To think perhaps my son isn’t autistic but instead modern society is too challenging for him to cope with.

It’s a tricky one - The school system has changed significantly since I was a child, and I was one of those quiet, weird kids that did ok at school, but I still think I would have benefitted from an earlier diagnosis. It would have helped me understand myself better and may well have helped me avoid significant mental health issues in my teens. All three of my children have received diagnoses, and school has worked well for one, been a little tricker for the next, and almost impossible for the third. Whether this is because of their presentation, ability to mask or the school system changes itself is a really hard puzzle to unpick. However, it’s interesting to note that those experiences run from the eldest to youngest, which makes me think there’s some connection that suggests school is getting more difficult for ND children…….. I’d be interested to hear more opinions on this! Thanks OP for starting this thread - I don’t feel it’s a stealth grumble, it could spark a really interesting discussion!!!

Op have a look at Pete Wharmby’s books.
He’s autistic, a former teacher, he has written about how the modern open plan classroom can be much harder for autistic kids to cope with than the more structured Victorian schools that were built so as to minimise distraction.

My niece (NT) is year 2 and at the end of the school week she is knackered. The lessons seem to be intense and she's involved in all sorts of club. I left primary less than 20 years ago and I never remember school being that demanding, nor was there much homework other than the standard spelling, timetables and odd worksheet. I also did a sport to a county level and it wasn't until about y6 when you had to provide big commitment.

My DD showed signs of ADHD/ASD years before she had an ipad or used one of our phones, nor did she use any form of playstation etc.

Give her a book or any form of cosplay/story development and she can focus for ages.

I am not saying electronics are innocent, there is an issue with the development of short attention span in all of us.

But when I look at DH and some of my family members - ADHD/ASD is definitely inherited.

I have been thinking a lot about autism since a lot of diagnosis in my family. As far as I understand it autism is a neurotype, as in a type of brain structure. Neither better nor worse than other types of brain type, and not a disability in itself. However the different circumstances and situations that we put those brains into can become disabling depending on how well it can cope.
Therefore the same person can be more or less ‘disabled’ depending on their situation.
I believe that we will discover more brain types as time goes on. And that what is called ‘autism’ will actually turn out to be several different things that just share common signs and symptoms.

That’s what I thought - so bored of these threads.

I think life in general is harder and more complicated for all including ND people now. A couple of generations ago people all generally ate the same bland food and ate at home rather than eating out. People tended to stay nearer to where they grew up and got a ‘job for life’ doing something fairly repetitive.

I’m not sure why so many are struggling at school. I remember it being noisy and crowded when I went and there wasn’t anyone with noticeably bad attendance. If it’s a small class maybe he is autistic OP? Nothing wrong with that.

My dh best friend was left in the back of a class to do colouring from the age of six and no attention paid. They had classes of kids that were deemed thick because they couldnt spell or do maths more then likely with a learning disability but basically just left to do baby work in second level

I have a neuro-diverse child and his main issue in life is school. He's safe and happy at home so I've had similar thoughts, that he wouldn't need a diagnosis if it wasn't needed to help him get through school. However he would still be autistic/adhd it's just that it's less of a problem at home.
I went to primary school in the 90's and believe I have undiagnosed ADHD (my son takes after me) and believe me it was not easier. Nobody thought to assess me or help me, my teachers just screamed in my face and told my parents I was unteachable because I couldn't pay attention.

Yes of course I don’t mean about private school. If we didn’t have the means to choose private school our general outlook on life is still the same. We don’t do lots of clubs, we spend a lot of time in nature, we love slow unstructured days, we don’t dash about. I know a few parents whose young children seem to be constantly stressed and having meltdowns and all they do is run them around to endless clubs and activities.

Define highly functional

Ageee. Modern life and especially schooling now is like a daily ADOS test if you have ASD.

Unfortunately not everyone has the means to put their child into a private school. But yes your right about the home life, my kids purposely have a slow & calm home life and it does wonders.

@SpinningTops I don't know enough about how your DS struggles to comment on whether he's autistic or not. I think that modern society shines a light on autistic children who would have hidden in the shadows years ago.

There were always going to be the children who were clearly autistic or had ADHD. My DM talks about her school days and describes the kid who was just tied to a chair each day because they couldn't get him to sit still. The kid who was sent to the corner of the room to face the wall because they couldn't understand what to do, etc.

I was an 80s child. I am autistic and have ADHD, only diagnosed in the last year. The signs from childhood were:

• having a lot to say but nobody could understand my speech
• investigated for learning disability because of my speech but was found to have an IQ double my chronological age.
• didn't 'fit' in the classroom
• bullied right from the beginning of my school days.
• school refusal as a young child
• did 'jobs for the teacher' to avoid play time
• precocious reader - I was used as a 'TA' to listen to other children read when it was reading practice time.
• had to be stopped from doing maths so other kids could catch up because I was too far ahead in the text book.
• I read Reader's Digest 'You and Your Rights' for fun when I was 9 or 10. It has 753 pages and I would read it from cover to cover, then start again.
• I wasn't allowed to do times tables tests because I got 100% all the time, so I had to do maths investigations instead.
• in secondary school I'd get into trouble because I knew more than the teachers and we both knew it, but I didn't know that I wasn't meant to show it.

I could go on. My point is that I slipped under the radar. I was seen as unpopular, awkward, quirky.

Now, the pressure is so high on children from the very beginning.

Even so, if your DS has been flagged at this age, go with it. DD2 is now 18. She wasn't flagged by school staff until 9 (I had been raising concerns since 18 months). Diagnosed at 11. Now needing specialist intervention.

Surely at his age you have plenty of control over what his life is like? We purposefully have a slow calm life because that’s the kind of people we are and so our son has the same life.

I do agree about schools in general and that’s why we have ours in private school. The class sizes, noise level, and general chaos in the local school are too much.

Yes, of course. The rush to diagnose people has many benefits though:
1 pharmaceutical intervention & profits
2 individualisation of problems & therapy culture
3 the system can become ever more hierarchical and serve those at the top - the already extrovert and well off

Yes, I'm being sarcastic.

We have moved away from people being seen as assets, to being seen as a burden - every other thread on here is how some old/disabled/'needy' person is a terrible drain on society. If they don't 'add value' to your life ditch 'em.

Teachers used to be trained that everyone is valuable, can learn and contribute, and has a unique set of skills and interests.

Hard to disagree with @Pricelessadvice.

My children’s school is certainly far more sensitive to and set up for different needs than when I was in education, I’m not sure it’s fair to blame schools, which are in my experience an incredibly caring place, but think more about how parenting and the wider world has changed.

And in some cases, those children were better able to cope then. I do think that modern society is far less tolerant of children deviating from an increasingly narrow ideal. Muddling along ok doesn’t seem to be enough any more.

There is a big elephant in the room we are ignoring is the use of screens by young children
Not just phones, but tablets and TV. There is the ability to watch cartoons and videos 24/7 so constant stimulation with flashing lights and bright colours and loud noises.
There is no time for down time or just being bored which can lead to creativity.
Schools have always had tests and assessments (I can remember having end of year tests and reading tests and I started school in the seventies)

I think it’s a complex issue that isn’t necessarily black and white.
-it could be that the levels of neurodiversity in society have always been the same and that modern life has made it harder for everyone to just ‘get on’ because of the overwhelming level of stimulation
-it could be that we are just much better at identifying people who shows signs of neurodiversity
-it could be that modern society is ‘creating’ more neurodiversity through the things we eat and drink, drugs we are putting into our systems etc
-it could be like you say that actually modern life is just really intense and overwhelming and people aren’t actually neurodiverse, we’re just living in a way that doesn’t suit the human brain
or could be a combination of all of the above. Plenty of people chose to live in a quieter way. I cannot live in a city, for example. I’m not diagnosed ND but I find the lights, the noise, the signposts completely unbearable. I need the quiet of the countryside, the one lane roads and dark at night to feel calm and in control.

I stand by the fact that screens have caused a lot of what we know as ADHD. I think the instant gratification does something to the chemicals in the brain and then the person is constantly seeking that same dopamine hit quickly in other aspects of life. If they don’t get that same hit quickly, they get restless and need to move onto something else. It becomes disabling to them as they constantly seek that same hit.
An amazing number of ADHD people (children and adults) can stay focused on screens far longer than on other things. That’s not a coincidence.

Ever think the curriculum is designed for the highly functional, academic ND child and it’s everyone else who has to fit in? People aren’t perfect and they don’t have to be. The most successful children I saw in teaching were the ones whose parents could do the work with them at home to close any gaps and then during the school day they got their heads down and muddled through without taking it too seriously.

I think modern life is horribly stressful for children. I’m not sure if it’s harder for ND children now or in the 80s/ 90s but it’s differently stressful.

I think it’s important that ND is being picked up now, and we shouldn’t dismiss as “it’s just stressful for everyone now” (even though it also is).

I think both things are true, likely he is autistic but would have coped without intervention or diagnosis years ago due to different demands.

I say this as a DM with two diagnosed Autistic children.