To realise very few people care about road rules or the Highway Code any more

Liverpool52 · 19/10/2025 20:55

Somebody posted a picture on the village WhatsApp, where we have a huge problem of people parking on pavements. She was outraged that people visiting the local church were so inconsiderate they'd blocked her in. When people pointed out she was being inconsiderate to pedestrians by parking on the pavement there was every excuse. Apparently it isn't against the highway code if it conveniences other drivers. 🤔

Doris86 · 16/10/2025 13:09

vivainsomnia · 24/09/2025 13:22

I agree with all but number 4. The usual signs encourage people to get onto one lane much sooner than just when the lanes merged.

Yes merging sooner means a very slight longer time, depending on how long the queue is, but those who decide to pass everybody queuing are assholes.they don't do it because they like to.folliw the rules, they do it because they have a sense of entitlement and think others should just make way to their more important self.

No the signs don’t tell you to get into the lane sooner than where they merge. They just tell you the lane is closing in 800/600 yards etc. Often accompanied by signs saying ‘Use both lanes when queuing’.

The people who straddle both lanes to stop the ‘queue jumpers’, thereby not allowing the traffic to fully use the available lanes, and causing tailbacks and gridlock in the roads and roundabouts behind are the assholes.

MaybeNotBob · 08/10/2025 20:18

I drive in France quite regularly, and it's very noticeable how much better the lane discipline is over there. Particularly as so many of their motorways are only 2 lanes. It's not exactly rocket surgery.

dynamiccactus · 08/10/2025 18:10

I was in Germany at the weekend and it was really noticeable how good peoples' lane discipline was on the motorway. However, a couple of factors help with that.

One - no speed limits on those particular motorways (A7 and A23), or not for most of them. When someone is doing over 100mph you shift out of the outside lane sharpish!

Two - no lorries allowed on Sundays which means much more space generally and there are far fewer vehicles you need to overtake, it's quite easy to cruise in the inside lane.

Needlenardlenoo · 04/10/2025 08:54

I have noticed (since changing to a job in a different area) that whether drivers obey the rule of giving way to a pedestrian at a side road, and pavements being for people not bikes, is area dependent.

In my borough drivers do generally give way to pedestrians at side roads and it's rare to encounter a cyclist on the pavement. In the borough I commute to, it's the opposite. I have to really watch myself not to be mown down by mum or dad and kids on multiple bikes and/or to be run over crossing side roads!

ProfessionalWhimsicalSkidaddler · 04/10/2025 07:02

Not illegal as such. Because there are clauses such as congestion. It doesn’t have to be done in a dangerous manner at all. The AA et al. also say that so… I’m a professional driver with additional training and see non dangerous undertaking receiving points all the time. But I’ll leave it there because this is clearly pointless.

thing47 · 03/10/2025 12:54

This. Is. Not. True.
You might get 3 points if it is decided that you did so in a dangerous or careless fashion.

Why do you continue to post incorrect information? Just check with a law firm or look on the AA or RAC’s website - they literally say ‘it is not illegal.

ProfessionalWhimsicalSkidaddler · 03/10/2025 10:50

thing47 · 03/10/2025 08:27

It doesn't. Not in and of itself. The authorities would need to prove it had been executed in a dangerous manner for it to meet the threshold of a dangerous driving charge. I'm not sure how many different ways I can explain this...

At no point have I suggested drivers should undertake, by the way. I would generally advise against it. I merely posted to explain that it is not illegal per se.

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You can explain it any which way you want. If you undertake when not in congestion, filtering or otherwise and are seen, you will get three points.

thing47 · 03/10/2025 08:27

ProfessionalWhimsicalSkidaddler · 03/10/2025 05:38

Right but undertaking falls into the dangerous driving category… dangerous driving is illegal. Ergo…

might take a step to get there but the result is the same. They only don’t say it’s illegal itself because there are times (like traffic) where it isn’t and laws can’t be grey or murky and the majority of people would use that as a get out clause. Like you by the sound of it.

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It doesn't. Not in and of itself. The authorities would need to prove it had been executed in a dangerous manner for it to meet the threshold of a dangerous driving charge. I'm not sure how many different ways I can explain this...

At no point have I suggested drivers should undertake, by the way. I would generally advise against it. I merely posted to explain that it is not illegal per se.

ProfessionalWhimsicalSkidaddler · 03/10/2025 05:38

thing47 · 02/10/2025 23:04

As I said in my previous post, not all Highway Code rules are backed up by the force of law. This one isn't.

You can get points for undertaking in a dangerous or careless manner, not for undertaking per se. Weaving in and out of lanes would most likely meet this threshold; simply passing someone on an inside lane in a controlled manner and while under the speed limit would not.

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Right but undertaking falls into the dangerous driving category… dangerous driving is illegal. Ergo…

might take a step to get there but the result is the same. They only don’t say it’s illegal itself because there are times (like traffic) where it isn’t and laws can’t be grey or murky and the majority of people would use that as a get out clause. Like you by the sound of it.

thing47 · 02/10/2025 23:04

ProfessionalWhimsicalSkidaddler · 02/10/2025 20:26

So teach me oh wise one

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As I said in my previous post, not all Highway Code rules are backed up by the force of law. This one isn't.

You can get points for undertaking in a dangerous or careless manner, not for undertaking per se. Weaving in and out of lanes would most likely meet this threshold; simply passing someone on an inside lane in a controlled manner and while under the speed limit would not.

NewPapaGuinea · 02/10/2025 20:43

vivainsomnia · 24/09/2025 14:58

It's merge in turn at the point of the closure and NOT "half a mile before"
So you think that because some people don't understand the rules, decide to act fairly, it gives the higher above who know the rules the right to avoid the queue, avoid the frustration of waiting, making it 20 second quicker to their destination?

I know the rules, but I still don't think it gives the right to cross before many people who have been patiently waiting. Just like I don't pass middle lane huggers on the left, or rush from the back of the queue in a supermarket when a new till opens, because rightly or wrongly, it is rude and entitled to think you shouldn't wait when others do.

I see it all the time where people will sit in a lane to turn left/right even though there’s 2 lanes left/right and one is completely empty. By your logic I should join the sheeple because they’re too ignorant to read the road markings.

ProfessionalWhimsicalSkidaddler · 02/10/2025 20:26

Weekmindedfool · 02/10/2025 20:24

You don’t understand the difference between the law and the HW code.

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So teach me oh wise one

Weekmindedfool · 02/10/2025 20:24

ProfessionalWhimsicalSkidaddler · 02/10/2025 20:19

Rule 268
Do not overtake on the left or move to a lane on your left to overtake. In congested conditions, where adjacent lanes of traffic are moving at similar speeds, traffic in left-hand lanes may sometimes be moving faster than traffic to the right. In these conditions you may keep up with the traffic in your lane even if this means passing traffic in the lane to your right. Do not weave in and out of lanes to overtake.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/the-highway-code/motorways-253-to-273

do not. Not must or should. If it wasn’t illegal, you wouldn’t get points for it.

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You don’t understand the difference between the law and the HW code.

Weekmindedfool · 02/10/2025 20:23

vivainsomnia · 24/09/2025 13:22

I agree with all but number 4. The usual signs encourage people to get onto one lane much sooner than just when the lanes merged.

Yes merging sooner means a very slight longer time, depending on how long the queue is, but those who decide to pass everybody queuing are assholes.they don't do it because they like to.folliw the rules, they do it because they have a sense of entitlement and think others should just make way to their more important self.

You are wrong.

ProfessionalWhimsicalSkidaddler · 02/10/2025 20:19

thing47 · 01/10/2025 13:21

It isn't, in fact. Undertaking is not de facto illegal; it can be if carried out in a dangerous manner (ie swerving across lanes), and then it comes under dangerous driving or driving without due care and attention. A controlled manoeuvre of driving faster on the inside lane than the cars outside you is advised against in The Highway Code, but it is not against the law (some parts of The Highway Code have legal weight and some do not).

Rule 268
Do not overtake on the left or move to a lane on your left to overtake. In congested conditions, where adjacent lanes of traffic are moving at similar speeds, traffic in left-hand lanes may sometimes be moving faster than traffic to the right. In these conditions you may keep up with the traffic in your lane even if this means passing traffic in the lane to your right. Do not weave in and out of lanes to overtake.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/the-highway-code/motorways-253-to-273

do not. Not must or should. If it wasn’t illegal, you wouldn’t get points for it.

The Highway Code - Motorways (253 to 274) - Guidance - GOV.UK

Rules for motorways, including rules for signals, joining the motorway, driving on the motorway, lane discipline, overtaking, stopping and leaving the motorway. A number of the rules for motorways also apply to other high-speed roads.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/the-highway-code/motorways-253-to-273

FrogsWormsandButterflies · 01/10/2025 17:31

In Australia they have used signs that say “don’t be a dick, merge like a zip”
Theres a roundabout near me having some major works done at the moment and the queues are awful because people don’t merge properly, and anyone that dares to merge correctly is usually given loads of abuse by the driver who feels they are “pushing in”

Matsukaze · 01/10/2025 16:07

JacquesHarlow · 24/09/2025 13:08

AIBU here - is anyone on Mumsnet like me, and thinks about the Highway Code or bothers to follow its guidance? Please join me if so!

For my job I have to drive a LOT. I drive pretty much all over the UK.

Yes, the standard of driving is far better than many countries around the world. But something I have noticed increasingly (and especially since the pandemic) is this:

Very few people indicate right on a roundabout. You get this bizarre situation where someone approaches a roundabout in a right hand lane, doesn't indicate, careers around the roundabout for 270 degrees, then once at their junction, they indicate off left to show they're taking the exit!!
Middle lane hogging is now third lane hogging On any four lane motorway in the UK, I find the vast majority of drivers have moved to the third lane and sit there at 60 or 65mph. The first and second lane have been re-designated as a lorry lane, and as a lorry overtaking lane. Again, this is not the Highway Code.
Phone driving is an absolute epidemic. On the school run people drive off holding their phones and checking messages... next to a SCHOOL where children are still walking and crossing the road.
Merge in turn is completely ignored - instead you see bizarre behaviour like road captains who sit straddling two lanes, a mile before the merge, to stop "queue jumpers". This goes completely against the road rules and the Code but once again, British drivers know best and no one can tell them otherwise
Give way if parked cars are on your left again seems to be ignored. I've seen plenty of fellow women do this one, where they barrel through hoping the other person will concede, and then when asked to reverse their car, go into a complete blind panic and start swearing and shouting for the other person to reverse instead.
Give way to traffic already on the motorway when joining Again, forget it. When I'm in lane 1, and I see a slip road ahead, I try and move over. I can't straightway because middle lane hoggers, however I wait for a gap and then move in time. Only to find the car that is joining isn't happy I've made a space...because they want to slalom across two lanes and barrel their way into lane 2 or 3 in one quick glide! WTF.

Yeah I've shared too many examples, but I could share dozens more.

It's like the Highway Code is irrelevant to most drivers. They decide "what is fair". So if they feel they don't want to wait and there's an obstruction on their left? Barrel on through!

The only way around this is either

increased traffic policing of road offences, which we all know won't happen because we have fewer police
mandatory driving retraining, which everyone would hate

Is this just me? Does anyone else care about this or notice this, or am I a lone female voice in this space and actually it's fine to just make up the rules as we go along?

Thanks in advance

There's a lot of people who don't seem to know what to do at a roundabout in general, nevermind not indicating to go right.
Loads of mini roundabouts near where I live, don't get me started on those either!

thing47 · 01/10/2025 13:21

It isn't, in fact. Undertaking is not de facto illegal; it can be if carried out in a dangerous manner (ie swerving across lanes), and then it comes under dangerous driving or driving without due care and attention. A controlled manoeuvre of driving faster on the inside lane than the cars outside you is advised against in The Highway Code, but it is not against the law (some parts of The Highway Code have legal weight and some do not).

ProfessionalWhimsicalSkidaddler · 01/10/2025 12:01

Colourpurplepalette · 01/10/2025 11:52

If you’re doing 70 on the inside lane and someone is doing 65 in lane 3 you will naturally pass them at some point. Is this illegal? There’s a whole empty lane between you and them and you are just driving the speed of the road and the traffic. The person in lane 3 is not following the rules of the road certainly, but in naturally passing them on the inside are you also breaking the law?

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Yes it’s illegal unless in congestion where lanes naturally travel at different speeds. You should never pass on the left. There is a video on big jobbers page where he discusses this. In it, lane 3 and 4 are congested with a clear lane 1 and 2. Someone has sent the video off and the person undertaking has received 3 points but the clowns in lane 3/4 didn’t - I think. Grossly unfair in my view but the rules are the rules and two wrongs apparently don’t make a right (or a wrong for one of them)

Colourpurplepalette · 01/10/2025 11:52

ProfessionalWhimsicalSkidaddler · 30/09/2025 21:10

I’ve just driven 200 miles up and down the m1 and it was an absolute nightmare. I use cruise control always so I know I’m maintaining a constant speed - maybe a little increase downhill - and people have started speeding up as I’m overtaking them. Only in the last few months but it’s massively increased. The amount of people in lane 2/3 too. I used to undertake in lane 1 happily but I saw a big jobber video where someone got points so I now go across all 4 lanes to overtake, sometimes flashing as I do and honestly it’s like they have no idea! I’m tempted to start a thread asking why the fuck people lane hog.

If you’re doing 70 on the inside lane and someone is doing 65 in lane 3 you will naturally pass them at some point. Is this illegal? There’s a whole empty lane between you and them and you are just driving the speed of the road and the traffic. The person in lane 3 is not following the rules of the road certainly, but in naturally passing them on the inside are you also breaking the law?

PauliesWalnuts · 01/10/2025 11:47

LakieLady · 30/09/2025 13:29

There's a set of lights in my (narrow) high street that has 4 phases, and slow ones at that.

Cyclists don't cycle across there when the lights are red, but bump up onto the (also narrow) pavement to ride past the lights instead. One almost ran into me the other day and had the audacity to call me a cunt as he bumped down the kerb into the road.

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Not excusing his behaviour at all, BUT some embedded motion sensors (the things that count/time traffic that works with the traffic light rhythm) are not sensitive enough to be able to tell when a bicycle is waiting at the lights, so sometimes we do have to either jump a red or make a different manoeuvre. Ironically there's one outside the national cycling centre in Manchester which prevented GB squad riders from exiting the facility on to the main road in a legal manner during their training rides.

lilkitten · 01/10/2025 11:43

I drive a lot for work, and other drivers not following the code annoys me a lot. In my mind (autistic stubbornness), if you don't know the highway code then you shouldn't have a driving licence. And if you know it, but ignore it, I'd like to do a psych evaluation to see why you would do that (I usually conclude they're a selfish dick, but I want to know why!)

ProfessionalWhimsicalSkidaddler · 30/09/2025 21:10

I’ve just driven 200 miles up and down the m1 and it was an absolute nightmare. I use cruise control always so I know I’m maintaining a constant speed - maybe a little increase downhill - and people have started speeding up as I’m overtaking them. Only in the last few months but it’s massively increased. The amount of people in lane 2/3 too. I used to undertake in lane 1 happily but I saw a big jobber video where someone got points so I now go across all 4 lanes to overtake, sometimes flashing as I do and honestly it’s like they have no idea! I’m tempted to start a thread asking why the fuck people lane hog.

DappledThings · 30/09/2025 16:16

dynamiccactus · 30/09/2025 15:46

You need to do one or the other.

If everyone has got into the lane they need early, it will move, albeit slowly, so just join it and follow what everyone else is doing. It's not clever in that scenario to go to the end and force your way in because you'll force what was a slow moving line to stop altogether.

A lot of places do now say merge in turn and that's what people do. A I go you go works really well but it also doesn't work when someone tries to push in when it's not their turn.

So both methods need people to play fair.

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Nope. If one lane is free and you are not at the merge point then it remains the right thing to travel to the merge point and merge there. Just because everyone else has misunderstood how it is meant to work doesn’t mean pandering their ignorance.

You see it less often these days. I think the message about merging at the merge point being correct is finally getting through.

I get annoyed when I am already in the lane that is staying open and people in the other lane start indicating to try and make me let them in early. No mate, I'm not creating a gap here in the wrong place, you go to the end and merge properly. I don't let people in there. I do allow people to merge correctly