Aibu to try and overturn my son’s permanent exclusion

The advantage of appealing is that she can request an Independent SEND expert and it's a legal requirement for one to be provided. He can still attend alternative provision in the interim period and benefit from their interventions, the local authority will be fully involved, but the chances of having assessment for trauma and at least two, if not three if you account the deliberate act of the other teenager, separate head injuries are nowhere near as high outside the appeal/independent review process.

It's her legal right to appeal, it doesn't matter whether anybody 'approves' of the decision, it's her legal right and she can and should exercise that right, if nothing else because she and her son will be in a position to be listened to and heard - something that was incredibly unlikely when in such an awful, abusive and dangerous relationship punctuated by daily violence.

It may culminate in a managed move, off site direction or permanent exclusion in any case - but we shouldn't dissuade somebody from wanting to exercise their legal rights in wanting her son's experiences to be heard and acknowledged; something that can be helpful in itself, both for her and her son.

I'm sorry but it probably isn't going to get you anywhere appealing. I think you'd be better putting your energy into making sure the lea get him a place in a pru or other alternative provision asap. They still have a duty to provide a full time education for him, so don't let them fob you off if they attempt to. I'm so sorry for what you have been through I hope things start to get bettwr soon x

The perspective from the school will be that due to the nature of the incident (and possibly anything from previous schools) they cannot be sure he wouldn't react like this again if another incident occured. Then they would be in serious trouble for failing in their duty of care. I have to say that I wouldn't really want either child in my kids year 11 class but I'd be much more afraid of the one who punched another student in the face four times. That being said I do feel for your son. What a difficult time he has had. I hope he gets some help and support.

@ByMintOtteri think that’s harsh and implies that his lot for life moving forward. He is a victim as much as his mum and needs help to deal with his anger and relationship with his dad (who has modelled how a man deals with things)

Op is clearly trying. We cannot underestimate the damage domestic violence does to everyone in the family.

Your son is just like his father. He needs consequences for his behavior, and he 100% deserved permanent exclusion for his behavioral choices.

Can you even imagine what the OP has been through with a violent man, and got away from him with the children?

I find your remark insensitive. Women aren't superhuman and the OP has been spread thin. But it's always a woman to blame...

I think a PRU isn't such a bad thing and it does sound necessary. They are trained to deal with kids with this kind of issue.

Seriously, read that paragraph back. Sue the school? Wtf? By your own (ridiculous) argument, the school has also done the same to the lad that was punched - so perhaps they could counter-sue the OP?!

Also think about the statistics of those entering a PRU
lots of aces.
non attenders.
domestic violence
criminal background
Long waiting lists for counselling/ camhs
delayed asking for ehcp/ diagnosis.
no parental involvement or emphasis on education.
Gang mentality.
multiple moves- house and school.
and that’s just the one I know!

We often get them later than we should and then have to work miracles in a very short period of time.

OP, having read your posts, I really don’t think an appeal is in your boy’s best interests.
He needs help. It may be the first time he has shown violence in THIS school but is it really the first time he has shown violence? people don’t just go from appropriate responses to punching someone FOUR TOMES in the head. If previous violence what were the sanctions- either from you or school?
Your boy needs help, you say so yourself, mainstream isn’t the place he will get it. So why hinder the process?
If he punches a male, how will he respond to a female who upsets him, for whatever reason?
Are you and his younger siblings even safe around him?
Stop using your energies trying to put other peoples children at risk from him and instead put them into pushing for the help you acknowledge he has long required.
if he stayed in mainstream and injured/ killed another mother’s child, how would you feel? Also, how would you feel if your son ended up in jail because you insisted he remained in a place that had already identified it could not meet his considerable needs?

Honestly, violent kids are such a risk for other children and staff.

I feel desperately sorry for you and in particular your lad, but I'm not shocked at the school's response.

I wouldn't if my child had pulled a chair out from under them, which led to them hitting their head. If he wouldn't have been provoked this wouldn't have happened. The boy who pulled the chair out is no more of a victim than the boy who punched him in retaliation.

@waterrat probably depends on the PRU itself. Some students thrive in them and it keeps them in education. Some don’t. Some students I teach shouldn’t be anywhere near a PRU (need specialised provision for autism etc) some really excel and get college places they would never have achieved in mainstream.
There are a lot of variables.
Kindly OP I would be interested in what his previous school also said. He had low attendance. Where flo’s/ early help involved?
Also he has been with new school a month. School may view that as honeymoon period
I just feel parts of the jigsaw are missing. You do need to be realistic moving forward though and he doesn’t have time to waste given his age.

Sorry I’m sure your DS has been through a lot and it may sound harsh, but that’s not my DS’s problem - he doesn’t go to school to be assaulted, so no matter what someone’s else’s issue is, it’s not my DS’s and your son deserves to be excluded.

I haven't read the full thread OP so apologies if someone has already mentioned this. Consider contacting the charity Headway for advice. They were doing some work on the impact of non fatal strangulation and the long-term effects it has on the brain. Suffice to say, it causes more damage than many people, including medical professionals recognise. I had done some work with them in the context of domestic abuse services and violence and aggression from some survivors, which could be attributed to the strangulation they experienced.

I’ve taught in a KS4 PRU. Me, 6 students maximum plus up to 3 TAs! It definitely was a caring place where students were nurtured. I also have a close family member who attended one in a different county in Y11. Often he was the only student in his class. He learnt to cook, got into basketball and the pastoral support he received was first class. They bent over backwards to make sure he had a plan for Y12 - and even checked up on him in his first term at college.

I used to teach in Brum and it took A LOT for a child to be permanently excluded.

Some PRUs are good.

Maybe it's worth going and having a look at a couple and see if DS might be happier?

He needs help with ptsd not anger management!

The statistics on PRUS speak for themselves.

They absolutely do not turn out lots of happy young people who have had wonderful 1 2 1 care - sadly - of course they SHOULD offer really great individualised supportr but this simply isn't what the statistical chances are for any young person entering a PRU

Ok. So don't sign anything. Advise the head that you will query next steps with the local authority.

I'll be honest, I don't think you're being entirely upfront about what's happened as I saw a comment around attendance being 47%, which is really indicative of some serious issues, and a comment about how this is the first school your son has settled in and liked.

The head will have full oversight of your son's record from his previous school(s). Punching somebody 4 times is a sustained attack. The only purpose of it is to hurt. Pulling someone's chair out could be intended to injure, but equally could have been intended as a misjudged joke. That's why they're treated differently.

I don't know anything about behavior centers. Is it possible this might be a good experience for him? Will he get more one-to-one, customized attention?

School cannot convert a suspension into an exclusion unless there is substantial new evidence.
What have you been asked to sign?

If in any doubt ring the local authority and ask them to talk you through the process.
When was the permanent exclusion?
If they haven't notified you of a governors meeting and you haven't been contacted by the local authority then you need to find out what process they are following as there are strict timescales.
If the school has decided to 'rescind' the permanent exclusion then they may do a straight managed move without any meetings but that's a huge risk to the schools as he could end up back at the excluding school if the managed move fails.

How many people die from having a chair pulled from under them in comparison to how many people die at the hands of violent men?
Most people grow out of stupid pranks. Violent men are sadly, less likely to outgrow their poor self regulation.

Police notify schools of any DV incident at an address a school has on record for a child with a note about whether the child was present and if a ‘safe and well’ check was carried out on them. So, at the OP’s son’s old school, there may well have been the argument that school was aware of his trauma and could have put something in place to support him. However, a move out of area post DV incidents mean school is unlikely to have been made aware of previous trauma unless OP mentioned it.

Schools absolutely do move instantly to permanent exclusions for violence of this level. They have a duty of care to other students. The same applies if a student is found carrying a knife - they don’t need to have used it.

I also second the many posters who mention that the PRU may well be the best place for him. Often they are far more nurturing and supportive than mainstream schools as the pupil to staff member ratio is very small and they have less pressure on exam results.