Marriages don’t last anymore because..

Having done that, I have to disagree. There are a lot of things which would not be tolerated any more (not safe in taxis senior managers for example), but I was never spoken to the way young women tell me they are. And hearing young men from the high school up the road when they are walking past is horrifying (they often dont see me if I me bent over weeding the garden). I have never been choked during sex, never asked for anal, never expected to do a lot of things which are presented as standard.

@BoredZelda "Respect for women now is far better than it has ever been."

Really ?

Have you read the Relationship Boards lately ?

There are females being distressed because their husband spends a lot of time watching porn on his phone. Females feeling inadequate because they aren't prepared to engage in the acts seen on porn videos and wanting to know if they are "normal".

Guys getting unpleasant because females won't have a "Home Date" fast enough.

etc etc

I read your original post where you ranted about TikTok and said people don't do working at it any more, and I didn't buy it then. I also don't buy it now.

I also read the post where you seem to believe that divorce is always bad for the children - I didn't buy that one either.

It's complicated, like life. But if the choice is between where we are now and where we were in 1950, I say kick that time machine into a ditch.

"Divorce is easy. No shame or sigma anymore."

I am glad there is now no shame in leaving an abusive partner.

You didn't read my post did you . .

But when one person (often the man) doesn't work as a team but instead resorts to addiction/abuse/violence/infidelity - then what? Keeping off TikTok isn't going to protect women from men who sell themselves as something they are not and who wait until their wife is nicely tied down with kids before showing their true face...

No amount of teamwork can fix a relationship if only one part of the team is doing the work. You and people on this thread like you fail to acknowledge the real problem, which is that as a cohort, men have not adapted to the times we live in now - when women have their own funds, when women are able to live happily and independently, when in short men have to step up, do their share at home and not be lazy gaming obsessed man-children.

What part of my post was confusing?

Two people working together, as a team, wouldn't end up in your grandmother's situation.

I totally get where you’re coming from. My husband has always worked away to a lesser or greater degree and like your mum the day to day childcare etc fell on me. I was a STAHM and pre school depending on where he went and for how long we’d join him. When he was home he was very hands on with the children and does accept he missed out on a lot especially once they started school and it was more difficult to travel with him. In the ex employees case the trip was to Australia to support the onsite team as there was problems.

Not the point of the thread but this blatently bollocks. I had dinner on Thursday with a group of professional women from my work, without exception they continued their professional training including exams with small children. This is a dangerous narrative which encourages women to postpone motherhood to the limits of their fertility window. There is actually a good argument to get on with it, so you can be hitting your stride in your late 30's/early 40's unencumbered with small children.

alot of women are no longer stuck financially anymore as we have forged our way into good working careers.

women also have a lot more say and choice now

many years ago only men’s wages were used to calculate mortgages even if the wife worked part time.

also women are getting better at knowing their limits and what they want out of relationships.

men don’t rule the roost anymore as much as they used to although my in laws are a perfect example of why it was such an awful time for wives decades ago and it blows my mind that mil accepts things how the are. She has no say in anything,no backbone and is just quietly in the back ground doing everything while fil grands it around thinking he’s the dogs bollox.
not in my world 🌍

I'm sorry to hear that. I've seen this happen so many times. Even to my own mother but after the second child he changed. So often men will change once they have you, after a marriage or children when they think you are trapped. Then, as you say sometimes they cannot handle the family life they thought they wanted which is very sad for everyone involved.

If we want women to keep taking the risk (because no matter how good he is there is a risk if only a small one) then I believe we have to support them more. If the government was really serious about helping families or increasing the birthrate they would add in more controls to protect women whose "good" partners bail.

I agree having had this exact experience.

I was with the father of my children 8 years (lived with him.for five of those, married for 4) before we had children. I was open about wanting children from day one and he always said he wanted them too.

However, he couldn't cope with the reality of being a parent and how it clipped his wings.
I had no way of knowing that was going to happen & truly thought I had "picked a good one".
I guess he didn't know how he would feel about it either so my point is that it's not as simple as "choosing the right man".

I agree and the birthrate is going down.
The problem, or one of the problems is that men are not showing their true faces before women have children with them. To reduce the risk of this happening and still having future children and humanity would be to improve men.

I take it neither of these comments come from someone who lived through the 70s /80s/90s? Respect for women now is far better than it has ever been. Men always had 24/7 access to porn. It was incredibly easy to get, you could walk into any shop and pick up a magazine and adult video stores were everywhere. As a child of the 80s, even in my tiny, rural area of Scotland, there were always kids who had access to their dad’s porn stash.

The most recent change in some attitudes, spread by the likes of Tate, has nothing to do with porn.

Couples didn’t put in more effort, (whatever that means), women are no longer forced to put up with abusive men.

"But I firmly believe that access to 24/7 porn has greatly increased men's disrespect of women and the impunity with which they express it."

Agree 100%

When women are being portrayed as a collection of body parts for mens' amusement it isn't surprising that some unenlightened men have a bad attitude towards women.
Not only that, but when a women can't meet the standard of "designer body" that these young porn "stars" have, male disillusionment can set in.

And? Doesn’t mean divorce is easy. Amicable divorcees are easier where both parties agree that it’s not working and split things accordingly without hurt feelings getting in the way and/ or there were already agreements made in the event of the marriage breaking down, those that are not amicable, especially when children are involved are definitely not and typically expensive and the one who has the best lawyer (can afford the best lawyer) has a higher chance of winning regardless on the reasons why the marriage failed in the first place.

Plenty of threads here about spouses cheating, really think the loyal spouse should work through it if they don’t want to or the ones involving abuse which a recent study came out showing that courts were STILL failing to protect women and children in when there was evidence of men being abusive to one or both due to pro-contact culture?

Can you quote these studies? I haven't come across one that blames meals on wheels for example for being the reason children don't visit their parents.
Sure, it can make it easier for some children who have another reason not to visit, but I've never seen a study where an adult child says they would love to visit their parents but can't because they are having meals on wheels.
You seem to be interpreting the studies according to your viewpoint.

He’s a Global,HSE director who’s normally home based. The company has offices worldwide. With some time differences it’s not possible to do meetings etc via teams. I guess in some instances it’s not crucial but he feels it supports his team if he visits them in person. He can also get a feel for what’s going on. They have staff on clients site too so he’ll go and see them.
I do agree with you that attitudes have to change after all parenting is a joint responsibility and of that means adopting the Nordic scheme then that’s not a bad thing.

And domestic violence? How do couples fix that together? Women have only been able to have their own mortgages for fifty years. In certain workplaces women were forced to leave their jobs when they got married & poor birth control limited women's choices further.
My clever funny grandmother had to give up her civil service job, never had a penny of her own again, no coat even, never sat to eat a meal, raised her children in her domineering violent husband's home and was not free until he died. No working it out together would have changed that.
Today she would be divorced, if married at all, back at wo rk and running her own household. Why shouldn't women have expectations, and leave if they don't work out? Yo u want them living like my grandmother until their eighties?

Following on from my post, depending on where he travels to I do sometimes go with him so it’s not a case of him wanting not wanting to be at home.

I didn't take that line as literally as that would be the only three good qualities one could name, I read it as "he's fine". As in, could be better looking, could be more charismatic/funnier, could be more intellectual (etc etc) but he's fine. In which case, stay and try and work on things, rather than sacrifice the children on another roll of the dice. If you've been trying to work on things and the best you can say is that the lawn gets mowed, I'd say that falls into the later category of abuse.

Of course it easy, you can just do it online now.

Delusional. Divorce is very far from easy. It is a brave thing to do and hugely stressful.