Controversial approach to Santa

Your approach sounds sensible, OP.

Mine is only 1yo, but I can’t imagine going to great lengths to convince them FC is 100% “real”. As a PP said, I fundamentally want them to trust us as their parents, and not potentially feel stupid or sad when they find out we’ve been insistently telling them things that aren’t true, just for fun.

I’m on board with fun rituals and traditions and telling stories, but I probably won’t be going all out to make DC believe FC is literally real and squeezes down our chimney! It also puts a lot of emphasis on getting presents, which I could do without.

Some PPs’ bullish insistence on The Magic - and for DC at the end of primary! - does make me laugh. It’s not a religion 😂

So no tooth fairy, no Easter Bunny, no fictional characters, no Disney characters, no fantasy characters, no magic.
There is a difference between lying and giving your kids joy. I appreciate this is just my opinion and I am sure you give your children a very happy childhood but I want to add in the magic and the fairy dust x

He's always been Santa in Ireland. What an odd thing to 'hate'.

But what does your husband think, OP?

Is he OK with being excluded from his family Christmas because your family do things a bit differently?

Do people not lie to their kids the whole time 😁? I do. "Oh sweetie, we can't go to the pool today because it's shut and their cleaning it. Let's go on Wednesday". "No, you wouldn't like this cake, it's a bit spicy".

I always think on these threads, "you do you". My child believes and has a strong enough belief that others not believing would have precisely zero effect. I think he asked at one point, and I said something like "Santa only comes if the parents want him to come, otherwise kids still get gifts, but it's their parents who bring them". It's also a good reason for why Santa won't bring nerf guns or ponies - "Santa won't bring anything he knows your parents wouldn't want you to have".

My older one is becoming more and more aware that my parenting style is based on lies and deceit, but it doesn't seem to have shattered our relationship. Instead, we lie to the toddler together - "no, your brother has not just eaten two Oreos, there are no biscuits in the house, would you like an apple?"

We've taken the exact same approach, stockings and presents. Presents are definitely from us, we just don't mention where stockings are from. I actively encourage conversations about what's make believe and what isn't. But respond to any direct questions about Santa with open questions about what my kids believe.

Tbh I'd much prefer to just tell them the truth as I find the whole Santa thing weird but I feel I can't explain to a kid that all other adults are lying to them so I just go with the open questions and definitely don't tell him he's real. Not sure why anyone else would have an issue with it, if you're happy to not saying anything direct.

Both my kids are obsessed with Santa, and due to my open questions have built themselves their own backstories they believe in strongly 😂🎅

Is that you Ebenezer?

Santa was a glorified delivery person in our house.

We didnt mention santa until they came home from pre school. Luckily pre school teacher had my bad and basically told them parents send present to santa and he delivers them.

That's the approach I took with my now adult children.

Thankfully my family never had such a OTT reaction.

I don't remember feeling an actual Father Christmas belief but I suppose I must have done - my best friend broke the news to me when I was 4 or 5 and I don't recall being shattered by it, just that the stockings themselves were really exciting, coming in the middle of the night like that, and I certainly didn't want to spoil that by letting on! I did eventually and I think my mother must have asked me not to tell my brother, 3 years younger - I did spill the beans but by then he was 11 (!!!) and I felt he really needed telling, so I did FC, the Easter Bunny and the Tooth Fairy in one fell swoop on holiday, and he was really upset!

What I appreciate most about growing up without Santa is that Christmas has never changed for me. The things that were brilliant as a kid are still brilliant because they’ve never had an element or focal point removed from them.

Interesting. Is an expressed 'belief' in Santa a bit like herd immunity - that is, as many kids as possible should either believe or express the belief that they do, in order to protect the vulnerable?

Probably controversial but I’m with @Lynsey953 - I don’t understand why people get so upset due to an imaginary figure to the point in our school we have year 6 mums kicking off cos the kids got told Santa doesn’t exist. It’s ridiculous keeping kids infantilised

Surely once the kids old enough for that level of perception it should be yeah mum and dad are Santa and then teaching them the value of love and gifting and being grateful for what you have and that money doesn’t grow on santas magic money tree and that we’ve technically just culturally appropriated a religious time for retail purposes.

but just to put it in perspective- any other situation and it would classed as gaslighting gaslit by magic.

by all means OP if the kids grow up not believing in Santa that’s absolutely fine - but perhaps to save yourself the grief from the magic elves when they are older it would be best to tell them not to let their classmates know.

and I think your SIL is overreacting. Christmas should be about spending time with loved ones not an imaginary fat dude in a suit. It probably says more about her and how she’s raised her kids if she thinks a 2&3 year old are capable of ruining an 8&9 years old Christmas.

your kids won’t bat an eyelid when someone talks about him. They aren’t gonna turn around and say he’s not real

Oh let them be little children and enjoy the magic. The 6 year old must hear about him at school. 😊

People in general do all kinds of horrible things I don't feel the need to personally demonstrate to my children.

I don't labour under the delusion they'll never be lied to, but I don't think I have to be the one lying. I felt quite strongly, especially when they were young, that they weren't stupid just ignorant - and it was my job to teach them about the world, and they trusted me.

And it’s even more tedious when all posters can defend themselves with is ‘ooh, touched a nerve, have I?’ Your opinions of your own visions of ‘magic’ and your weeping emojis for children who have to ‘endure’ Christmas without Santa are ridiculous, and that’s all that’s going on here.

How does ‘adult cynicism’ come into play when I was a child who didn’t care either?

If you want to go ahead and form a robust reason why exactly Santa is so necessary, then go ahead.

I would tell them the stories before they go to school. Just as stories. And not discuss if they are true or not if I could avoid it.

This is totally normal and rational. A recent fantasy tale told about a true saint in history - and you’re mad if you don’t shove it down your kids throats before they become shocked that their parents have been lying to them for 10 years.

It’s so odd what people will say to defend such an odd thing.

You are choosing not to lie to your kids. Well done.

Seems like a nerve has been touched. 🤔
"Fed up of people pushing this BS?"
"narrow box?"

As I said, it's more about the adult ...

We never did father Christmas with our dc. Dh's family just never did it and i was told the truth at a very young age because i was terrified of the idea of a strange man coming into my bedroom when i was asleep.

We taught the dc that they needed to respect that some children believe in father Christmas and that they must not tell them that it isn't true, in the same way you respect other people's beliefs, religions etc.

I took more or less the same approach as you OP. I never said if he was real or not until they asked, but I never gave anything from Santa. When they asked I said he didn’t exist in real life but it’s a lovely story, like all the other stories we have. I personally felt it was a lie and why lie - I don’t lie about anything else, so why say someone exists when he doesn’t, was my view. My kids have great Xmas memories from when they were young though. I did tell them that some kids believe Santa is real so don’t tell them (a bit like some people think fairies are real etc).

I really hate this sanctimonious pontificating. Yes I believed in Father Christmas as a child and no, I don’t see it as my parents lying to me. Yes I told my children about Father Christmas, they’re teens now and we have a great relationship. Don’t make this a bigger issue than it needs to be.

Op your DH obviously grew up believing in Santa, what does he think?
Does he want to do the Santa letters, the visits, the biscuits and ? 🍪🍶
My oldest who decided ALL the reindeer needed a carrot 🥕 🥕🥕🥕🥕🥕🥕🥕🥕

The absolute joy and excitement going to bed listening for bells 🔔.
Is Santa going to bring whatever their hearts desire?

Different people do Santa different ways he is a big delivery man to me, not everything is from him but he delivers everything, like the postman.

BTW Santa doesn't bring live animals they'd get cold and squashed on the sleigh, and pee on other presents- yuck

I do believe Santa is the magic of Christmas. Santa is what makes people dig deep for toy appeals, giving trees etc.

I don't do Elf on the shelf but my kids ask why do they not have an Elf.

I'm glad my DD has had magical Christmas's as she's 9 now so is starting to not believe. But I would never take away her excitement of santa bringing presents, leaving out snacks for him and rudolph etc. She gets presents from Santa and presents from family and friends.