To think a lot of MN are ableist?

Am I missing a point here? It is harder to be disabled than not? This doesn’t mean I don’t have my own struggles- I do and plenty like many others- but they would be even harder if I was disabled. This surely is just “what about me” ism.

And it's utterly appalling.

so true

and trying to turn into a competition is never going to help.

When SOME posters try to derail every thread with a "take my disability then! If you are jealous, you take it" they don't help their side of the argument at all.

Because there is a huge grey area between a totally, fit and able bodied person and someone that is disabled. The threshold is often arbitrary and there will be people either side of it with an awful lot in common.

If you fall under the threshold you are expected to work to fund those below it. You are expected to not complain because your struggles can't possibly be hard as their struggles when actually you may be struggling more in some areas.

It's about being compassionate and empathetic as a society and not assuming that everyone must be experiencing life how you are and therefore must have the same perspective on things as you.

I’m so sorry to hear about the loss of your babies. I’ve had a child on life support too, though he fortunately survived.

What I’m talking about is someone who has no personal experience with a baby or child on life support stating that it should be standard to euthanise all babies who are born with a profound disability without parental consent because caring for them will be too costly for the state.

Very, very different to a loving parent making the difficult decision to remove their baby from life support on the advice of multiple doctors after they have done everything possible in attempt to help the baby survive.

I think what is happening is the country is in dire straits. Not enough working people to support all the services being dished out.

This always happens in society. In times of plenty people are generous to the elderly, weak or disabled.

When resources become scarce (like they are now in the UK) people start looking after their own more and become far less charitable.

I can see all sides. People with disabled kids might be doing the best they can with difficult circumstances. By the same token working people struggling to buy a home of their own don't want to lose more of their income to fund more social care.

I forget what the saying is but something about rats scrapping in a barrel. That's what's happening in the UK and as a reflection here on Mumsnet.

I mean during the COVID and food shortage think did everyone say oh dear I better buy two rolls of toilets rolls and give one to my elderly neighbour but not take any more in case some else also needs toilet roll. No they went to the shop bought 20 packets for their own family and to hell with everyone else.

Not everyone that is disabled is in constant pain. In fact the majority aren't.

Not every able bodies person is in fantastic health and doesn't suffer chronic pain.

The world isn't black and white.

I work long hours and can’t get my nails done but how could I, physically abled and neurotypical, possibly resent someone on pip getting their nails done? I mean, they have their nails but I have all the privileges of not being disabled or in chronic pain. So if anyone should be complaining about unfairness, it isn’t me

There's a lot of posters who just like to stick the knife in ..they don't care what the subject is or who they upset.
And that's always the risk when posting on an internet site , people type things they wouldn't say in real life , probably because they are having a bad day themselves.
I would personally concern yourself with how you and your child are treated in real life
Don't give a second thought to no marks on an internet site with no life other than running other people down .
I used to post about my DC with autism..but I gave up and don't bother any more .

The UK goverment can't make any good decisions about anything.

They try, the public is 'outraged' and so they back down.

We are all just waiting now for complete disorder/civil war when the money runs out and all welfare is stopped.

They did try to have sensible discussions about assisted dying but nothing seems to have come of it

They did try to bring in a tax for elderly social care but nothing came of it.

And so we go on until the money runs out which based on all the news/talk/late date of this years budget might actually be now.

Denmark sounds like a country making good decisions for the good of the entire nation even if sometimes that involves tough choices. The UK goverment is fiddling while Rome burns (and members of the public argue over who's benefits should be cut or not cut whilst not realising that actually there is no money for any benefits)

im sure those poor poor people, working hard, scrimping and saving would much rather be healthy, able bodied, and able to continue doing that, than in constant pain and unable to exist like me.

I've been the healthy bodied parent, struggling for money, to make ends meet, and i'm where i am now, physically disabled, reliant on benefits.. i know which i'd rather be.

The people being resentful need to give their heads a fucking wobble. I'd swap with them any day of the week.

Doctors prescribe adhd medication, not parents

Can you give examples of how the definitions of adhd and autism have broadened over the years please? Where are these new definitions and who has created them? Because I find comments like this also very ableist because you’re implying many people who have been diagnosed (by a qualified, medical professional) do not really have these conditions

The OP started a thread saying that a lot of people on MN are ableist. I am responding to that, not to someone looking for support or advice about themselves or their disabled child. I really, really would like people to be more understanding about disability and therefore I do desperately want to win them over. I’m not interested in hurling insults at people.

Half the time people aren’t understanding the posts they complain about. We leap to assume a motivation which isn’t there, because of our own sensitivities.

We are in a fucked up place as a society and need to find a way through it. That will only happen if we really listen and consider other people’s perspectives. Not to win. Not to change minds. To understand and find compromises.

That works both ways though and there seems an inability by many to accept other people's struggles and why resentment or anger can build.

I have seen posters on here stating that they use their PIP to go to the nail salon and get their nails painted. They stated that they liked their nails to look nice, always had manicured nails before being disabled and this was a totally acceptable use of PIP.

If you're someone that is working all hours of the day, hasn't been to the nail salon in years and doesn't have the time to paint their nails themselves due to work/childcare commitments then this obviously will cause resentment. Your taxes are paying for someone else's luxury.

Any disagreement about PIP being spent on nail salons and other luxuries is wrong was met with cries of ableism rather than even attempting to understand why people that can't afford any luxuries feel angry and bitter about this.

What is the longest possible definition of ableism please?

I think you should work on your reading comprehension. I never said I ask MN to delete posts I don't agree with.

But a child who doesn’t learn boundaries will grow into an adult with no boundaries. His sensory impulses may be childish at 4, but at 24 some of those sensory impulses will be sexual. And those impulses will hurt someone else.

We have to teach boundaries before that happens or yes, without help they will assault someone.

Why should someone who is just looking for a bit of support or advice on a messageboard be concerned with winning hearts and minds? People are responsible for their own ableism, including those with the cognitive abilities to engage in a discussion on the internet, even if they really really don't like being called ableist.

This upsets me so much. We had to turn off life support for our baby boy 2 years ago, his twin died a few days earlier - stillborn. We were told his quality of life would be deplorable. He had a couple of haemorages too, he was 4 days old and likely to die alone in the NICU before we could reach him if we were lucky. I absolutely didnt do this because of money ffs. All I wanted was to bring him home and his brother. But it wasnt right for him. My baby son had multiple organ failure. Disabled didbt even half cover it.

I have never met any parent who was in the NICU who didnt want to bring their baby home no matter what. Id have leapt at the chance no matter how disabled he was. But he was suffering. His last haemorage went to his brain. It was a grade 4

Maybe it's not a good idea to try to get every post you disagree with deleted?

Just not being empathetic to someone’s situation. The i-s-t bit is slung around to shut people up. It alienates people and will never win over hearts and minds.

I think that, when we are under pressure - as we seem to be as a society at present - sympathy/ empathy with others is one of the first things to go. We become protective of ourselves and ‘our people’, and less tolerant to anyone ‘other’.

It is no surprise, therefore, that racism, ablism and ageism are rife, and are more openly expressed. All involve less sympathy towards those who are ‘other’ by virtue of race, disability and age, expressed as a view that they ‘take, or are given, more than their fair share, leaving me short of what I need / would like’ - whereas in fact there is a shortage for everyone, regardless of age, disability or race.

same happens to me a lot. I report posts which are clearly hate speech but more often than not, it doesn't break talk guidelines. Its really shocking. I don't know what happened to MN and the complete change in standards. I vividly remember the fabulous 'this is my child' campaign. this would not happen now.