AI to do it!

So, for example, in this case. As can be seen from this thread, an objective outsider view is that a) John is old enough to stay at home alone if he's happy to do so and b) John did not miss any school, nor did he get up so early his sleep was hugely disrupted so it's a total non event.

But becuase you've had years of emotional abuse and manipulation, including after you seperated, you didn't see that. You questioned yourself. Then you thought about explaining yourself while also attempting to tell him why he was wrong/inappropriate, even knowing that he'd never take that on board.

NONE of that is your fault. But we have to find ways to help people (mostly women) break these patterns. A sort of "break the emotional abuse pattern" version of the Fair Play cards that get talked about on here re household tasks!

And, as also seen on this thread, my AI-generated training materials/cards, need to also provide support and objective view points for when family/friends don't see/understand the abuse and therefore inadvertently make it worse by making the victim question themselves/their responses etc.

My MIL, now that she's finally seen the way exBIL does this, is brilliant. She doesn't challenge him, she doesn't debate with him, she doesn't argue with him - she just laughs at him and walks away. It must drive him MAD becuase for many years, his abuse of SIL was helped because he was very very good at looking "rational" and "reasonable" to PIL who then, without meaning to, helped him to continue to abuse her.

Ignore. No responses is a response

This. Try not to give it any more headspace @Lilifer.

My ExH wouldn't attend our DD graduation this summer as he would not sit next to me which was wonderful for me as my DM came with me instead we had a fab day. We split up on good terms but when I applied for maintenance he hated me for it. I know going forward at any event I will be ignored. I would not tolerate bullshit from him though just to keep the peace and we haven't spoken for some years. The kids have a tricky relationship with him which is of course my fault - I have barely spoken ten words to the man in years.

All those saying reply to him I think are wrong, you are just pandering to him and giving him power over you. Stop it he doesn't get a say in your life. The maintenance will end soon so that will be the last you will need anything from him. If he does not want to be civil that is on him not you.

I agree with the approach you are taking OP, and look at using the BIFF technique.

This guy may get worse as your ex realises that the control he had is slipping away. At 17 this should be a non issue really. But these types cannot let go. You have to do it for him. Treat him like he’s a bit addled.

I don't think there's a problem with you having a good relationship with his family, in fact I think it's great for your DC that you do. If you want to keep up letting him know when you'll be seeing his mum to avoid awkwardness, I don't see a problem with that. But your relationships with them are none of his business. Hopefully you aren't sending him pictures and updates when you see them.

I'm sure you are enemy #1, but it's also about control. And you do admit (rightly) that it was and will always be thus. This is why I wrote my post upthread Yesterday @ 15:08. So, my advice (again) is to stop allowing him into your relationship with the DC by 'reporting' to him with information and pictures. It's not helping things now and won't affect things in the future, so why bother. Especially with your youngest turning 18 soon. And I use the word 'reporting' because I'm sure he feels that you need to report everything with the DC to him. As far as he's concerned he's still the boss of you. Time to show him he is not.

And I agree that keeping it to emails regarding the financial ties is best. It needs to be completely separate from 'family stuff'.

Good idea to limit things to the very occasional business like email. I can see why it irks him that you visit his mother. Maybe you should think about whether seeing her is such a good idea if you genuinely want to move on?

Agree.
You need to cut contact for the sake of your health ... which is much more important than a pendant.

But he doesnt actually have to be in your life anymore, does he?

You dont really even need his number in your phone now. The kids are all old enough to make their own arrangements with him.

If you see him at their events you treat him with polite distance. A simple. "Hello' will do. Talk about what is happening. Dont bother asking how he is because why would you care? If he akss you, answer "Fine" and thats all.

Politeness for the sake of the event/kids sake but no more. He simply shouldnt factor in your thinking anymore. He is irrelevant.

He is just utterly irrelevant to you now. No more, done, gone, zap.

by ‘polite’ at events I suggest you smile and cheerily say ‘oh John hello how are you?’ He starts talking and half a sentence in you interrupt and say cheerfully on polite auto talking to strangers mode ‘well it’s good to see you how are you doing?’ And walk off. Nobody can complain about that 😁 but it does nicely convey don’t give a toss about you.

@Lilifer

know that my response is disproportionate and that’s on me, and something I need to work on. Because we live in a small town, close to each other and are still connected financially till youngest moves out I try and walk a fine balance of being friendly and accommodating but also trying to protect my peace, I post him updates a lot, photos of the kids etc if I’ve met up with them, keep him in the loop, most of the time he doesn’t even acknowledge these messages.

I think that, unknowingly, you are still allowing him to control you. This is the habit of a lifetime of that marriage. You probably don't even see it or know you're doing it. It became instinctive and necessary for your 'survival' when you were living in the same house. But now, you aren't and you should be 100% free. You don't need to tell him when you see the DC, send him pictures, etc etc. They are adults, they can let him know what they're doing. You need to step away from their relationship with their dad.

You're doing this to 'keep the peace' just as you walked on eggshells during your marriage. Thing is, that peace doesn't need 'keeping'. You are divorced. That means you live your life, he lives his. And your DC live theirs.

As far as future events (grads, weddings, etc) why do you think that 'advising' him of goings on now will save one iota of conflict and upset then? There will always be something he can beat you over the head with. And as long as you keep reacting he'll keep doing it. Why? Because he enjoys it!!! He loved abusing and controlling you then, why would you think he doesn't still enjoy it now?

I'm not saying to suddenly go NC with him, that would be too obvious and probably stir up a real shit storm. I'm saying to gradually stop telling him things about the DC. And stop telling him when you're meeting up with DC and FGS stop sending him pictures!! By doing so you are actually inserting him into your relationship with the DC. And I'm sure you don't want him there.

Now that your youngest is about to turn 18, this is the time to start slowly 'disengaging'. If you haven't tried it, counseling can help.

Sometimes I think it’s about putting boundaries in place. It works well for me not to need anything from my ex. He will generally say no or make it look like he is doing me a massive favour. Maybe have a look at the courses woman’s aid offer after controlling relationships. Also your kids are old enough to understand and see for themselves what goes on. Weddings and graduations are rare occasions you don’t need to be his friend just polite.

I’m not blaming you for doing it because it a normal world taking the gift would be the nice thing to do. But in his fucked up world he now had something he sees as being able to hold over you and is probably delighted you ‘owe’ him something for the sake of a tenner postage.

I would avoid asking for anything I could, just so he doesn’t get the satisfaction of being Sir Bountiful (in his demented head!). I would save the favours maybe for when totally desperate until you are not affected by his annoying comments

I'd stick this one up instead 🖕

😂

Ignore it.

When it comes to my ex (in fact, many situations) I ask myself what I want to get out of the conversation, and whether there's anything I could say that would have that effect.

In this case, there's nothing that you want to get out of this conversation, so there's nothing that you should say.

And your son is 17. He's perfectly fine to take you to the train early and stay in the house overnight. He sounds like a good boy, who made sensible choices about doing it early so he didn't miss school, and you got to your appointment. Spot on.

Mine are 15 and 12, and they're fine with me leaving them while I pop out for a couple of hours in the evening - in 2 years time, I'll be completely comfortable leaving them overnight TBH - they're sensible kids, and it's not like we're not always in contact these days! If we have to go somewhere early for one of them (or me) then we do it. The occasional early start doesn't kill them.

Just send him a thumbs up emoji lol. It’ll wind him up.

Not a criticism Op. My husband has a saying don’t let the madness in meaning don’t engage with some people as it’s not worth it. While a perfectly sensible plan to ask to take the gift if he was a normal sensible person I think just not engaging with the pompous idiot at all is best. You are nearly rid of him.