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To be interested in why women generally live longer than men?

183 replies

JFDIYOLO · 04/10/2025 15:38

Quite a few articles doing the rounds this week.

The XX chromosome combo seems more robust - if there's something wrong with one X, a woman's other X will compensate (eg I probably carry my father's colour blindness but my mother's healthy X patched that). But male embryos/men, with only the one X, may be more vulnerable.

Female embryos are more engaged with building the immune system very early on than male.

Men are more likely to do risky behaviour like motorbikes, driving dangerous, drinking, fighting - testosterone is a dangerous drug?

Men are more likely to be doing dangerous professions - building sites, deep sea diving, the military etc, and to die at work.

Men are more likely to murder and be murdered.

Men are less likely to consult a doctor for health issues - I once came home to find my partner googling 'What should I do about this pain in my chest' (yes, heart attack) whereas I'm on the phone if it doesn't look right, feel right, act right and to take every routine test on offer - because I've been socialised to know my entire female anatomy is trying to kill me.

Men are less likely to talk about and ask for help with mental and emotional issues which can descend into depression, and higher male suicides.

Even though women still die in childbirth, suffer PND, are way more likely to be murdered by their intimate partners and are prescribed drugs that were habitually not developed using female test cohorts.

www.sciencenewstoday.org/why-do-women-live-longer-than-men-scientists-say-the-answer-lies-in-evolution

OP posts:
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Cheese55 · 08/10/2025 20:58

Thats why they re marry so quickly !

Umidontknow · 08/10/2025 20:57

Apart from medically, I think with the older generation many of the men couldn't really look after themselves. My grandad was an extremely skilled carpenter but he nearly set the house on fire when he tried to make a meal when my grandma was ill. They had a very happy, loving and supportive marriage, but he worked full time to pay the bills and she ran the house and worked part time. If she had died first he wouldn't have known what to do to survive 🙈

PrincessSophieFrederike · 06/10/2025 22:25

pottylolly · 06/10/2025 21:06

Amongst women. Not necessarily amongst men. Many women can and do have consensual sex with male carers. It’s an open secret.

Interesting, had no idea. Do the elderly men do this less?

Makes me glad my grandmother lives with our family (I'm a uni student) so we can keep an eye on her! 🤣

NewAgeNewMe · 06/10/2025 22:12

Great thread.

Cheese55 · 06/10/2025 21:42

We are meant to look after the young offspring. Can't rely on men to do that. Not skilled enough!

dumberthanaboxofrocks · 06/10/2025 21:36

PrizedPickledPopcorn · 04/10/2025 16:09

Why wouldn’t men be more useful in old age though? It’s not as if women can breastfeed in old age. We aren’t physically useful, so why can’t men make themselves useful too?

Cos they’re busy telling everyone about a fight they won in 1967

IAintAfraidOfNoGoat · 06/10/2025 21:15

Only a handful of species go through menopause, and each of the other species tend to have matriarchal communities which keep them peaceful. That’ll be the evolutionary reason why women live longer than men.

Humans have stupid men who forced patriarchy upon us and silenced women over centuries and denied us peaceful communities. Wankers.

pottylolly · 06/10/2025 21:10

MrsTerryPratchett · 06/10/2025 20:25

This. Evolution is essentially:

  1. Did you live long enough to reproduce?
  2. Did you get enough of those offspring to reproductive age?
  3. Did they reproduce?

There’s some stuff about conferring advantage on relatives. Cousins, nieces etc. for their portion of your DNA, which accounts for things like heritability of same sex attraction. But it’s basically all about sex and death.

That’s why the Darwin Awards only gives prizes for those two things.

So true. Huntingtons and Parkinsons are both associated with super-fertility and a greater physical attractiveness (eg symmetrical features etc) which is why these conditions haven’t been wiped out.

pottylolly · 06/10/2025 21:07

AnOn2909 · 06/10/2025 18:26

It’s interesting that since the State Pension age has been equalised for men & women, women’s life expectancy is falling.

Probably because a lot of women have / are dying in poverty due to how suddenly the changes were affected.

pottylolly · 06/10/2025 21:06

Amongst women. Not necessarily amongst men. Many women can and do have consensual sex with male carers. It’s an open secret.

MrsTerryPratchett · 06/10/2025 20:25

rickyrickygrimes · 06/10/2025 18:41

Evolutionarily, your offspring are more important than you personally are. Biology doesn’t really care about you once you’ve fulfilled your purpose, which is to reproduce and ensure your offspring reach adulthood as best you can.

This. Evolution is essentially:

  1. Did you live long enough to reproduce?
  2. Did you get enough of those offspring to reproductive age?
  3. Did they reproduce?

There’s some stuff about conferring advantage on relatives. Cousins, nieces etc. for their portion of your DNA, which accounts for things like heritability of same sex attraction. But it’s basically all about sex and death.

That’s why the Darwin Awards only gives prizes for those two things.

Buxusmortus · 06/10/2025 19:55

Tiredofwhataboutery · 06/10/2025 18:30

What was the programme?

I can't remember, but it would have been on radio 4 because that's the only station I listen to, and probably within the past year.

rickyrickygrimes · 06/10/2025 18:41

PrincessSophieFrederike · 05/10/2025 23:10

So you get the advantage of more offspring, but is it that much of an advantage for you personally if it makes it more likely you'll die prematurely?

Evolutionarily, your offspring are more important than you personally are. Biology doesn’t really care about you once you’ve fulfilled your purpose, which is to reproduce and ensure your offspring reach adulthood as best you can.

Tiredofwhataboutery · 06/10/2025 18:30

Buxusmortus · 04/10/2025 16:27

Yes. And I heard an interesting programme to say why female humans go through menopause and continue to live afterwards, whereas other mammals continue to be able to reproduce their whole lives.

It's because older women have practical uses in helping their children( primarily daughters) bring up the next generations without themselves still having to continue to breed, so that their daughters can continue to breed. All based on evolution and the continuation of the species.

What was the programme?

PrincessSophieFrederike · 06/10/2025 18:26

Sorry, that link doesn't work. This one does :

https://www.boomershub.com/blog/stds-in-nursing-homes

AnOn2909 · 06/10/2025 18:26

It’s interesting that since the State Pension age has been equalised for men & women, women’s life expectancy is falling.

PrincessSophieFrederike · 06/10/2025 17:50

PrizedPickledPopcorn · 04/10/2025 16:29

But why not men in this role? Why women?

I think it must have something to do with community. Women being generally more able to live in bigger groups without everyone vying to be in charge.

Male animals seem to need to be the only bloke on the block- so are useless to a wider group.

The cliche that women are less competitive has been challenged by some scientists more recently, who argue that it's more that men are competitive in more noticeable (ie. Overtly aggressive) ways.
Heather Heying has quite an interesting article on this,

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=naturalselections.substack.com/p/competition1of2&ved=2ahUKEwjp8P7DzY6QAxXRVEEAHWCVH8wQFnoECBoQAQ&usg=AOvVaw2YSktsc1Uz6yu7JyAR9IT4

And this book makes a similar argument.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Warriors-Worriers-Survival-Joyce-Benenson/dp/0199972230

I agree broadly though that women are more able to remain in large groups without severe conflict.

https://www.google.com/url?opi=89978449&rct=j&sa=t&source=web&url=https%3A%2F%2Fnaturalselections.substack.com%2Fp%2Fcompetition1of2&usg=AOvVaw2YSktsc1Uz6yu7JyAR9IT4&ved=2ahUKEwjp8P7DzY6QAxXRVEEAHWCVH8wQFnoECBoQAQ

Cheese55 · 06/10/2025 11:42

I thought men's sperm becomes poor in quality as they age which is why they can't donate over a certain age? Also the decrease in testosterone means they don't really want sex post 70 years , so the idea they can father babies forever is a bit misleading

pottylolly · 06/10/2025 09:37

mathanxiety · 06/10/2025 01:37

Typically, in ancient societies, men were busy with warfare, hunting, perhaps ceremonial duties (shamans, etc), and pursuits outside of the home or settlement. Women raised babies, cooked, gathered, administered primitive medicine, and when older, helped take care of babies and children, pregnant and nursing women, and had duties around medicine and food prep, community property like baskets, pots, woven items, food preservation. and passing on community wisdom around food and medicine that lasted well into the years after they were finished with childbearing. By contrast, older men were pretty much surplus to requirements apart from ceremonial / storytelling elements of life. So goes the general theory anyway..

In prehistoric societies, before / agriculture in hunting / gathering societies - WOMEN were the society / community. Men were only useful if they could hunt & were not allowed to remain if they couldn’t.

JFDIYOLO · 06/10/2025 08:59

The height and size thing is interesting - I'm taller and bigger than many UK men and I'm consciously losing weight to give my system less work to do in my 60s .

I wonder if lifespan studies are done in populations that have different average heights - say Japanese people compared to Dutch people.

OP posts:
Worldgonecrazy · 06/10/2025 08:53

I once did the maths on population stats at the time - U.K. only, and this was about 15-20 years ago. Birth stats were just under 51% male babies. Probably slightly more male pre-natal but male babies more likely to miscarry. Male babies also slightly more likely to succumb to childhood fatal illnesses in pre-teen years. Teens and early 20s - males mired in likely to die in accidents etc. By the age of 28 the sexes were evenly balanced, and then female percentage of population increases each decade.

Women have better immune systems, so we are less likely to succumb to infections etc.

It’s interesting that evolution has ensured more male babies to counteract the higher death rate.

PrizedPickledPopcorn · 06/10/2025 08:24

mathanxiety · 06/10/2025 01:37

Typically, in ancient societies, men were busy with warfare, hunting, perhaps ceremonial duties (shamans, etc), and pursuits outside of the home or settlement. Women raised babies, cooked, gathered, administered primitive medicine, and when older, helped take care of babies and children, pregnant and nursing women, and had duties around medicine and food prep, community property like baskets, pots, woven items, food preservation. and passing on community wisdom around food and medicine that lasted well into the years after they were finished with childbearing. By contrast, older men were pretty much surplus to requirements apart from ceremonial / storytelling elements of life. So goes the general theory anyway..

It sort of suggests that men have/had no flexibility- they did their macho thing then came home and sat on their arses. So were indeed useless in old age. I would have thought there would always be a job for extra hands and another set of eyes. I certainly would have found them helpful in the thick of my parenting years!

PrincessSophieFrederike · 06/10/2025 04:01

WinoTime · 05/10/2025 12:16

It’s because men are often not good at looking after themselves or their environment.

DM died a couple of years ago and my DF is pretty useless at keeping up with the household chores and efficient shopping and cooking. He’s getting better but it is obvious that he went straight from living with his mum to his wife.

That stat isn't accurate though- most studies show married women as living longer than single women, the effect is just less pronounced than for married vs single men.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2352827320302792#:~:text=Although%20marriage%20was%20protective%20for%20both%20men,absolute%20values%20as%20well%20as%20relative%20percentages.