my 17 year old daughter is so babyish

There isn’t a spike in diagnoses because people are being made aware of what autism can look like in women and girls.

The so-called “spike” is because the assessment criteria is based on an outdated classical male presentation which meant there were generations of women who were left undiagnosed.

Growing awareness and understanding means that females who would have previously been dismissed are now being identified. That’s actually a good thing. I don’t understand the sniffy comments about this - the rate of neurodivergence is still very small, even with the much-maligned “spike”.

If you don’t know what autism in girls can look like, it’s very easy to miss it. Even medical professionals and teachers often don’t know what to look for as they’ve been trained on the stereotypical neurodivergent male. I think it’s helpful for people who have experience of neurodivergence to suggest that OP looks into this in more detail.

None of us can or should diagnose, but if there’s a chance of this being neurodivergence then OP should definitely look closer and either get it confirmed or ruled out.

For reference, I have autistic twins, one of whom also has a very significant learning disability. I got diagnosed after they were - I really wish I’d known earlier as it would have saved a lifetime of feeling lost and inadequate.

I was very immature/naive at 17, I was teased and laughed at, it didn't help that I was at an all-girls' school and was scared of boys, and was a later developer physically. I was also quite "eccentric" in that I didn't follow any modern culture (this was in the 1970s and I had no idea about the music etc, I won a Thin Lizzy record in a raffle and I had never heard of them and was amazed when I played it, I had never heard such music before).

I was very upset the day I overheard my grandfather saying "she's such a funny little thing, how will she ever get a boyfriend?" I never really forgave him.

Then I went to university (still aged 17 actually). I reinvented myself, grew up and had potential boyfriends coming out of my ears, like any normal 17-year-old on a male-dominated course. I went on to have a very successful professional life. My personal life has been interesting (first marriage ended in divorce but that was not my doing) but I have had a great time overall. I remained a bit "eccentric" in that I have made some bold and unusual decisions in my life and have never "played it safe" but I am not noticeably odd.

Am I autistic? No diagnosis but I do wonder sometimes (I happen to know a lot about it because of my profession) . My son is.

It is fine to be "different". But she also does need to learn, as PP have said, about things like keeping safe and, sadly, being aware that not everyone is a good person.

Hear hear!

Sometimes things do need specific help or diagnosis, but there is a worrying trend to want to pathologise and homogenise all behaviours these days, even those that are not particularly troubling, just quirky.

I also notice how growing up as fast as possible is celebrated as somehow superior, yet it seems to me to bring plenty of problems with it.

That said, op, I'd talk to her about allowing people space socially and see what her response is. All young people need guidance on certain things and we sometimes forget to notice how we are presenting. I remember my mum pointing out to a young teen me that a boy I had a crush on and I were "circling each other like dogs on heat." I think we were (always trying to brush when we walked past each other etc) and it made me take notice and be a little more subtle! It worked too, as he asked me out!

But aren't there physical and learning problems with Williams syndrome? The OP didn't mention anything other than being immature and a bit overly friendly.

She sounds lovely.

OP, I'm eccentric. I'm a 31 year old woman with an extensive teddy collection. I collect Pokémon cards and play it on my switch. I play DnD, board games, and video games. I have a Sphynx cat and pet rats. I come across a little offbeat socially. People also find me funny, and I have lots of friends, I'm married with a child, and I'm a mental health nurse. I'm 100% an undiagnosed neurodivergent lol and it hasn't held me back. Your daughter could be too, but even if she isn't, everyone is just different. Isn't it fun to be a bit quirky or eccentric? The world would be so dull if everyone was the same. Also, isn't it a shame that when we become adults, we're expected to drop all the fun things from childhood? What makes some hobbies more childish than others? Why is it acceptable for adults to collect candles or stamps, but not plushies or trading cards? Who cares! The world is full of different people and she will find her crowd.

Also, being friendly and warm is a lovely trait. If she is too trusting and therefore vulnerable to exploitation or harm in anyway, spend some time talking to her about people and their intentions, and warning signs that someone may not be so nice.

Being very childlike can be a sign of autism in girls.

A family member of a close friend has Williams Syndrome, and it does indeed sound like this. Being very ‘young’ emotionally for their age, and being very enthusiastic and close with everyone.
From what I observed with this person, in terms of emotional development the ‘childhood’ phase extends through the teens and into the twenties - it is very sweet and endearing, but of course also makes them vulnerable. The ‘teenage’ phase tends to come in late twenties/early thirties.

Will she be going to university or what is her plan for the future?

No need for hostility, or an armchair pseudo diagnosis.

Yes and she has the whole rest of her life to be taken advantage of because she's vulnerable due to her naivety and emotional immaturity. What a bunch of bull, I'm glad you never saw my DS.

OP she is sounding typical of someone with ASD, what would have been Aspergers syndrome in old money. Keep encouraging her independence in small steps with lots of help and support from you. She's done well to cope so well at secondary school but she might find 'the real world' far more difficult.

"Very very eccentric" isn't just young for her age. It is definitely something to be investigated. You would be doing her a disservice if you do not trust your instinct and follow up on it.

Start by reading up on autism in girls.

My friends son has William syndrome. You can't miss the physical appearance.

Lots of people saying it's not autism
Op I was diagnosed age 50 with autism
That was a lifetime of not coping,and being drugged up with every antidepressant possible,one after another after another, because I kept getting told I was depressed,every time I reached out for help .
I was fobbed off constantly by doctors,they don't have the time or patience to notice a woman with autism...just like teachers with 30 in their class don't notice the shy girl not talking,they are just glad she is behaving.
A lifetime of forcing myself to try to fit in to a box not made for me ,a lifetime of being taken advantage of in lots of not nice ways .
If there is any possibility she may be autistic, getting a diagnosis will help her understand herself,so she can live a life that's true to herself,and understand her strengths and weaknesses,.
Understanding is power

What is your relationship like with her Op?

I can’t shake sense that that way you talk about her… well, you don’t seem to think much of her

This post is so spiky and I'm not sure why.

OP is just casting round for opinions, not defending herself in a court of law.

There are worse issues op, but I can see why it might be starting to bother you. I'd start with the enthusiasm on meeting people and have a chat to her about . giving people space. She might open up as to what her thinking is ie; she may say she feels shy and it is a role she has played over and over so uses it as a crutch, or she may not realise people don't always appreciate it. Her answers may give you a steer as to what is driving it.

If she is small in stature she might have just got stuck in a rut of what she feels "works" for her in a social setting. Could you suggest her teachers give her some role of responsibility or similar to bring out another side of her?

My daughter was very similar in behaviour to yours at around the same age and is at the mild end of the autistic spectrum. ASD was my first thought when reading your first post. People on the autistic spectrum tend to mature later than neurotypical people but they get there in the end. My daughter is now in her late twenties and has a masters degree (distinction), works, lives in a lovely basement flat, drives, has friends and a good social life. She still has some quirks but these are part of her personality.

If it were Williams syndrome, the OP's daughter would almost certainly not be in a mainstream school. Williams causes learning disabilities as well as the classic facial features and overfriendliness.lt is rare and would have been diagnosed in babyhood or very early childhood.

I don’t think it’s unreasonable for people to flag there may be something more going on, lots of females aren’t diagnosed as ND until older.
If she’s thinking of university maybe suggest a gap year first to grow up a bit.

Same here. I am late diagnosed ADHD and Autistic and agree totally with this post and very much resonate with the below paragraph.

"Bad things can happen to girls with autism, who seem able to cope with the world."

OP, please listen to mumofoneAloneandwell's brilliant advice. A lot of autistic girls mask and although seem strong on the surface, they are vulnerable.

Your daughter sounds like me when I was young. I was young for my age, naive and trusting (still am 😔) and was taken advantage of by different people (not just men). I wish I had had someone had noticed and looked out for me.

I think she sounds rather wonderful! She may be naive and trusting but that is a quality op, unless you feel she is at serious risk of being harmed or hurt (and it doesn’t sound like she is)

I am picking up on irritation that she isn’t more sophisticated and doing what you perceive as ‘normal’ things at her age - but my dc have all been completely different to me and my life experience. All are naive and young for their age and their friends too, I put this down to the pandemic and a good childhood where they didn’t need to learn how horribly shit life can be.

Celebraring who she is will protect her from losing confidence and self esteem. In your place I would be giving her more responsibility. Working. Travelling alone. A weekend with her friends camping and generally exposing her gradually to different life experiences so she becomes more mature and responsible. Cooking and budgeting etc.

She sounds great and enjoy it whilst you can.

My DD1, who is 16 and AuDHD (autism and ADHD) is like this. I love the bones of her but it’s very, very wearing at times. I was looking at another thread with a mum who is sad her 7 year old is growing up and I wondered if I could articulate the complex feelings when that doesn’t happen at quite the rate it normally does.

Then I hear from friends whose kids are out getting drunk at parties and remember this age can be exhausting in other ways as well!

It’s lovely your DD has friends. My DD lost all hers - we’re slowly building up again from the local ND community

Not sure why people are triggered by others flagging autism.
I don't see how having an autism label/diagnosis can in itself cause anxiety, my anxiety was much worse when I was masking hard (even masking to myself), but once I got the "label" I could actually be myself and reduce my anxiety massively.

My ASD son is like this and he still
looks like a cherub although he’s 13 now. I have concerns too about how he will navigate the world and am trying to train him to think about other peoples motives.

my plan is to get him to work for a year after school so that he’s of a similar maturity when he does start university. Maybe your daughter would benefit from something similar?

I think it would be worth looking into the features of autism in girls. It's definitely not Williams Syndrome, but your description of your daughter resonates with me and my experiences of teenage girls and young women with Aspergers Syndrome.

I was young for my age at 17. I grew up a lot in my early 20s. I’m NT.

sometimes people just take a bit longer to mature.