Private school grief

Do you plan on having more kids? We decided to go private for secondary and this year our second child started. It is a lot of money. I think maybe men feel the financial pressures more then women, even if the woman is working as well.

Have you thought of state first then private? It is possible to get into top private secondary schools from state. Both my dc are in top academic schools and both were in state primary.

The saddest thing is that Labour who are supposed to be be about supporting people have ensured that private achools become more elite and less accessible for the socially mobile and education focused aspirational families because they added 20% to the fees to cut out the people qho might have just about afforded it.

This is true. My DD is at a state secondary and I was very struck by how middle class her group of friends are. They are definitely from the kind of families who sent their kids to private schools in the 80/90s.

I think the poster saying everything is changing is spot on. Private schools are becoming out of reach financially for the academic upper middle class (doctors / non City solicitors) with more then one child. Cost of living / lower salaries / VAT. But English private schools are popular with overseas students.

Over time I think it will be very wealthy / generationally monied and the overseas students who will be the majority in the private schools. Anecdotally I see this happening already with Dd2s friends who at the local private schools. The “normal” middle class we know with the odd exception are all at state. Many friends went private themselves but could not afford it for their children.

Oh well I'm getting confused! Very expensive education here op and I can't follow a thread so all is not lost!

The list keeps getting longer:
Unqualified teachers.
Less likely to get into top universities.
Traumatised children.
Counts against them when job hunting.
All pupils are thick and entitled.
Everyone hates poshos.
Drugs and bullying are rife.

Please, someone, tell me where the ‘privilege’ is in private education.

That’s exactly the point I’m making. 🙂

I don't think it's ever entered my head to categorise people according to their wealth! I'm poor, a working class scouser, exdh is unemployed, we're on universal credit but I just interact with the other parents normally. The other day I went to a garden party in Cambridge with lots of posh, presumably very clever and maybe wealthy people. I wasn't fazed though I work in a warehouse on a zero hours contract!

They don't all have unqualified teachers: that is nonsense.

You see the funny thing is, op, those of us who are paying private fees worry that their education will actually count against them in a job interview, given the quotas, prevailing attitudes etc.

Is not that simple, but I guess that's my point: you don't just go to private school then scoop all the jobs.

I agree there are other benefits, but it isn't a guarantee of a successful job interview.

@twistyizzy @38thparallel

Also the unshakeable belief that private school parents are buying their children’s artificially inflated grades, whilst simultaneously the teaching in those same schools is inferior to that in state schools and is provided by unqualified teachers.

100%

It's the attitude that there's a finite amount of success available in life so no-one should have more than their equal share of it.

Because for some people it is Schrodinger' education: independent schools simultaneously confer privilege and advantage whilst at same time not being as good as state schools.

@twistyizzy yes it’s very odd. I suppose it’s an opportunity to sneer at what posters perceive to be posho children and tell parents that private schools are known to damage their pupils so it shows what sort of awful parents they are if they use them. Yet despite the damage and inferior education somehow these children are ‘privileged’.
Odd logic.

It’s really annoying how you have referred to it as GRIEF, do you have any idea what grief is like???

@Movingonfeelssad
What an absolutely shit reason for disregarding private education.

Your DH sounds like a dickhead who has made your DC's education all about HIM and not about the best fit for your DC.

I thought he might have just morally disagreed with private education but no it's about his insecurities - what a twat.

I went to a private school, yes some people are seriously rich but most are just normal people in well paid jobs e.g lawyers, business owners, accountants. Also parents are not comparing bank balances. My best mate's dad was a shop keeper.

Look if you can afford it and it's a viable option, you should consider it. You don't have to go to a premium prep school, also you could go to a state primary and private secondary. You don't have to spend £500k.

I totally get it, I’d hate to the poor parents at a school full of relatively wealthy families. We thought about private but the lifestyle hit would be huge and I perhaps selfishly don’t want my kid only doing nice things with school.

100% agree with that. Make ALL state schools good for ALL children. But it's easier to tear down independent schools and blame them for everything than improve state schools to that extent.

I agree but think that enough is enough and we should as a country do something about changing education so that there is not such a huge unfair gulf, and raise standards throughout. Most of the disruptive kids are behind and have been for years. How things are taught needs improving. Knowledge is incredibly motivating for kids. As is reading extensively instead of years of phonics torture. There is a lot we could do differently at state school.

I agree with the advice too.

I come from a very underprivileged background but was sent to a private for 4 years between 12 and 16 and I can tell you the difference it made for me was immense. I went to a state sixth form and only two of us managed to get good enough A levels for russell group unis, and both of us had been to a public school. It is shocking and unfair but it is the case.

Where we live there are no private options and dc is doing well at the state academically because dc reads a lot of good books and is clever and i have done some motivating stuff at home, and extra maths, but what really affects my dc at school is that around 90 percent of the class do no work, are demotivated, loud, lewd, disruptive, know things that kids of their age shouldn't know, spend all their time on violent video games and some are violent. DC has now said they are fed up and asked to move house and go to a school where the kids are motivated and academic.

I think that good private schools give good training in independent study, and also gives subconscious training in the "right" social skills. I think it makes a difference in terms of delivery and confidence, not necessarily in relation to academics as there are so many other factors. Disparity in income and background was apparent at my private school but not an issue. Ethics and academics were more important. It was all girls and really pushed the idea that women could do anything they wanted which was fabulous.

I think you should do what is best for your son, and persuade your husband after you have decided what is best! I don't think you should put your husband's feelings of inadequacy over what you think is best for your dc.

FWIW in your shoes I would give your dc a taste of both types of schools and make sure they are ahead academically at all times.

Don’t really understand this post. My DS is at a state school. We could afford private. He’s in year 11 doing very well. Can’t see how a private school could “open doors”. He wants to study medicine, and I don’t see why he will be disadvantaged by being at a state school.

Use your money to pay for some tutoring down the line. Like for GCSEs and A levels.

Loads of people seem to tutor around here but they keep it quiet. My state school child had no English teacher for 6 months while in an exam year (yes, I know, not great) and we looked to get a tutor just so they could find out what they were supposed to be doing for coursework. Lots of people were using them but no tutors had any space.

It’s good to see teachers that have been abused into leaving teaching have a lucrative employment option! Does that Sutton Trust number cover this sort of thing maybe? Secondary school subject specific tutors employed to get kids through exams.

Maybe it's just me but I still don't your DHs problem?

That's fine don't believe it but those are findings of Sutton Trust research.

I honestly don't care but was merely making the point that plenty of parents who use state schools also buy "privilege" for their children and to accuse independent parents of doing so whilst ignoring the issue within state schools is disingenuous

Yes but you said it was 25% in primary and 30% in secondary. What on earth are all these parents supposedly tutoring for in state primary? They don't even do SATs now. I genuinely do not believe that of the 9 primaries in my South West town there are 1000 kids receiving tutoring.

Yes full of privileged parents who can access privilege for their children outside of using independent schools.