Botox & frozen faces

Aging is not good and signals dysfunction. Our children may benefit from current technology and may age more slowly, giving them more useful years of life.

Right now, it’s mostly cosmetic—there’s limits to how far we can push back aging, but hopefully in the future it won’t be. (Not that there’s nothing we can do, but we hope it can be more dramatic in the future).

i don’t understand people who are like, what’s wrong with aging? Like … I even feel sad to see my pets age.

No. You are confusing your dislike if how some women respond to an issue with the cause of that issue. You should be focusing on how to remove the cause rather than criticising the response if you are serious about improving things for women.

Exactly. On an individual basis, people deciding to have Botox seems fine. But at a society level it means that women are no longer allowed to be wrinkled. I think it’s setting a bad example for the next generation.

People saying that they don’t want to stop ageing and they just want to look ‘fresher’, that is a load of nonsense. Of course it is because they are the age they are that the unwanted wrinkles are appearing.

If you want to get Botox, OP, just do it. You have to go at it pretty hard to get the spoon with hair look and a good practitioner won't allow it. Just do minimum dose and see how you go. If you don't like it, it'll wear off in a few months. It's not a moral failing and it's entirely possible to get Botox while loving your family, doing Pilates and whatever else you've been told is somehow incompatible with a minor cosmetic procedure.

Aging is a privilege, not all of us get to grow old. Botox doesn't change the age of the heart or other organs, it won't prolong your life in any way.

I personally accept ageing, and I haven't felt that it holds me back at work. I don't like the idea of having poison injected into my face, and some of the women I know who do it, now have their 20 year old daughters doing Botox and fillers. I feel they have set a bad example. Also do we even know the long term impacts of Botox, this might only come out in 20 years time..?

I can think of better things to spend my money on. I do yoga, pilates, bike rides, and lots of dog walks. I try to stick to a healthy diet. For me this is better than Botox, and I happily accept my facial lines as part of growing older.

So, other than insulting and blaming other women (hardly an effective way to increase the self worth you feel is lacking) what do you suggest is done to address the root cause of the issue?
I'm assuming you've started other threads where you talk about the positive things we can do to increase the respect in which we are held as we age? About how we can uplift and advance each other so that our appearance becomes a much less significant part of our lives? How we can support older women and create positivity around their life stage?

If you think women stopping anti aging procedures is going to lead to older women being valued, or improve things even a little in that direction, you're dreaming.
Older women are devalued because they can't reproduce and are not as sexually appealing to men as younger ones; and what we do bring to the table, our knowledge, skills, wisdom and confidence is seen as a threat.
This has been the case long before botox was discovered, and has not become worse because older women now have the choice not to have visible wrinkles. If anything, there's a positive direction of travel resulting from women banding together and insisting on our rights. Their appearance is irrelevant to this. And your attempts to demean and belittle women who want to look a way you dislike is divisive and making easy scapegoats of other women for an issue they didn't cause.

What is there to debate? It’s non of your concern what someone does with their own face.

About as nice as OPs post!!

Yes, those of us who have one, tend to find it located in the head.

This would be true if we lived in a vacuum. We don't.

Yeah no, you're conditioned. We all are. It's ok to admit that.

@Jackiepumpkinhead

This faux concern is just an excuse to tear down women, it’s really unpleasant.

I'm not sure what you mean by " faux concern".

I am extremely concerned about the pressure on women to look young:the idea that youth is the only thing that is important when it comes to attractiveness.

How you interpret this concern as " tearing down women" is a mystery to me.

You really are trying to silence women who are voicing legitimate opinions and concerns.

OP I agree with some of what you are saying. I’m a feminist (the proper kind).

I have mixed feelings about this issue. I think the more reasonable explanation is some of us older women in careers see what happens as we age, the male gaze works in two ways. We appeal to it or we are judged on it.

Some women just want to fly under that radar, not get noticed for anything apart from their capabilities.

So I get why women do tweaks to achieve that. So they can extend their careers etc.

Until society stops conditioning women to behave or look a certain way this won’t change.

Let’s not bash women for complying, it’s men who need to change.

What a silly question OP.
Botox isn't compulsory. We are left entirely alone to age naturally if we choose. On an individual level I'd be amazed if anyone gave a jot how old you personally look or was pressurising you to have botox.
If you're an older woman who is feeling devalued, then you'll be devalued by default because of your age, because that's the way of our society.
If you are feeling pressure because of what other women are doing, that's on you and you need to develop courage of your own convictions rather than expect other women to ease things for you by making the same choices.
Goodness knows why you want to add to the negativity towards older women by singling out a subsection insult.
As for the faux question as to why they want to look that way, women who have botox clearly don't think they look worse for it or they wouldn't have it.
Maybe take your own advice and leave other women alone to navigate aging as they see fit.

Why do women feel the need to have darker and longer eyelashes? Why do they feel the need to paint their lips red? Why do they feel the need to follow fashion?

Basically, why aren’t we all going around with no make up, no hair dye, dressed in a burlap sack?

Why are women that don’t follow your own personal definition of how a woman should look and feel be labeled as brainwashed and following trends as if they have no mind of their own? What is an acceptable level of embellishment that that doesn’t subscribe to unreasonable female standards? Is mascara ok? Highlights? Shaving legs?

No one is silencing anyone! People are trying to explain why they get treatments and are being judged for not having any ‘individuality’ and generally being looked down on for not ageing ‘gracefully’. This faux concern is just an excuse to tear down women, it’s really unpleasant.

Oh dear Expressionless (great name for you), you need to learn what ‘objective’ means. Lots of women have explained to you why they have treatments. Lots of women have said they don’t and won’t.

Do you not have your hair done, nails painted, wear make up? Do you use moisturiser and occasionally a razor? Buy new clothes, have a facial or a pedicure? People like to look good, it makes them feel good, that includes men too. If you want to stay completely natural (which I doubt you are) then that’s great for you.