Why can’t the Israelis and Palestinians just live in peace?!!

@Helenalove Did you not read my previous post?

I'll post it again

Britain does not occupy Northern Ireland; rather, it is a constituent part of the United Kingdom since the Government of Ireland Act 1920.
Northern Ireland has its own devolved government and is not a separate foreign entity, sharing a border with the Republic of Ireland.
The Good Friday Agreement of 1998 ensures that any change in its status would require the consent of its population.

Male female balance is important in the wolrd, especially in male leaders. If anything gets severely out of balance, it causes problems.

Several male leaders have come out and said this also. That we need more female leaders. Barack Obama was one who said it.

I don't think it is anything to do with being male of female. Some female leaders in the EU are not doing a great job at stopping esclation to ww3 at the moment. It is to do with bringing people up with empathy, like you said upthread, and with values which put the value of human life over excessive profits, probably, and that applies to both sexes.

In relation to education, the level of education when it comes to history/politics in the UK has been poor since the 1960s in most state schools. It should be improved everywhere, I agree.

I wish so many wars hadnt started over land. Usually by male leaders. We need more female leaders workdwide for more peace and balance.

Thank you. You have written a good post.

Isn't it kind of shocking that the U.K. don't teach what happened in schools.

Its like they edit out anything where the U.K. was bad to other countries. I mean - you can't do that!

Its whitewashing and its similiar to how Israeli young people are taught that everything is Palestine's fault and nothing is Israel's fault.

I have German friends, and they have told me that that they are taught in detail what happened in WW2 and are brought around concentration camps. That is the right wag.

Its not the average UK persons fault - what happened in Ireland. But its important that they at least know what happened. The UK government and the education system should teach it in schools.

I think most people were not aware of the background to the NI conflict, rather than not caring. I think it was presented to the English as being the English saving everyone from terrorists, and people didn't look further than that. These were the days before the internet. It was the Cranberries song Zombie in my generation which started to inform people who I knew, funnily enough. Whereas now we can all find out about the history of the Palestinian conflict going right back to 1917 with the Balfour Agreement and you can see copies of the Balfour Agreement and the Mandate for Palestine and everything which has happened since at a click of a button. You have to dig around though. It is the same with the Ukrainian conflict, there isnt clear information in once place but is is easy to find information on the Orange Revolution and the changes in society before and after that and the increase of conflict (and dare i say the fact that it was apparently funded by people who were not Ukrainian or Russian), the start of EU trade agreement negotions in 2007/8, US involvement and funding as well as the Russian information as you can translate Russian with a click.

i think that as soon as people become informed they care, and they want it to stop.

It isn't just land, I don't think. It is control, resources, profit at the root of most of them

Exactly. A lot of wars have been started over land..
It happens. Thats how the world was, yes. But you cant just invade somewhere, take land and then say "fuck it, it will be grand"

The UK government was a bit stupid about Northern Ireland. They seemed to not anticipate all the problems that taking Northern Ireland would cause.

Its disheartening. Because I have lived in England and I have lived in the republic of Ireland and I have lived in Northern Ireland. I worked on a peace project in Northern Ireland and I saw the devastation and suffering on both sides.

In England, no one I talked to gave a shit about what happened in Ireland as it doesnt affect them. And also i think they dont like to see the UK government as the bad guys.

They do give a shit about whats happening in Palestine, as someone else is the bad guy.

I think that this is exactly the point and the reason why we could drift into ww3. Most people are simply not aware of how wars start and how the people on the land affected by the war feel. I would put money on most posters here not having a clue how the Ukraine Russia conflict started and not having a clue how the Israel Palestine conflict started. And the links between those conflicts and every major conflict going back to ww1.

Ths U.K. took Northern Ireland by force.

Explain to me how they are not occupying it?

Ths USA and Australia are not split into two countries. Ireland is split into two. That is very rare, and it still causes problems to this day.

So do you think we should just say "thats just how the world goes"

About the Israel/ Palestine conflict

aswell?

Its how the world goes. Once too much time has passed you can't just undo people's lives. It's the same as telling every settler in the USA and Australia to go back to their original country and give it back to the natives. It doesn't work once generations have lived in the land.

You wrote
"Britain does not occupy Northern Ireland; rather, it is a constituent part of the United Kingdom since the Government of Ireland Act 1920."

You left out some vital parts of history

In 1920, Ireland wanted total freedom from the U.K.
The U.K refused to give this freedom. The U.K instead proposed a deal where the U.K got to keep Northern Ireland, and the rest of Ireland would be free.
Ireland did not want this. But the UK refused to offer any other deal. Irish politicians felt they had to accept this del at the time, as it was the best of a very bad deal.

This deal (the UK getting to keep northern ireland) was not accepted by many Irish people at time and caused the Irish civil War, where many lives were lost.

Ireland did not have a choice in the UK taking Northern Ireland. This led to many problems including the later troubles in Northern Ireland.

You are heartless. You write vague statements and dont care about anyones pain.

Israel could say the same thing that you said. They could say that Israel is not occupying Palestine. That palestine is their land. When the outside world sees that Israel is treating Palestine extremely cruelly.

Why do you think there was war for so long in Northern Ireland? The descendants of the locals and the descendants of the colonisers fought for a very long time.

Anytime I talk to anyone that is not from the UK about Nothern Ireland. People from the rest of the world say to me "why don't the U.K. give Northern Ireland back?"

You need more education 🙄
I'ts about land not religion 🙄

Britain does not "occupy" NI.

Ireland wanted Northern Ireland to be part of Ireland.

The U.K. forced Ireland to hand over Northern Ireland to the U.K.

Do you think Ireland just said

"here take a large chunk of our island! No problem".

The U.K. forced Ireland to give Northern Ireland to them. Northern Ireland was taken by force,

and the current situation of having a split island, Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland, has caused a huge amount of problems in Ireland.

@Helenalove "U.K. is still occupying Northern Ireland "

This ^ is incorrect

Britain does not occupy Northern Ireland; rather, it is a constituent part of the United Kingdom since the Government of Ireland Act 1920. Northern Ireland has its own devolved government and is not a separate foreign entity, sharing a border with the Republic of Ireland. The Good Friday Agreement of 1998 ensures that any change in its status would require the consent of its population..

Again you are proving my point. You are showing zero empathy.

I am not the first poster that mentioned Northern Ireland on this thread.

Scroll back and look.

I added to the existing discussion about Northern Ireland. When several posters talk about a topic , it is not derailing. It is an important topic.

Anyone can see the glaring hypocrisy of U.K. posters condeming Israel occupying Palestine, while the U.K. is still occupying Northern Ireland .

But not all, as was posted upthread.

More info here

https://medium.com/metaphor-hacker/guns-glory-and-greed-most-wars-were-not-caused-by-religion-but-they-werent-prevented-by-it-a3002aee387f

But this thread is about the situation in Gaza, despite your attempts to derail it.

Because of religion. The cause of many wars over the ages.

This thread is an interesting one on human psychology.

No one likes to see themselves as the bad guys.

People on here from the UK condemn Israel for what they did.

But when it is pointed out to those same UK posters that the U.K invaded, stole land, raped and murdered many many people. That the UK caused destruction and devastation around the world.

They brush it off. They don't want to see their country as the bad guys. They get defensive

Its the same when i have talked to some Israeli people. We say to them "mass murder of civilans and children is wrong" and they say no but it is the Palestinians fault.

Uk people do the same thing too. I have yet to see one UK poster on heres show any empathy or kindness for what the UK did to other countries. I am still waiting. I am not waiting for someone to express personal shame. I am waiting for someone from the UK to even acknowledge the terrible acts that the UK committed around the world.

Again the lack of empathy is astounding.

You wrote " ah sure Most countries have history that they’re not proud of. My take is, don’t look back, look forward"

So should Israel also say that about what they have done to the Palestinians?

After all the death and destruction that Israel caused.? "Ah sure don't look back, look forward". And just shrug it off? Im sure the palestinians will remember their dead brothers, sisters and parents.

Again, what i find utterly bizarre is how people from the UK on here can say that what what Israel did is wrong,

Yet they completely brush off all terrible things that the UK did.

So death, destruction, murder and rape is ok when the UK do it to other countries?

You should be totally fucking ashamed of yourselves

Mumsnet isn't for military history. Positively disavows it a lot of the time.

Quite. See also: World War I; World War II; Putin’s current war in Ukraine.