To think that you can absolutely buy consent

Loads of conditions. Some people may place conditions on the beliefs their partner needs to have, number of previous sex partners, them being single, them being rich, them being a sportstar, a celebrity etc. Some people want sex solely to reach a certain number of sex partners, to say they have ticked off a sexual partner bucket list, for a laugh, a dare, to say they fucked a famous person etc.

There are so many reasons people would choose to have and not have sex that have nothing to do with being attracted to a person and where the conditions aren’t met they decline to have sex

I just don’t get why money is the one reason where having sex for money is considered non-consensual.

Some have mentioned golddiggers and women like Bonnie Blue and I struggle to see them as non consenting.

Is your argument that if no cash is exchanged then a 12 year old can be considered to consent….?

Apologies if I'm missing the point but I thought conditional consent along the lines of "I'm definitely up for having PIV sex with you provided you use a condom" was ok?

I do wonder where people place golddiggers on their sexual coercion spectrum.

I take it you disagree with the consent or pay model, then? :D

Many people have jobs they do to pay the rent/mortgage. Would they do them for free? I wouldn't spend all day cutting people's hair for nothing. Pay me what I'm worth and I'll consent. So of course you can buy consent for sex. I am not speaking here of those wretches who are forced into it, so must do it whether they want to or not. Some women don't mind doing it, if they're paid properly.

But provided it isn't a gun-to-the-head/duress/exploitation situation (which is a different thing altogether, not to mention illegal), consent is consent. You/I either consent to do something in return for whatever or we don't - whether or not we like [wiping arses/cleaning/pulling pints/lapdancing] or actually want to do it isn't the same thing.

The idea that women aren't able to think for themselves because they have made a choice that somebody else finds unacceptable is a very slippery slope, I think.

Of course you can. I doubt many rich men would have the wives they otherwise. I also can't say I wouldn't have sex with some dude if he offered life changing money.

No, I understand they can make different choices from me, I just don't think consent is ever free and enthusiastic is money is involved. I'm not judging those women or saying they shouldn't be able to do what they're doing; I just don't think it's true consent.

Of course it can - I would never choose to do any job I've ever had if it wasn't for the money. Being paid is a fair exchange where I agree to do X, Y or Z in return for ABC amount of cash.

Unfortunately as you've seen above there are a lot of people who can't grasp that women are individuals who may make choices they would never make themselves, and justify this lack of understanding by deciding that they cannot possibly be thinking for themselves and must instead be having their decisions made for them by somebody else. Which is just as insulting and offensive as it sounds.

Some people can never have enough money, so maybe she wants the money? I actually think there's a whole lot more going on with her though, to be honest, none of it good, and actually, when she was doing her various stunts, she told the men to stop at various points, and they didn't so not a poster girl for consent in any way.

Like what? The only conditions I put on having sex is that I find the person attractive and I feel like having sex with them in that moment.

I'm sure there are other conditions that I would consider to involve a lack of consent, but I need to know what you're talking about to take a view on it either way.

What about the 12 year olds 'married' off for money? There is an exchange of cash and the 12 year old doesn't complain... so consent right?

I think you can if the sex worker has genuine choices and chooses this over other occupations but that’s not often the case

I agree with this, and I agree that it's mostly damaged women who enter sex work freely.

However, I also agree that, theoretically, you can buy consent. My work bores the pants off me, but I consent to spend hours a day doing it, after all.

I worked for a charity who supported women who worked in sex work and one of the first things I was taught was the difference perspectives on sex work and choice, I think people believe different things. I think fundamentally anyone who has someone profiiting off of their sex work - a boyfriend/pimp or an organised gang probably has very limited choice in that senario so that’s not consent. A lot of the women I worked with were being put out to work by intimate partners. The ones who weren’t had drug and alcohol issues, well actually they all did. But this was street sex work and ‘massage parlours’. I don’t know that someone can buy consent from someone who is that desperate that they don’t feel they have any other choice,

On the other hand my cousin was at uni, very much supported by her family while she was at uni so no desperatation, she started stripping, she used to do party buses and brag about how much money she got. She deffo didn’t sell sex, but it was a sexual service and she was consenting. No doubt in my mind. She’d be mortified now if anyone found out, 20 years later she’s very well to do and I doubt anyone knows what she got up to back then

Round of applause for this post.

Oh ffs. Of course you can't fucking BUY consent. Look at that sentence even!

Does someone like Bonnie Blue who is by now a multi millionaire doing it because she needs the money?

Well yes sex under any kind of duress should not be considered consenting. I am not talking about that.

I am talking about the idea that sex where money is a condition can never be considered to be consensual. But sex where other conditions are stipulated can be considered consensual.

That’s rubbish. Theres lots of stuff I wouldn’t do for free but I would do for money. Why should sex not be one of them? All the many many women who marry or are in relationships with rich ugly men wouldn’t look twice at them if they had no money. You think eg if Jeff Bezos or Harvey Weinstein were bin men that their wives would have been interested (I realise HW is now divorced obviously as the serial rapist stuff was too much even for his wife)?
It’s unpalatable but there are so many women who don’t give a shit and want to sell their bodies - eg Bonnie Blue and Lily Philips are doing this themselves and are not being coerced.

Of course, that would be your position. Most of these women need the money, so they're doing it under duress rather than of their own free will. It's as simple as that.