To think a lot of MN are ableist?

Oh God yes
There's a complete lack of understanding from some people that just because their autistic child is able to learn / do something all autistic children will .

"(also parents of HF children towards parents of LF children who failed to teach their children certain skills.). Some people can't comprehend why my DC (autism + severe learning difficulties) is unable to do X/Y/X simply because there HF and very academic child managed."

Yes
"Autism is no excuse"
"My child understands because I worked hard/ taught them right from wrong"
"They all have to learn"
Etc
From people who should know better.

You are twisting said stats to suit your anti ADHD narrative whilst ignoring the findings and conclusions as a whole from the Taskforce.

I would say that people say ableist because they don't feel listened to. I (not on this thread) have had this discussion many times where I explain lived experience and am shut down and told I just need to learn to cope like other people. I agree that disagreeing is not inherently ableist, but many disabled people are just tired of having to justify their lives and accommodations.

There is a lot of snobbery of those with HF ASD towards the lower functioning end (also parents of HF children towards parents of LF children who failed to teach their children certain skills.). Some people can't comprehend why my DC (autism + severe learning difficulties) is unable to do X/Y/X simply because there HF and very academic child managed.

I've met at least 2 people with the same diagnosis as myself who hold such views. There's a lot of "I manage, why don't you?" It's simple - I struggle because I have other diagnoses they don't

I am quoting statistics from the ADHD Taskforce?

I think we get to the heart of the issue here. How have I been ableist? I want you to specify what exactly I have written that is ableist. I am sick of posters accusing anyone that doesn't agree with them of being ableist. It's a weapon used to shut down debate and stop discussion. Making fake allegations should be treated very very seriously. Disagreement is not discrimination.

No you’re inflating and scaremongering to suit your narrative.

I think I trust the NHS Taskforce rather than a random ableist anti ADHD MNer.

The changes are huge! Required age of onset has almost doubled, you need less symptoms and there is a far greater range of examples.

They're only not being diagnosed at that rate because not everyone that is eligible is attempting to get a diagnosis. If they did and the rate of positive screening continued to increase by 50% then we will be looking at well over 20% of the population potentially having ADHD in a few years.

The forms and info needed for children from schools are lengthy and detailed.

The NHS ADHD Taskforce lists how changes need to be made going forward re the disgraceful set up we currently have in this country.

But they’re not being diagnosed at 13% they’re being under diagnosed from the low global rate.

And the changes aren’t huge.

• Adult-specific examples: The DSM-5 included clarifications and expanded examples of how symptoms manifest in adults, such as losing "things necessary for task activities" like a wallet or keys instead of just toys or school supplies.
• Reduced symptom threshold for adults: For adults (age 17 and older), the number of required symptoms was lowered from six to five to better reflect adult ADHD presentation, according to the National Institutes of Health.
• Increased age of onset: The age by which symptoms must have first appeared was raised from seven to twelve, which helps in the diagnosis of adults who may have had symptoms since childhood but were not diagnosed.
• Clarification of presentations: The DSM-5 replaced the term "subtypes" with "presentations" to describe the various ways ADHD can manifest.
• Co-occurring conditions: A significant change was the removal of the exclusion that prevented a diagnosis of both autism spectrum disorder and ADHD in the same individual, .

It's not a favour to the state. It is caring for your own child which should be the default for all parents. Of course having a disabled child changes the nature of this but it is your child. For the same reason, I think you are your child's advocate and should be in a position to make the best decisions for your child. Not the State. It's hard to argue it all ways. That you have no real responsibility to care for your own child and so if you choose to do so then you are doing the default carer (the State) a favour but then claim that you should have complete autonomy over parenting decisions and being the one that makes the big choices for your child. That's wanting all the power without any responsibility.

For the record though, I absolutely think parents should be supported by the welfare state to care for their children if required. Surely this is what the system is there for? I can't understand anyone arguing otherwise. You are placing parents in an impossible situation.

The criteria absolutely didn't change marginally. That is a complete misrepresentation of the changes that were made.

NHS studies have shown that prevalence is likely to be much higher in the population. The stats here relate to the ASRS screening test but some NHS clinics have a diagnosis conversion rate of over 95% following referral so it could easily follow that around 13% of people could be diagnosed with ADHD. We have seen positive ASRS results shoot up by more than 50% in less than ten years.

https://digital.nhs.uk/data-and-information/publications/statistical/adult-psychiatric-morbidity-survey/survey-of-mental-health-and-wellbeing-england-2023-24/attention-deficit-hyperactivity-disorder

Criteria has been changed marginally to accommodate improved knowledge which is a very good thing. Global rates are still tiny -2-3% in adults.Women and girls previously went completely under the radar with a catastrophic impact on life.

It’s a high threshold to reach and the condition is a massive impact on life.

Absolute rubbish.

The help medication brings is often life changing.

ADHD is under diagnosed and under treated in this country.

www.england.nhs.uk/long-read/report-of-the-independent-adhd-taskforce-part-2/

Just like Nazi Germany. Aktion T4.

@BoredZelda

"No healthcare professional in the field of neurological disability would ever insist someone couldn’t manage their symptoms and could never work. "

This demonstrates complete naivety or wishful thinking on your part.

Fyi, a male nurse specifically told my young relative she would never get into college if she did not take the drugs they were giving her when she wanted to stop taking them herself aged 18. This is one reason I am so angry at how the medical care she has received is turning her into a life-long patient instead of helping her.

Also, if you were following any news over the past 15 years, you might of heard of the transgender epidemic where many healthcare professionals were more than happy to tell distressed young people they needed both drugs and surgery to deal with their mental distress.

The opioid scandal in America is another example where 450,000 people died as a result of Purdue Pharma pushing sales of oxycontin to boost profits regardless of the impact to patients. These people were prescribed oxycontin for too long by doctors they trusted who were doing the bidding of big pharma who fund a lot of training for doctors, nurses and other medical professionals.

Hi Sunsetswimming

there are lots of articles on-line about how dramatically the definition of autism has changed since the fifties to the present day - below is one:

https://azaunited.org/blog/how-the-autism-diagnosis-has-evolved-over-time

ADHD is an umbrella term for a multitude of issues with a multitude of causes and medication is prescribed in ever increasing and alarming numbers for the past few decades with little or no real evidence of it doing the children involved any good in the long-term - it's another social experiment by big pharma.

Below is an interesting video from Sir Ken Robinson who touches on this topic and provides some data which should be of concern to anyone with children.

He starts talking about ADHD at 4 minutes 12 seconds.

@TempestTost
This has already started in the Netherlands with the Groningen protocol.

No one is forcing abortions of disabled fetus' to save taxpayers money though and that is what the poster was advocating.

Killing disabled newborns because they will cost too much money. Parents seemingly not having any say.

This is a pretty inevitable direction given where we are in society now, I think.

I live in Canada, a board of doctors making recommendations recently recommended that MAID (assisted death, ie euthanasia, in this context) be extended to infants. And many people abort a disabled fetus because they think it is too hard on parents and a disabled life isn't worth living. That's not an unusual opinion, it's ubiquitous.

I expect that here in Canada euthanasia of disabled newborns could be a thing in 50 years.

You want me to detail the appalling things my SIL has told me about neglect, blaming mothers, shame and abuse, to you, who seems to think it’s a good thing because due to those things, disabled/ND people don’t impact others as much and it’s cheaper. Jog on and be careful what you wish for.

FFS.

@SlowlyFalling
but how is it actually worse? Concretely?
I mean I’ve heard people say that it’s worse in France too - that beggars belief. I’d like to hear actual factual descriptions, before I believe the Uk is the crème de la creme, best place on earth..!

Not blanket assumptions. My SIL is Chinese, diagnosed as an adult in the UK as autistic, one of her and my brothers children is autistic. Thankfully he was born here. She said she will never go back to China, nor take her children there due to the treatment of autistic people. Shes seen the treatment of disabled people first hand throughout her younger years and in her niece who is autistic that still lives there. It’s fucking horrendous! I think she’d know. To try to say it’s not worse, fuck me, do go away.