Page 9 | Aibu to try and overturn my son’s permanent exclusion

ThatRealBlueQuoter · 2025-10-20T15:31:54+00:00

So this year me and my 5 children have moved from Birmingham to another town due to domestic violence got my children into school my 15 ds has been through a lot with my ex husband one of the main ones been strangled until he passed and and cracked his head open on a table this I feel is relevant to the permanent exclusion my son has received from the school.On the day my son got permanently excluded him and another lad had been messing about in class as a “joke” this boy has pulled out the chair from under my ds making him fall and bang his head my son has then got up and punched the boy four times in the face,I’m in no way dismissing this behaviour he no’s he done wrong and is very ashamed he told the teacher been hit on the head is a trigger for him he knows he shouldn’t of reacted like that,I went to a meeting after a 5 day exclusion with my son to try and plead his case the headteacher wouldn’t budge and handed me the permanent exclusion letter she basically said my ds is to much of a risk ,I found her to be very dismissive and not understanding at all is this worth appealing?the student who done this to my son received a punishment but I wasn’t allowed to be told what it is,I know he is still attending the school my son will now have to go to a behaviour centre my argument is really that shouldn’t the school at least have offered help anger management etc he only has 9 months left before he leaves it is the first time he has actually enjoyed school now the school are trying to get me to sign a letter and they are saying if I do the permanent exclusion won’t go on my sons record?Im in no way condoning what my son has done,can anyone offer advice

Original poster

ThatRealBlueQuoter · 21/10/2025 08:57

LittleOwl153 · 20/10/2025 18:58

School govenor here who has done far to many exclusion panels in the last year.

So. In my schools your son would get an automatic exclusion for punching someone 4 times. It would class as a serious breach of the behaviour policy.

The next issue is whether it would do harm to others in school staff & students to have him return. I think you could argue here if the victim kid is teasing him that it wouldn't be such an issue. But I personally would be looking at where it happened, who else was watching and their reaction- e.g. fearful yr7s onlooking vs 1 other yr 11 who know them both well. And the impact on any staff who had to deal with the incident.

There is then the issue of SEND and I think you could argue your sons history here assuming school are aware - and thus could mitigate.

Finally there is the issue of his impending public examinations. If by excluding him he would not be able to sit those examinations there is an issue.

That's an appeal. And it would be a fight. My gut instinct going only on what you have said clearly is that I would not seek to overturn the heads decision in this instance.

In terms of what you do now... what are they asking for a signature on? Is it a managed move? I.e. moving your child to a neighbouring school to give him a fresh start? That - if there is a named school that would take him at this point - I would definately consider. I dont know what else they could be asking you to sign.

Your next steps needs to be governed by what your sons aims for the future and and what GCSE's he might get this year - and would be capable of if he took a step back and retried next year. I'd actually contact your local sixth form college who will do GCSE+ which is resits - and see what they suggest he does to get in from next September and reset himself.

Thank you for your information the school want me to sign a letter to agree that I won’t allow my child back at the school and that if I comply it won’t go on his record ?

OP posts:

Leadonmacduffs · 21/10/2025 08:56

ThatRealBlueQuoter · 20/10/2025 16:37

No I haven’t thanks for the idea

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There’s NO WAY he should be in a mainstream school. If my child came home after being violently assaulted I would expect the abuser to be excluded and I would want criminal charges brought against them.
You’re new to the school, so they have no way of knowing if this was entirely out of character or par for the course with your child.
He’ll be better off being managed by adults who are used to this behaviour and can support his needs.

Original poster

ThatRealBlueQuoter · 21/10/2025 08:54

Lightuptheroom · 21/10/2025 08:37

PRU/alternative provision isn't just where they throw the kids no one wants. Unfortunately by punching someone four times in the face your son has found himself in the permanent exclusion part of education. The local authority have to provide him with an education after the 6th day, that's a statutory requirement. Again, unfortunately, his trauma needs etc don't come into this part of the process. You need to contact the school and local authority urgently to be talked through where he is in this process. He's year 11, you need to know what the plan is and help him work through that plan. You're not going to change the schools policy. He's hit someone, therefore that = permanent exclusion. What's happening with the other boy doesn't come into this policy, they don't have to tell you what they are doing with regard to the other child.
I'm a fair access officer. Please ring the local authority and ask them to talk you through this process (local authorities are under pressure all the time to lower permanent exclusion rates) if there is another route then they will tell you about it.

Thank you for your advice and pru surly depends on what area etc it is ?

OP posts:

Original poster

ThatRealBlueQuoter · 21/10/2025 08:52

sittingonabeach · 20/10/2025 20:33

@ThatRealBlueQuoter can you give a timeline of correspondence and meetings since day of incident? Have you been given details yet of the panel meeting?

Yes I have a panel meeting November the 10th they want me to go to the school today to sign a form to say I agree not to let him go to the school again I was told this won’t then show on his file when it’s comes to college etc but that doesn’t make sense

OP posts:

Lightuptheroom · 21/10/2025 08:37

PRU/alternative provision isn't just where they throw the kids no one wants. Unfortunately by punching someone four times in the face your son has found himself in the permanent exclusion part of education. The local authority have to provide him with an education after the 6th day, that's a statutory requirement. Again, unfortunately, his trauma needs etc don't come into this part of the process. You need to contact the school and local authority urgently to be talked through where he is in this process. He's year 11, you need to know what the plan is and help him work through that plan. You're not going to change the schools policy. He's hit someone, therefore that = permanent exclusion. What's happening with the other boy doesn't come into this policy, they don't have to tell you what they are doing with regard to the other child.
I'm a fair access officer. Please ring the local authority and ask them to talk you through this process (local authorities are under pressure all the time to lower permanent exclusion rates) if there is another route then they will tell you about it.

Original poster

ThatRealBlueQuoter · 21/10/2025 08:32

He is nothing like his father who was a cruel,nasty and violent person who used his position as a piller of the community to brainwash his wife and children verbally abuse them daily beat them daily and deny them of the most simple things

OP posts:

coronafiona · 21/10/2025 08:30

How would you feel if he was punched four times?! Schools have to keep all students safe, not just your son.

Original poster

ThatRealBlueQuoter · 21/10/2025 08:29

TheFrendo · 20/10/2025 20:31

I think your son punching the lad who pulled his chair out is reasonable. But, maybe not four times.

I wonder if the school would have excluded him for a single punch? I hope not.

The other lad assaulted your son. I hope he has been excluded.

No exclusion for him his father is a local mp

OP posts:

Original poster

ThatRealBlueQuoter · 21/10/2025 08:26

Mapletree1985 · 20/10/2025 21:22

I don't know anything about behavior centers. Is it possible this might be a good experience for him? Will he get more one-to-one, customized attention?

Maybe I don’t know from what I have been told it’s just somewhere to throw the children who no one wants to deal with my son is worth so much more he messed up he knows and realises this I’m not justifying his actions believe me but surely some support and a chance ? Or maybe I’m not seeing clearly as this is my son

OP posts:

waterrat · 21/10/2025 07:41

@ByMintOtter what a vile thing to say about a child. Yes, children who have witnessed and been victim of violence to struggle to regulate themselves and may be violent if they have had no support. He isn't 'just like his father' -- he is a victim of cruelty and abuse who clearly needs more support.

ProudCat · 21/10/2025 07:26

No chance on appeal.

And your son hasn't been 'written off'. He's been deemed a risk to himself and others. Punching someone four times in the face because they pull your chair away is an unusually (and criminal) extreme response. The school have probably gone down the line that this is the 'honeymoon period' as he's not been there long and so they'd expect to see behaviour deteriorating from this point forward. I think they've probably come to the conclusion that there isn't any room for further deterioration. This is almost certainly linked to a risk assessment (severity x likelihood) and your son (serious assault x very probably going to happen again) is therefore being risk assessed as unsuitable for their setting. They can't offer support they don't have.

RebelliousStick · 21/10/2025 07:05

Exclusions are at an all time high and I think we need to come up with a better solution that involves a great deal of empathy and forward thinking.
Exclusions can easily lead to non-attendance, which can lead to future crime, no employment and a further impact on society.
I think safer school officers are a good idea and certainly clear behaviour policies/prevention. At my son’s school there have been 3 exclusions before Year 2. I looked at the behaviour policy recently. The strategies outlined on there are not followed or even used.
I also think teaching has changed - a lot - over the past 20 years. Years ago as a teacher, I was far more accountable for the behaviour in my class - now the ‘blame’ has shifted onto the children. I don’t think children have actually changed that much, but the way adults diagnose and deal with behaviour certainly has. I can’t remember one exclusion taking place in the school I worked in - over a six year period - despite being in an area of high need.

@ThatRealBlueQuoter Please scrutinise your son’s school behaviour policy before the meeting and look for any instances where policy was not followed. I would also try and find someone to advocate in the meeting with you. Governors/school = school’s best interests. Local Authority = local authority best interests. You/plus I’d definitely look for an advocate who knows the law = your child’s best interests. Don’t be ‘outnumbered’ in the meeting.

Espressosummer · 21/10/2025 06:27

DrearyDiary · 20/10/2025 23:25

I feel like I wandered into an alternate reality.

I what world is being deliberately hurt and embarrassed "the slightest provocation"?

To my mind the first boy was worst, his action was deliberate and premeditated.

OP's son reacted badly in the moment and that needs to be dealt with, but hopefully the "prankster" can learn something too. He won't becuase apparently everyone's going to paint him as an innocent victim

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I don't agree that it was deliberate and premeditated. The OP herself said the lad and her son were messing about together throughout the lesson. Sounds to me like the lad pulled the chair out as part of this messing about. It was stupid and dangerous and he definitely deserves to be punished for it. He did not deserve to be punched 4 times in the head.

I feel like I've wandered into an alternate reality. So many posters seem to completely ignore the OP's own words and have zero understanding of what 2 teen boys messing about is like. Also, so many seem to have no idea of what the word premeditated means.

If I was in that class as a 15 year old girl I would be far more scared of the teen boy who lost his shit so severely that he punched someone 4 times in the head than the idiot who thought it was okay to pull a chair out on the boy he was messing around with.

covilha · 21/10/2025 00:11

NeverDropYourMooncup · 20/10/2025 22:44

The advantage of appealing is that she can request an Independent SEND expert and it's a legal requirement for one to be provided. He can still attend alternative provision in the interim period and benefit from their interventions, the local authority will be fully involved, but the chances of having assessment for trauma and at least two, if not three if you account the deliberate act of the other teenager, separate head injuries are nowhere near as high outside the appeal/independent review process.

It's her legal right to appeal, it doesn't matter whether anybody 'approves' of the decision, it's her legal right and she can and should exercise that right, if nothing else because she and her son will be in a position to be listened to and heard - something that was incredibly unlikely when in such an awful, abusive and dangerous relationship punctuated by daily violence.

It may culminate in a managed move, off site direction or permanent exclusion in any case - but we shouldn't dissuade somebody from wanting to exercise their legal rights in wanting her son's experiences to be heard and acknowledged; something that can be helpful in itself, both for her and her son.

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He will receive help in the PRU.
Legally he has assaulted someone, yes he was pranked but his response goes way beyond limits of self defence.
Judging by his response it seems unlikely this was the first time he has used violence.
Safegauarding Is EVERYONE’S responsibility. This mother needs to understand her son poses a risk to other mother’s children. This is also a legal matter.
The PRU is there to manage and support him, the school can not and is not there for this purpose.
Maybe focus on addressing child’s behaviour in appropriate setting rather than putting him at risk of criminal consequences in one which doesn’t seem appropriate for his current needs?

Unexpectedlysinglemum · 21/10/2025 00:10

You can appeal the exclusion and you should, I believe you can appeal and still go to the behaviour centre if needed/ wanted.

WilfredsPies · 21/10/2025 00:02

abouttogetlynched · 20/10/2025 23:35

I can’t be bothered to post a lengthy response, but violence can be a vicious cycle - not always, but it can, we know this.
Pulling a chair out can be dangerous, but it doesn’t provoke that kind of response. Happened to me at school and I laughed, I don’t have PTSD from it.
I stand by the fact that if my child came home having been repeatedly punched in the face I would be furious regardless, whether the perpetrator had been abused at home or not. I wouldnt tell my DS “Well you kinda deserved it for pulling out his chair.”

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And there are a million kids who got into scuffles at school, had fights in the playground, after school, in the park etc, who also walked away as fine and without ptsd as the child who had a clump. The boy did something shitty, he hopefully learnt not to do it again, especially to the OP’s son. A single punch could have killed him, yes. So could hitting his head on the corner of something because some horrible kid has decided it would be fun to do something stupid.

I stand by the fact that if my child came home having been repeatedly punched in the face I would be furious regardless, whether the perpetrator had been abused at home or not. I wouldnt tell my DS “Well you kinda deserved it for pulling out his chair.” Yeah, I’ve very much got that. I suppose time will tell what the consequences are for that approach.

abouttogetlynched · 20/10/2025 23:46

DrearyDiary · 20/10/2025 23:38

Of course the puncher did wrong, but you'd think it was OK for your DC to deliberately hurt and embarrassed another child? That was nasty and premeditated and I'll bet that child has plenty of potential to be a nasty abuser too.

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Nope, don’t think that’s OK at all, but doesn’t warrant being punched in the face 4 times… victim of DV or not. I agree with the school’s actions and think the puncher needs help that he won’t get by going back to that school.

DrearyDiary · 20/10/2025 23:38

abouttogetlynched · 20/10/2025 23:35

I can’t be bothered to post a lengthy response, but violence can be a vicious cycle - not always, but it can, we know this.
Pulling a chair out can be dangerous, but it doesn’t provoke that kind of response. Happened to me at school and I laughed, I don’t have PTSD from it.
I stand by the fact that if my child came home having been repeatedly punched in the face I would be furious regardless, whether the perpetrator had been abused at home or not. I wouldnt tell my DS “Well you kinda deserved it for pulling out his chair.”

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Of course the puncher did wrong, but you'd think it was OK for your DC to deliberately hurt and embarrassed another child? That was nasty and premeditated and I'll bet that child has plenty of potential to be a nasty abuser too.

abouttogetlynched · 20/10/2025 23:35

WilfredsPies · 20/10/2025 23:23

No, it’s really not just a prank. It’s something that we teach children not to do from a young age because it can result in serious injury to heads, necks, spines and, as shown by one of the posts above, can cause someone to bite part of their own tongue off. There isn’t a teacher out there who wouldn’t see that ‘prank’ happening and put a stop to it immediately. Punching him four times is simply showing a sneaky little bully that he won’t take his crap.

I’m sorry but he could end up as violent as his dad You should be sorry because you very clearly have no understanding of domestic violence and the effects on children. He might not tolerate bullies, but your son has as much chance as growing up to be a violent spouse as the OPs son. Or are you of the mistaken belief that it’s only kids who see violence in the home who grow up to be violent partners and husbands?

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I can’t be bothered to post a lengthy response, but violence can be a vicious cycle - not always, but it can, we know this.
Pulling a chair out can be dangerous, but it doesn’t provoke that kind of response. Happened to me at school and I laughed, I don’t have PTSD from it.
I stand by the fact that if my child came home having been repeatedly punched in the face I would be furious regardless, whether the perpetrator had been abused at home or not. I wouldnt tell my DS “Well you kinda deserved it for pulling out his chair.”

DrearyDiary · 20/10/2025 23:25

Espressosummer · 20/10/2025 23:17

Except this is a teen who attacks others at the slightest provocation. They were messing about together, the boy pulled the chair out (stupid and dangerous) then the OP's son punched him 4 times in the head. What happens if he's walking across the field at lunchtime and gets a stray football to the back of the head, is he going to launch another assault? Or if he gets jostled in a busy hallway?

He is an unpredictable, violent male who is a risk to others in that school. Sadly it is due to his awful experiences that no child should ever have to suffer but that doesn't mean the school can just ignore it. I also think it's rather telling that the OP has ignored questions about her son's previous school experiences. It's all well and good the OP saying he's done really well in this school but he's only been there a month.

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I feel like I wandered into an alternate reality.

I what world is being deliberately hurt and embarrassed "the slightest provocation"?

To my mind the first boy was worst, his action was deliberate and premeditated.

OP's son reacted badly in the moment and that needs to be dealt with, but hopefully the "prankster" can learn something too. He won't becuase apparently everyone's going to paint him as an innocent victim

WilfredsPies · 20/10/2025 23:23

abouttogetlynched · 20/10/2025 22:50

Pulling a chair from under someone is a prank (a shit one clearly, because it resulted in the other kid apparently banging his head)… punching someone 4 times in the face is quite another matter.

OP’s DS needs severe consequences for this so he realises how very wrong his actions are or I’m sorry but he could end up as violent as his dad. Letting him back into that school would send the wrong message to him IMO

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No, it’s really not just a prank. It’s something that we teach children not to do from a young age because it can result in serious injury to heads, necks, spines and, as shown by one of the posts above, can cause someone to bite part of their own tongue off. There isn’t a teacher out there who wouldn’t see that ‘prank’ happening and put a stop to it immediately. Punching him four times is simply showing a sneaky little bully that he won’t take his crap.

I’m sorry but he could end up as violent as his dad You should be sorry because you very clearly have no understanding of domestic violence and the effects on children. He might not tolerate bullies, but your son has as much chance as growing up to be a violent spouse as the OPs son. Or are you of the mistaken belief that it’s only kids who see violence in the home who grow up to be violent partners and husbands?

Espressosummer · 20/10/2025 23:17

WilfredsPies · 20/10/2025 22:44

I doubt the OP sends her son to school to have him receive a bang to the back of his head because some other child hasn’t yet absorbed the message that pulling someone’s chair away isn’t just a harmless prank and thinks it’s funny to cause pain and embarrassment to another student. If that’s not something your DS would do, then he’d have nothing to worry about. This isn’t a teen who has been randomly attacking other students with only the slightest provocation.

If it is your DS, then you’ve got bigger problems than him having had a clump.

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Except this is a teen who attacks others at the slightest provocation. They were messing about together, the boy pulled the chair out (stupid and dangerous) then the OP's son punched him 4 times in the head. What happens if he's walking across the field at lunchtime and gets a stray football to the back of the head, is he going to launch another assault? Or if he gets jostled in a busy hallway?

He is an unpredictable, violent male who is a risk to others in that school. Sadly it is due to his awful experiences that no child should ever have to suffer but that doesn't mean the school can just ignore it. I also think it's rather telling that the OP has ignored questions about her son's previous school experiences. It's all well and good the OP saying he's done really well in this school but he's only been there a month.

abouttogetlynched · 20/10/2025 22:50

WilfredsPies · 20/10/2025 22:44

I doubt the OP sends her son to school to have him receive a bang to the back of his head because some other child hasn’t yet absorbed the message that pulling someone’s chair away isn’t just a harmless prank and thinks it’s funny to cause pain and embarrassment to another student. If that’s not something your DS would do, then he’d have nothing to worry about. This isn’t a teen who has been randomly attacking other students with only the slightest provocation.

If it is your DS, then you’ve got bigger problems than him having had a clump.

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Pulling a chair from under someone is a prank (a shit one clearly, because it resulted in the other kid apparently banging his head)… punching someone 4 times in the face is quite another matter.

OP’s DS needs severe consequences for this so he realises how very wrong his actions are or I’m sorry but he could end up as violent as his dad. Letting him back into that school would send the wrong message to him IMO

Ratafia · 20/10/2025 22:45

Is it correct that they imposed a 5 day exclusion and then a permanent one? I'm not sure the they can do that. Try contacting someone like the School Exclusion Project,, or the Communities Empowerment Network, or the School Inclusion Project, to get full advice.

WilfredsPies · 20/10/2025 22:44

abouttogetlynched · 20/10/2025 21:42

Sorry I’m sure your DS has been through a lot and it may sound harsh, but that’s not my DS’s problem - he doesn’t go to school to be assaulted, so no matter what someone’s else’s issue is, it’s not my DS’s and your son deserves to be excluded.

I doubt the OP sends her son to school to have him receive a bang to the back of his head because some other child hasn’t yet absorbed the message that pulling someone’s chair away isn’t just a harmless prank and thinks it’s funny to cause pain and embarrassment to another student. If that’s not something your DS would do, then he’d have nothing to worry about. This isn’t a teen who has been randomly attacking other students with only the slightest provocation.

If it is your DS, then you’ve got bigger problems than him having had a clump.