Do you think we should life the two child benefit cap?

Raising taxes in order to provide better public services such as better schools and healthcare, and lifting children out of poverty, are GOOD things!

Presumably you want a better NHS? How do you think that can be paid for without raising taxes? The fact that taxes aren't high enough is why we're in this mess.

Only from the right. Normal people would be delighted to see six hundred thousand helpless children lifted out of poverty.

Not for those whose second child turns out to be a multiple birth, as happened in my family. And if you got accidentally pregnant for the third time and didn't have much money, and really wanted the baby, how would you like to be effectively coerced into an abortion because of the cap? It would break your heart.

A caring society puts children and families high on the agenda, like the Scandi countries. We are not a caring society.

Maybe two kids IS plenty, but what about all the children who are already here and who are suffering from the drop in household income caused by the cap? And what about people whose second child turns out to be twins or even triplets? And accidental pregnancies? People should not be forced into abortions that they do not want. That is cruel.

Of course we should. Over 30 percent of children in the UK live below the poverty line, including 18 percent who live in absolute poverty. The two-child cap is an extremely cruel policy.

This is so true. We once had a horse for our only child at a DIY livery £25 a week for stable and field only in 2013. Another horse owner had 4 children, worked for cash in hand, husband worked. 3 of the kiddies had ADHD, one of the daughters rode the pony. They had the full sky package and only went and bought another bloody pony ffs 🤦‍♀️ . Absolutely infuriated me, here we were one child, hubby worked full time, I worked part time, she wasn’t short of money. That PISSED me off big time 😤

I’m honestly not targeting you. But just a personal experience. I’m RC, though don’t practice, so there were loads of big families in my upbringing due to the whole “contraception is a sin” thing. One of my best friends was from a family with 11 children. So she had ten siblings. Mum didn’t work. Dad worked in a factory. They were all brought up in a three bedroom council house. Every single one of them are now professional people with families of their own who are also professionals. Their parents were wonderful people. You shouldn’t judge people by their income. Education is the key to lifting people out of poverty. Those parents were poor but clever and made sure their children read and could count by playing family games with them and taking them all to the library every week. This judging people by their income is insidious and frightening. Some of the thickest people I know are money rich. It’s not something to aspire to.

I live in an area like this. The kids didn't have a chance before the cap. The cap has definitely made some women think about having another child - which, quite frankly if you are on/below the poverty line is a good thing.
I like the Swedish approach to eradicating child poverty, which is giving children from age 1 the same, high quality childcare. Mothers on unemployment benefits and asylum seekers are obligated to put their child in nursery from 12 months, otherwise they get their benefits get sanctioned. It's harsh, but it has worked in levelling the playing field and has one of the lowest disparities of childhood outcomes in the world.

I don’t think it was tbh. The years when I job shared and spent 4.5 days a week with my children were the funniest, most satisfying days of my life. Never a dull moment. I laughed every day. There were times I had to go and count to 100 to deal with their wee moods but I was pretty skint but happy 😊

It won’t be a hard choice for the benefit bashers amongst them though. They’ll be just fine leaving their children to go to work. So at least there’s that.

@Differentforgirls. Wow. Parenting is hard and working mums make a hard choice to leave their children when they go to work.
it is parenting.

See below

Probably for another thread but I think it should be funded. Being a parent who parents full time. It’s better for the children. Rather than letting strangers parent them. Dropping them off first thing then picking them up last thing and putting them to bed isn’t parenting imo.

Yes it should be lifted

why do children need to go without we are not a poor country we are a country where wealth is poorly distributed

Same!

Oh yeah, FSM was at a ridiculously low limit when it moved over from tax credits. I bet a lot of people feel the same way as you.

My son will be Year 6 from next September so would just sneak in for his last primary year but we do a packed lunch due to his limited diet.

@Kirbert2 whilst I think this a good move and should happen, I feel let down. Many years scraping together the pack lunches from what was in the cupboard, going without lunch myself and making sure my girls had theirs because I was just over the threshold for fsm. I worked all week and I worked nights when they went to their dads to get overtime rate.
I don’t believe the two cap should be lifted but this is a move I am in favour of

Same as the improvement in the economy (no one else was aware of it mind you) that allowed Starmer to U turn on Winter Fuel Allowance.

It doesn't matter whether we agree with it or not, Labour are going to Labour and do whatever they want anyway, whether it breaks election promises or not. There is however a ray of sunshine, Starmer said they will drop the cap when the economic situation allows. The economy must be doing really well then, that must surely mean taxes don't need to go up, right, Sir Keir?

I wasn't aware, thank you. I'm glad.

You have me torn between principles and pragmatism OP. Because while my principles rail strongly against forcing disadvantaged people to rely on the charity of the more fortunate, and the thought of less well off people being patronised with cooking lessons and privileged people's cast offs; the pragmatist in me sees that this may well be more helpful to some children living in poverty than a few extra quid in their parents pocket.
However, I'm no expert on child poverty, and those that are feel strongly the cap should be lifted. So I'm happy to bow to their greater knowledge acquired from decades of research on this.

Maybe we should campaign for both?

Ha good for you

😂

@Pumpkinallspiceit is a lot easier to have the headspace to read, cook meals from scratch, research and attend extra curricular groups etc etc if you’re slightly less stressed about where the next meal is coming from/ how to pay the bills.

Um rude much?

I doubt labour will ever be voted in again, declaring this the same week as tax rises will piss a lot of people off, especially with the current public opinion on immigration when most big families are from other countries.
I think a two child cap is reasonable and I say that as someone who was on benefits for years and had a child at 16 (so a complete scrounger 🤣) once or twice fair enough but how did you not learn your lesson the third time??
You can’t expect working taxes payers to fund your platoon of children and not feel resentment, who’s jealous of someone on the dole with a platoon of kids? I’m sure the op could choose to do that herself hell we all could but the economy would crash.
Personally I think free coil fitting centres in every town should be available (I recently found out the place in my town that used to do this has shut and the nearest one is miles away) then there’s no excuse and before you mention twins, twins have always been exempt from this policy