AIBU to just throw my hands in the air re elderly parent?

Tell him he has a choice.

Choice 1:
You will help him to find and lock in a gardener and cleaner for one day a week and a handyman one day a month. He will have to pay for this.

Choice 2:
Or he can sell and move to a manageable home.

Choice 3:
Or he can do nothing, in which case you will get social services involved at some point - for safeguarding reasons.

This bothers you. Rightly so. If you avoid the hard conversation then you are only prolonging the situation.

It is not your responsibility to allow him to absent himself of his responsibility. You can't expect any other outcome if you won't speak up.

You can’t make him move. We had the same dilemma with my dm after my df died. Lived in a big semi, 100ft garden. Totally overwhelming for her, but didn’t see why she should move and I agreed. She’d been there for about 30 years. However, after a hospilization because she wasn’t looking after herself, she decided to downsize.

I think you can raise him moving, but ultimately, it has to be his choice. I would make it clear, however, that you are not going to maintain his house.

@PlutarchHeavensbee
You really have a terrible situation going on there and for your own sanity you need to cut back on what you do. Your father is not even a nice person. Put your phone on silent over night. You could have a pretend illness for a few weeks and see how he gets on.
For various reasons my sister and I are LC with my mother, who is in her 90s. My brother visits her once a week with her shopping. He takes her to medical appointments but that is it. My mother knows that there is no point moaning to us as we just say ‘do you need to go into a home?’. She has carers, a cleaner and a gardener because none of us will do these things for her.
My children will not be doing care for me. Why would anyone want someone they love to be their skivvy? I have spoken to my children. They would arrange care for me but not do it.

Oh OP it's so hard. My friends and I talk about our elderly parents a lot and it makes such a difference if a DP is adaptable and open to support from outside the family. My DF unfortunately isn't either so I feel your frustration. Not saying we have solved anything at the moment but I hold firm on what I can / cannot do on visits and get him to prioritise or work out what someone else can do. He has a cleaner now and a carer for DM, so that is an improvement - but he hit crisis several times before this happened. And the house is still cluttered! I have not succeeded in that at all.

What a lovely way for your GP to go in his own bed but sadly many, many older people won't have this experience at all. I'd never force a relative to move but I would want to downsize myself and clear out a lot of my crap whilst I was still fit enough to manage it.

But they clearly have been having conversations with him, which he is ignoring. You can have a million ck variations about fixing and maintaining the house. But if he won’t do it, what can OP do?!

The issue is that OP and sibling have their own lives, children and jobs and don’t have the time to help him maintain that four bedroom house he is adamant he wants to stay in. He needs to at least accept help by way of cleaner, gardener etc

Except we aren't all going to become infirm it's just what we're led to believe my one GPs died last year aged 105 he still played table tennis 3 times a week, did all his own housework, shopping, cooking etc. Lived in a 3 bedroom house that was immaculately kept. Surrounded by memories of his children, grandchildren and great-grandchildren playing in the garden.
I can't imagine what his life would have been like if he'd have decided that he needed to move away from his home of 80ish years just because people thought he'd become infirm
Happily for us he went to bed one night and never woke up.

I don’t know why people seem to think they need to take over for their parents just because they’re older. He sounds capable of making his own decisions, so just leave him to make them.

You don’t need to step in and do anymore than you did when he was in his sixties. He’s just being lazy expecting you to arrange things.

We're all going to age and become infirm - it's hardly a surprise to anyone so people should make plans imo. I plan to move to a flat or bungalow long before I'm very elderly. I wouldn't want to be a huge burden to my kids personally 🤷‍♀️

I look after a ( very very ) old person. My mum..Change can be extremely frightening for them. It might be worth introducing a very friendly helper if he can afford it. Maybe to help tidy up initislly. If trusts builds he might agree to more. Sometimes relatives get the brunt of it but riendly strangers are tolerated better.

It’s an awful situation to be in :(
my mother in law is in a 4 bed house alone and independent, thankfully with a downstairs bathroom. She only finally accepted help after falling down the stairs and lying undiscovered for 24 hours (the one and only time my partner didn’t check on her that day). After months in hospital bed blocking, she finally agreed to a stair lift, carers and a cleaner and gardener and that has made life a whole heap easier.
she doesn’t actually let the carers do anything, just makes them a cup of tea and have a sit down 🤣
we’ve installed cameras throughout downstairs that my partner can access from his phone and she now wears a panic button (keeps setting it off accidentally).
but. She’s happy she’s in the home she’s lived in for 60 years, and can still get out and about to her social dances etc. it’s a good compromise. One your father is going to have to realise at some point needs to happen if he wants to stay there.

This - absolutely. I have made a rod for my own back with my 92 year old father, who lives alone but around the corner from me and his expectations as to what I could and should do for him have made my life a living hell over the last 7 years. He’s housebound, only in receipt of a state pension and pension credit but reasonably fit for his age despite being unsteady on his feet.

I work full time and I’m an only child. I also have two small grandchildren that I try to see regularly and my own house to clean, shopping to do, but despite this my father thinks I should put his needs and wants before everything else, without exception. I do his shopping, his cleaning ring him twice a day and see him for at least 45 mins after work everyday but it’s nowhere near enough. He’s told me that I should give up my job and move him into my own home to care for him, despite the fact that he hates my poor husband and is a nasty shit whenever he sees him, calling him an arsehole. He’s a racist, a misogynist - who openly says that women are a lesser species and are there to cook, clean and look after men. We had a huge row a few weeks ago when I finally snapped and told him that what I did was the absolute maximum care that I could provide and told him bluntly that there was no way he was moving in with me. I told him that I didn’t think it was right for him to expect me to wipe his arse for him when the time came and his response was - why!? I wiped yours??

He rings at all hours of the day and night and if I dont answer as I’m at work - he just rings again and again and again - despite knowing that if I don’t answer it’s because I can’t. He rang at four in the morning a few weeks ago - leaving a ranting voicemail to tell me that the bulb in his kitchen had gone and to “get your husband round pronto to sort it out.”

It’s slowly destroying me. There no way out because when I try to pull back and do less - he plays the guilt cards and tells me that it’s my duty to look after him. I’ve tried my best to leave him to stew in his own juice but then I sit worrying that he’s had a fall and might be on the floor. I can’t persuade him to have a pendant alarm - even though he can afford it - I’ve even offered to pay for it myself and told him it’s for my peace of mind but he won’t budge and is doing it deliberately to keep me shackled.

I truly feel for you OP. It’s an awful situation to find yourself in and I don’t have any answers. I just wanted to let you know that you’re not alone.

You need a mantra that you can keep repeating until it goes in. So, when he phones with requests for house help you say something like “I’ve explained why I can’t do that. This is why I think you need an easier property. I can respect your decision to stay there, if that’s what you really want, but I cannot do xyz”

I have strong prejudices against old people living in too big properties. I don't care what amazing personal memories they have about the place. Move ON.

OP: you won't keep your sanity unless you establish firm rules: "I will do X, I won't do Y" lists. The "Will do" list should be fairly short. The rules about what goes on the lists need to be simple so you don't second guess yourself. I hope you keep us updated. x

Surely it is better that they live in a home suitable for their needs? I am glad my mum took the decision herself to sell the large family home with huge garden for a 2 bed flat in landscaped gardens looked after by gardeners. She is 90 and very happy with neighbours just a few steps away and emergency help if needed.

OP isn’t local and has DC and other responsibilities. There is only so much she can do. OP you need to set boundaries but ultimately if your dad won’t accept advice or help then any accidents are down to him. Can he afford to pay for help to come in?

My parents are the same although younger than OPs dad, Both have health issues but Refuse to discuss anything about the future (LPAs , wills and location there of) . Refuse to discuss having a cleaner or even the groceries delivered to the kitchen, apparently all delivery drivers are casing the joint 🙄.

The house is dirty, chaotic and full of stuff, I dread the time I’ll end up sorting it all out. But there is nothing I can do and I’ve just had to accept it and make damn sure I don’t behave like this for my DCs.

I hope you are not suggesting OP is abandoning anyone?

My elderly step dad needs increasing amounts of help. It is taking up more and more of my time, no one else to share it with, and its starting to affect my health. Should I work myself into a health collapse so that he can do whatever he wants? I dont give him ultimatums. But I also tell him what I can and cant do - like not being able to sit up with him all night because he is lonely and wakeful when I have to go to work the next day.

OP, you need to have a frank discussion with your relative about what you can realistically do. And where there are needs he has which need other arrangements to be made. I would offer to help make those arrangements, and be clear you are still there for him, but be clear about your limits. There is nothing abandoning about that.

FWIW I think a lot of older people are in denial about how much help they need to stay independent. Its understandable, must be very scary to admit you are losing ability.

Exactly, if he’s able to jump out of bed he is ok for the time being, an accident may happen in the future that will change his mind but for the moment he is coping and is sociable

I sympathise op, I have literally just got home from staying with my mum for 2days because she refused to have a new hip when she needed it a few years ago, she can now barely walk. I am able to work remotely but I was in tears earlier today from the frustration of having to deal with her. As a family we share the responsibility and have carers but one of us goes round every day, my sibling is on holiday which meant I did 2 days on the trot (I live over an hour away) and it's nearly broken me.

He’s stubborn, leave him to it (obviously visit, call and check in from time to time) at the moment as he seems to be coming just about ok, he will probably change his mind in a few years when he becomes more frail

OP you are being unreasonable.
I am guessing your Dad has lived in the house for many years and he will have a huge emotional attachment to it.
Please leave him be, the emotional upheaval would be too much for him to bear.
There will come a time when he might have to move but he hasn't reached it just yet.
I know from experience how hard this situation will be but please trust me you cannot and shouldn't try and make your Dad do anything he doesn't want to do x

That's fine if the oldest child wants to. But people have their own lives and responsibilities elsewhere.

If someone is living and working in London for example they can't just quit their job, dragging their family up to a rural village to help an older person. There are alternatives.

Btw my own DM did move across the country to help my Nana, but that was her choice. She wanted to and was able to.

A lot of people are not in that position, so stop trying to derail a thread telling the OP she is shit for not chucking her life away to assist her ungrateful DD.

You have all my sympathy! DMIL declined with vascular dementia after DFIL died, but soldiered on, insisting that all was well and that she could still drive and play bridge at the local golf and tennis club, and that she had too many friends to leave her network. Except that she didn't, and she relied increasingly heavily on DSIL plus carers 4x daily for eight more years, (we live 300 miles and six hours away). Eventually DSIL needed surgery for an ACL injury, which took her out of commission for eight weeks and arranged respite care for DMIL in a residential home. Three weeks later Covid struck and we were all locked down for six months, by which time the dementia had progressed to a point where there could be no question of her returning home alone, and her cash funds were running out. So we sold the house, and cleared it out. Not a happy memory, even now.

I dislike the lack of responsibility and excuses made for elderly parents who could make a plan before things get this far.

What excuses are there to get to 88 and not have a plan in place or discuss such things with your adult children especially when they live hours away barring disabilities?

My parents already know that I am not going to move back to them once they get to an age where they need care. I live 4,000 miles away here in the UK, have three children, one who DH and I will likely be caring for until either he goes or we go. My sister lives 10 hours drive from them and she had her own child and moved away from their area due to the lack of job opportunities.

Plus, they were carers for my mother’s parents and after doing that for years with my sister and I assisting in turns, and they would not want to put us through the same again.