Motability cars - should they be UK made?

Choosing Vauxhall or Ford say would give those companies a huge competitive advantage over other manufacturers- this would hugely affect the car market and would probably not be allowed. But anyway, disabled people often have quite specific requirements and can't guarantee that a single brand or two will have a model that suits them.

Im not on the MN camp that there is zero fraud because they do find some fraud its just statistically zero which isnt the same as none, and then some will go undiscovered as well.

But there are only 815,000 motability cars in the uk. The chances of all these mumsnetters (and telegraph readers) knowing several people fraudulently getting a motability car seem out of kilter with the total number of users. Even if you quadruple the rate of known fraud of other benefit types it just seems high.

The resentment about the Motability scene is completely illogical.

If it was scrapped then disabled people would have to use their PIP/DLA to lease cars from other outlets. I just quickly checked and we could lease the car we have now for less than the PIP payment we sign over to Motability.

The difference is the money we pay now is ploughed back into the scheme for the benefit of all its members, rather than shareholders. Why is that a bad thing?

I have just looked at the cars currently available with no down payment. Many of them are models I looked at when recently changing my car and very few of them could take DS standard wheelchair easily, especially not without taking the whole boot space. People who need anything more than then basic car will struggle to not have to pay some sort of advance payment.

DS isn’t entitled to motability but I did end up buying an ex motability car which comes with the bonus of knowing it had to be maintained to the right standards. So motability cars help the second hand market!

Anyway to answer the OP’s naive question-
No people who require WAVs cannot simply be forced to purchase British made vehicles nor should they be because there aren’t any to lease or to buy.

I would love to have my Peugeot van/WAV replaced by a Jaguar version for the same down payment of several thousand pounds and the full DLA mobility component but I don’t think they do WAVs.

Are people hoping wheelchair users will stop going out?
Are they hoping they can just attach a wheelchair via a towbar to a mini?

I see sour chops Reeves is planning on overhauling Motability - stopping high end cars being available and stopping certain types of disability qualifying. I assume she has this power because the charity (Motability) gets tax relief and possibly funding from the government to run the scheme.

Im assuming that announcement by her has sparked the question from the OP.

I’d dearly love to see currently non-disabled spend as much thought or time on how to make life equal for disabled people saving the government and the almighty taxpayer money WITHOUT making sweeping claims about knowing an x who claims y fraudulently or dramatic statements about work being a mug’s game or about there being an empty purse (which of course means the disabled are the first to be targeted).

I’d love for them to care that much about the rights disabled people have but often cannot exercise, without frothing about the cost of making an ill-equipped society include people who are unfortunately enough to be severely disabled.

That failure of concern seems to be less for people developing disabilities over their life (MND, Parkinson’s, cancer causing disability) than for those born with disabilities . It’s as if because the latter couldn’t happen to them (the latter won’t apply to anyone not disabled right now, unless they have a disabled child they birth in the future or their child births in the future). And it seems like the latter is somehow “lesser” than people born without disability.

A very sad time for people either severe disability.

You can have a car you pay a lot for - it won’t suit your needs and you won’t ever own it - but it will be British.

No, it’s ableism to think disabled people should have fewer choices than non disabled people. Motability’s customers are paying to lease their car, it’s not free.

I don’t know about the scheme but doesn’t it support the car industry in terms of companies making money by selling and maintaining vehicles?

If there was no scheme then wouldn’t claimants get that money to use on taxis?

Why would British manufactured be prioritised over stats like cost of a new car and running the car? (I assume that owners pay for MOT and maintenance ?) By that metric wouldn’t taxpayers get a better deal if say Japanese or South Korean cars were the only choice? (That’s not my opinion btw just an argument for debating purposes)

Some people are eligible for a Motability Foundation grant for adaptations, but that depends on income/savings. Not everyone is eligible even if the adaptations are essential. We funded DS1’s adaptations.

No. This constant demonisation of people with motability cars, and people on disability benefits in general, is ridiculous. Motability cars are paid for by disabled people with their mobility element. They then usually pay £000s extra in advance payments for a car they have to hand back 3 years later and will never own. Why shouldn’t they be able to choose a suitable, reliable car that meets their needs? Getting the higher rate of mobility for either DLA or PIP is ridiculously difficult and only awarded to the most severely disabled claimants. And rightly so. Stop reading the daily fail and do your actual research. And no, I don’t have a mobility car. I’m just angry at the constant barrage of attacks on disabled people right now from a government that are using this false narrative to distract the general public from the things that are really damaging the country.

We are! DD has a Motability car, but she’s not allowed to drive even if cognitively she was able to, which she’s not. She could well choose to run people over, for instance.

We and the care staff, where she lives, only drive the car either with her in it, or for her benefit, such as shopping for her. We have two cars of our own. She can walk, although not reliably, and could well go to the gym if she wanted to - in fact, she needs activity and weight bearing exercise for her health conditions. She would need to be under 1:1 supervision, the whole time she was there though.

VAT registered businesses can reclaim input VAT on vans, bought for their business. So, if VAT is going to be charged on Motability vehicles, why not extend that to all business vehicles and raise even more money for the Treasury?

'Made in the UK' a very small number of cars indeed. Niche and expensive. Assembled in the UK? Much more feasible but parts could come from all over. Don't think it's feasible.

You think it's ableism to say that benefit fraud exists in the UK?

The only madness here is you thinking your comment is accurate.

The usual sources, the papers, social media, people lapping up untruths, and passing them on verbally.

Yes, some people seem to have a hard time getting their heads around the actual facts.

ive been helping a lady who comes to a programme I run, she is entitled to motorbility, she uses an electric wheelchair, but, and big but, the advisor says only 3 vehicles are suitable without extra monthly payments on top of the entire pip mobility element and will accept the grant she qualifies for for adaptations, and two of those brands aren’t interested in her business! Only ford has accepted her, so zero choice, and as it’s technically a van she will have to pay congestion charge to enter Bath despite not being used for commercial purposes.

This is something that is obviously really hard for people to understand but Motability is funded by the payments from people's benefits. These would be paid out anyway, whatever they were used for, whether it's taxis or a lease on a car.

The government only pays extra to help people who need adaptations.

What effect on your life does it have, what choice of car Motability offers to disabled people?

Why do you need to include expensive top of the range SUV’s costing £45,000 plus ?

You do realise that the cars are leased by Motability customers, not owned? The car's worth is immaterial. The only difference is the higher the spec, the higher the upfront payment made by the customer (from their own money).

Sorry new cars

I agree. The amount of people that claim PIP fraudulently is probably cancelled out by those people that legitimately qualify but get turned down. The incidents of accessors ignoring supportive evidence or even telling blatant lies is outrageous. People give up on their claims due to the stress. Millions of pounds would be saved if people weren't forced to go to tribunals which they then go on to win.

And where does the statistic that 20% of he’s car sales are Motability cars ?

The cars are not fucking free - where does this misinformation come from?

I’ve got a Motability car. I’ve had one for quite a few years. It’s an absolute lifeline for me. I save towards my Advance Payment from the minute I take delivery of my current car because those cars with a 0AP don’t suit me. I need a comfortable, heated seat at the correct height and a heated steering wheel. I, also, need an SUV for ease of getting in and out and enough room in the boot to take my power chair and hoist. Believe me, when I go to shop for a car it’s not as easy as saying “I want that one…”

I’m so sick of people picking on disabled people. Richard Tice said Motability claimants are “bed wetting boy racers” because apparently if you wet the bed you get give a Mercedes. Kemi Badenoch started with this removing the VAT exemption from Motability cars, at their conference last week, now Rachel Reeves has jumped on board. It’s nasty politics. Leave us alone and start looking up to save money instead of punching down all the time.

Many people have a very limited choice on what car they can buy or lease due to cost. I don’t see why Motability cars cannot be limited to mid range cars such as Fords and Vauxhall. Why do you need to include expensive top of the range SUV’s costing £45,000 plus ? A car is something to get you from A to B, and we have to remember that it’s funded by the taxpayer to the tune of £3.4 billion pounds a year. There has been an increase in pip claims of 80% in recent years. There was someone on a phone in on LBC recently who said their partner has been awarded the higher rate pip payment which he used to lease a Motability car as his mental health wasn’t good and he struggled to use public transport. Im not sure that this is a good use of public funds.