To Think that Grad & Apprenticeships are now only for Diversity Candidates

And I don't understand why you want so desperately to convince people against all the evidence to the contrary that white people are the real victims of racism and black people are advantaged over them.
But if that's what you really believe, do something about it. Like i said, start your own foundation for white people who are under represented and who have experienced racism due to the colour of their skin. If its the problem you think it is, you'll have no problem providing evidence to funders and the donations will come flooding in.

Can you link to this scheme please?

I could only find a Bank of England social mobility scheme that offered 1 bursary and had a very specific list of eligibility criteria and a household income requirement of £30k. Hardly a similar offering.

At least you now admit that white people ARE being left out and discriminated against. I’m not sure why you think that it’s reassuring that the RAF lost its discrimination case (and I’m not sure how swift it was) - it’s really difficult and expensive to bring cases like this. You appear to have forgotten about the list of other organisations found to have discriminated against white people - MI5, MI6, GCHQ, Aviva etc etc.

Please just stop minimising and denying this is happening when there are so many examples already. I don’t understand why so many people are happy for discrimination based on race as long as it is against white people.

I think you're completely missing the point of Spring Insight weeks. They are not the "real" internships that lead to jobs - which I've never known for banking or consultancy to require diversity to apply for - they are a simple week designed to give people with less likelihood of exposure to what finance is at its broadest sense a bit of a sense of it and encourage them to not be too scared to apply to the real internships. They were only invented to marginally improve application diversity and are incredibly superficial. I don't how it works now but when I was applying to banking internships a long time ago most the annual deadlines for the "real" internships (i.e. 10 weeks over the summer where you do real work) were October each year before the summer they applied to and having also been at the "picking" end of candidates attending a Spring Insight week provided no leg up in terms of getting them except they might have a marginally more polished presentation at interview. If your son couldn't find any to apply to was he just applying too late in the year?

I said in response to a poster saying poor white people would vote Reform because there was no help for them from the BoE, that there were OTHER (in big old capitals too so everyone would know it was a different scheme!) schemes that poor white people could apply to. Its called the social mobility scheme and offers 5 years of support to low income talented young people, from age 16 through to their first job. The people who've benefitted describe it in glowing terms. And yes, there's even help to apply for bursaries up to £5k there too.
But of course that's not going to be good enough for you, is it? Because it's not the exact same thing the black people are getting.
Thing is, the black heritage fund is set up and donated to by people who want to use their donations to help black people.
To get the exact same thing for white people you'd need to set up a white heritage fund. Not sure how you'd sell it to donors though given you'd be hard pushed to show being white meant they were a disadvantaged group. But I'm sure you'd give it your best shot.
And yes, of course I know about the RAF discrimination case. The legal process was followed and the white people won. Which should reassure you that when white people do experience discrimination its dealt with swiftly as unlawful, so at least is not systemic.

Absolute bollocks. I work in this area and the vast majority of our apprentices are white working class.

Try harder.

It's not just unconscious bias, although I believe that exists. It's actual barriers. Women have babies, so are pulled from the workforce. It's why groups have put fought for such stringent maternity protections. Disabled people often need additional accommodations. That's a disadvantage. Poorer families can't afford fee-paying schools that have a gateway to Oxford and then, often, to elite professions. The tide is turning, but slowly. Schemes that fight for equality are just going part of the way to even the playing field. And it is uneven, we can't pretend it isn't.

So maybe you could share these lovely internships that pay an extra £5k for poor white candidates as they don’t seem to be advertised on the B of E internship page?

You appear to be very invested in claiming that it is misinformation but are ignoring all the information you receive contrary to that. I mean the RAF were literally found to be discriminating in court but that’s not good enough for you?

That is literally the topic of the tread.

why? we aren't talking about global scale so why global majority? UK has white majority.

I'm so glad that in my time of applying for jobs there wasn't this EDI insanity so no one ever suspected me in being diversity hire.

Of my firm's last intake of summer interns, out of 12 there were 7 white men, 4 white women and one black woman.

These things are ridiculously competitive. We had 135 applicants for 12 places (we're a professional services firm). All good candidates, many who would have been excellent interns but who got nowhere simply because there were far more applicants than places.

I would hate to think any of the seventy or so white men who didn't get through were begrudging the women their success and thinking they'd only been selected for diversity purposes.

even if it’s unfair it’s no more or less unfair than it’s been for people from global majority backgrounds for years and the balance has to redress somewhere. unlucky for your son but since unconscious bias still exists in spades in banking and consulting etc i’m sure he’ll still find his way.

like the aussie pp, extremely interested in the roles you say your son found which explicitly ban applicants who aren’t from global majority backgrounds etc.

That's exactly the point.

@5128gap is likely to be referring to Migrants and discrimination in the UK - Migration Observatory

but the data here is based on self reported, means perceived, discrimination.

I've seen it more than once - internal vacancy opens up, 5-6 applicants, a few white, one black. After rounds of interviews white person gets the job. Black one starts talking about racial discrimination instantly. If opposite, and it's black person gets a job, no white candidate will ever raise an issue.

As a woman, if I'm treated disfavourably by a man at work, how do I know if he just doesnt like me personally, or its because I'm a woman and he's sexist?
Well firstly, there's patterns of behavioural clues. Language used, attitudes expressed, tone used. Absence of any other reason for the behaviour. Then there's the comparator. Does he treat men the same way? Does he treat other women the same way? If thats a no followed by a yes, then there's a strong indicator its sexism rather than a problem with me generally.
Same with identifying racism.

I have been passed over for promotion and other things that I think are unfair during my working life, but as a white middle class person etc I have never thought it’s anything to do with my identity more that the decision maker has a grudge against me for some inexplicable reason. How do POCs know that the unfairness is because of their racial identity and not like in my situation that some decision makers are just idiots?

That's what I'm asking really. Where are the numbers? Because the only numbers I can find are that 5% of white people, 67% of Asian people and 76% of black people reported they had experienced discrimination at work.
I'm very happy to discuss any new information or evidence that supports your assertion that this has swung the other way. But, it's not unreasonable to want more than "just look at..." without providing anything TO look at.
Unevidenced speculation that supports your position (that white people under report) while simultaneously speculating the opposite about POC ( that they over report or only 'percieve') which i know you didnt personally say, but im probably reasonable to think you agree with, given you don't believe POC experience barriers; isnt conducive to open discussion because it starts from a position of bias.
I understand people don't like the idea of schemes targeted to POC. That couldn't be plainer. However to have the conversation you say you want, it's as important that you remain as open to the idea that white people as a group are not actually suffering detriment as you expect others to be to your claims they are.
At the moment we have figures to suggest that discrimination against POC is a serious problem, and that this isn't the case for white people. Unless you have different figures, it's going to be hard to convince anyone unless you're preaching to the choir.

This smacks of ‘I’m alright, Jack’.

No one has argued for discrimination against Caucasian people. That’s absurd.

As a POC myself I see no need for DEI silliness

I haven’t assumed anything. I know there are people are quite invested in arguing in favour of discrimination against Caucasian people for personal reasons.

Just look at the number of kids now affected by the corporates and government departments discriminating against them. This is an entirely new (in the last 10/15 years) and manufactured issue so obviously it’s getting as it didn’t happen before.

It will clearly be under reported because you can see the reaction elicited for even discussing it. Accusations of ‘right wing race baiting’ etc. even on here. So many people clearly invested in denying it is happening, ignoring it waving away the examples given. It’s quite obvious really.

But how would you suggest addressing it? Because it’s daft to say that a company has to have a certain gender balance or ethnicity balance in a lot of situations. If a construction company thinks they should have brickies 50/50 male and female they’re not going to get anywhere as women aren’t interested in training. Or the Bank of England grad scheme demanding a set number of women / BAME hires if the vast majority of people studying the relevant degree is white men.

Yep, it's the people who say things like 'I don't see colour' or 'I don't care if you're black, brown, blue, purple or yellow' that worry me.

Do people not think unconscious bias exists? I think it does. I think I'm biased against groups, it would be remiss of me not to admit it.

It's not just about graduates.

It's about anyone either looking for a starting career position after college or sixth form. In fact, even jobs for more experienced candidates are discriminating.

Lots of companies use AI to sort through cv's. They don't need to be blind. You can just tell AI to ignore x .

The days of a real live person going through 1000 cv,s have been over For quite a while. Bias is bias, whether its against poc or white people.

Is it just young people being forced into this social experiment? There are very few jobs around anyway. It's ridiculous it's not enough to get good grades.

It's not just young people either. I have also found senior professional roles welcoming applicants only from minority backgrounds etc. I welcome them saying they don't have a white old boys club and anyone can apply. Well, not quite anyone.

link please?