To think some people love being victims too much to heal?

I fell into that trap in the 80s. Being victimised, or a victim of something seemed to be everywhere from daytime TV and upwards.

I was in a terrible state, had been through something horrendous. So my ears pricked up and I leaned in. It was a huge relief at first. Like finally being seen, even if just by myself. But it was trap. The more I leaned in and examined my wounds through that lens the more my locus of control wandered off to the Outer Hebrides (and I was living in Luton, so not exactly conveniently located).

At some point I think it infected me to the point where I was actually perfumed by it. Because predatory types could seemingly sniff me out. Which did little to shake my perception of myself as a victim. My mum was doing much the same thing, just in a different place.

I was 26 before I realised I either grabbed that wandering locus of control and superglued it back inside myself, holding myself ruthlessly accountable for that which was within my control. It took a long time. Many two steps forward, fall flat on face, get up again, backslide, trudge forward a bit sessions. Progress was measured in inches.

But now in my late 50s and my mother in her 80s, I can see how the inches added up and turned in eons away from the piteous state I’d been pushed into, then chose to make my home. But she’s still in the hole. Still digging.

Maybe both of our former selves died in the process of managing the worst parts of life-rain and its aftermath. I don’t feel anything like a phoenix. I could possibly pull of singed budgie on a good day. But I’d give anything for her to have had that, rather than being stuck, sat in the ashes of who she used to be.

this is an interesting topic to discuss.

I think what everyone else has said can all be true.

i think people can get stuck and kid themselves they want to “get better” when they don’t.

I think people can be manically depressed and not really sure how to go about getting better. sometimes people can be depressed and know what to do, but just can’t get started.

I think others feel like they are perpetually dealt bad cards so just of develop a can’t be bothered type response as a coping strategy

I think some people are genuinely quite satisfied with their lot and whilst may like to moan and complain, they wouldn’t actually have it any other way.

whilst it’s 100% true that you never know what someone is going through, you can’t expect other people to react to a situation the same way you would. (Even if you are also going through a tough time)

i also think social media, as with most things, plays a huge part in this new trend. There is this performative victim behaviour, people seem to feel the need to have their behaviours justified by strangers online. I personally don’t understand it, but I see sometimes people I know partake in it, and I do wonder why. It doesn’t seem helpful, to me, to look for validation, outside of your real life support network. I left Facebook years ago, but my husband’s aunt was always posting hospital check in’s, and miserable selfies. It was so draining to see. (One of the reasons I deleted all my social media profiles)

You and @Onlyinthreeshave worded it so much better than I have managed in years. Thank you.
Now, how does one get out of it?

I agree. And I say that as someone who has built their life around healing. It’s not my identity but it is my purpose, to live a life that is full and fulfilling. A life that is gentle and slow. My mother on the other hand loves to be a victim. She goes from crisis to crisis and seems to enjoy it. She looks for reasons to be upset. It’s bizarre.
I am happy and positive and I am a glass half full person. She moans and moans and finds the negative in every situation.

You can make healing your life without it being a negative thing.

Mine is long gone, but she was a bit like that - loved having a grievance to nurture - and still go on about 20 years later!

@Onlyinthreesput it perfectly.

I think depending on what happened and when, having been abused/traumatised can become quite a defining part of your personality and inform your later responses. There’s a perception nowadays that victimhood has caché or is some sort of moral trump card. Certainly wasn’t that way when I was growing up; pity was a double-sided coin with shame. Who wants to feel pitied?

As an adult, if and when you move on, it can feel like a compounded loss. Because there’s been a life-altering struggle you maybe couldn’t disclose, and if you’ve made poor decisions along the way as a result of ‘the thing’ it can be painful to acknowledge that you fucked up. So it’s perhaps it may feel safer to stay in the headspace of blaming someone else for their earlier wrongdoing than assessing how your response to them has informed your outcomes.

And having been abused, you may not be in a good place to effect change anyway, as much of your early life was about being blamed for things you had not done, or feeling guilty about things you didn’t cause. When you feel everything is your fault, it’s hard to see a way forward.

And sometimes the response to trauma or abuse can be a useful fuel. One example would be perhaps trying to right wrongs through your career choices, trying to create change or aid the mechanics of justice, or creative endeavours - a lot of writers/artists will explore/process childhood trauma.

When you realise you’d be better off psychologically if you try to shut down the furnace, you’re left thinking, well, what now? And who am I now? What was the point of all that? Ironically these are thought-processes you’re probably more prone to, having been a victim of abuse. I know some people who very much lack a sense of self as a result of what happened to them as children. I think it’s definitely more complicated than ‘people love being victims.’ It’s a bit like there’s a part of you that’s trapped in amber.

It's complex (of course) but yes I think this exists. I actually made big changes to my life after realising I really enjoyed some quite major surgery and the post surgical recovery. Literally having risky open surgery was worth it because I got to then spend some time with fewer expectations on me. If you don't have the option to make these big changes then I totally get that being unwell is preferable to facing up to life.

Edited to add - I am in a bit of a slump at the moment actually and it's one of my early warning signs to sort myself out a bit. I start hoping I get ill.

Most posters on mumsnet play victim.

I see you've met my step MiL 😂 The only divorcee in the world, at least to hear her go on. 40 years on its all got very wearing.

I agree. And I don’t share with everyone around me. Nobody at work knows anything about my private life. My friends do - but they have equally gone through shit and we hash it out together. It’s the thoughts in my head I want to change.

I think that is true. It definitely isn’t calculated with me. I don’t share with everybody. The other side of it is friends can become used to you being a victim and feeling sorry for you and when you start to get stronger those friendships change which can play havoc with your victim mindset and make it safer to go ‘back down there’
I go to work, I do my thing, I comfort others when it is needed at work, I don’t discuss myself - it is when I come home and my brain goes into overdrive hating myself because I can’t take the advice I offer others. That’s when my victim mindset kicks in.

The thing is though, you also don't know what the other person has gone through...
But I do think that describing yourself as victim & over sharing your own experiences can be very tiresome for the people around you.

Well it doesn’t sound like you’re what the OP is talking about then?

Yes. I can think of several people like this. Constantly needing to have their ‘pain’ acknowledged and have everyone flocking round them giving attention and sympathy, but hostile once anyone suggests practical steps towards recovery. It’s like people thrive on the attention. The worst person I’ve ever known for this WAS diagnosed with EUPD, but there seems to be a degree of narcissism involved, it’s incredibly manipulative behaviour. I can never quite trust anyone who claims to suffer severe depression or anxiety but has never tried medication. I’ve been there, I’d have had an arm amputated if it meant getting better.

I don't think its that simple or that calculated

I think people fear change and feel overwhelmed with what's needed to turn things around.

It can feel less scary to stay the way you are because its what you know.

I was agreeing with you being annoyed with myself at what my first thought was, then took the time to take a second thought and have a word with myself.

No-one knows what anyone has gone through.

But you turn up to work, do your job and get through the day the same as everyone else who may have gone through shit.

Plus, if others are going through stuff they can really do without having someone with victim mentality sucking the energy out of them.

I think part of the issue is current culture encourages and even rewards ‘victim’ status, so there is incentive to stay within it, and little incentive to get better. Unfortunately, in many families, organisations, and society at large, attention is given to those who are causing problems or creating drama, and those who get on with things or are independent and try and solve their own issues are ignored because it’s generally accepted they will just carry on. This results in the message that if you want attention then you must cause problems or be a victim.

It doesn’t help that psychologists in recent times are also encouraging victim mentality, oppression complexes and the like - keeping people submerged in their trauma instead of being challenged to find their own way out.

You see my first thought after reading your post was ‘but you don’t know what I’ve gone through’ 🙈 which is exactly the op’s point I guess - but I don’t love being this way and I don’t refuse to do anything to change I just don’t know how to change on my own and I am desperate to.

I have a friend who split up with her fiance 15 years ago. He treated her dreadfully but she is still going on about it now, like it happened yesterday. She’s never really moved on, and all her relationships since have been short term, unstable, or futile attempts to recapture what she lost. She’s bitter and it’s ruined the best years of her life, when she what she should’ve done is grieve for a short time and then shrug it off. I want to shake her but I think she’s too far gone now.

YANBU

Victim mentality is definitely a thing.

I work with a perpetual victim who refuses to do anything to really help herself, and it's utterly exhausting at times.

I think that could well be me. My whole person is so wrapped up in my ‘trauma’ that I don’t know how else to be and have no idea how to just be steady and to cope when things are on an even keel so I self sabotage. It’s a horrible way of being and I hate it about myself - and hating myself doesn’t help so the cycle continues. I wish I could find a great therapist who could help me be rid of my victim mentality but so far the ones I have found just nod and agree with and don’t challenge me or even try to get me to think differently. If it was that easy to just think differently then I would have done it years ago - but it isn’t. It’s as ingrained in me as saying my knee needs to stop being a knee and now needs to start being an ankle, well it can’t can it? That probably doesn’t make sense 🤦🏽‍♀️ I literally don’t know how else to be.
My parent was similar and I think I leant into that behaviour/way of being. Somehow I have managed to avoid it with my dc and they are thriving - 1dc is LC with me (don’t blame them - just want them to be happy) I have to sort myself out to stop that happening with my other dc but I genuinely don’t know how.

I agree totally with you OP. My mother currently is that person . Yes she has had a shit year and things haven’t been good but no she does not want help finding a solution to make it better. It’s also like how some people and families seem to thrive on drama and fall out over things that would be almost a non issue to me. I know several of these people.

Something weird has happened in our society where people feel very hyper-observed and subject to judgment. Huge swathes of people have taken cover under a protective shield of victimhood. “Don’t have a go at me, I’m just a victim”.
It’s understandable, but very unhealthy, obviously.

I don't think people necessarily make a conscious choice to do so, but I do believe sometimes people struggle to move on from whatever situation/person/circumstance is causing then pain, because addressing the reality and moving on with life can be hard to accept.

Sometimes people stagnate or unconsciously put their lives on hold because if they have self-doubt or fear about what they'll have left if they do move on.