Private school grief

OP - state education is the norm, not the exception, so look around at all those people
working in Education, Medicine, Engineering, Research etc look at the people making, building, creating, contributing to their families, their communities, to the world at large.
State educated, and thriving.
Both DP and I - totally bog standard state educated, went to university, got good jobs, top 1% of earners ( if that’s even how you measure ‘success’)
Both totally opposed to wasting our hard earned money on private fees just so our children can mix only with people with money. The problem with private schools is they’re stuffed with kids from generational wealth, and those kids have t got a clue about real life, nor do their parents in many cases.

Oh well done on all the cash. If you’re successful in this, why are you failing to tell your husband to support your choice?

There is no god.

"The year was 2081, and everybody was finally equal. They weren't only equal before God and the law. They were equal every which way. Nobody was smarter than anybody else. Nobody was better looking than anybody else. Nobody was stronger or quicker than anybody else."

Yep again..."terrific state school". Not available to everyone so what do we do? Expect our kids to go to the same sh*t failing comps that failed us utterly, or try to do what we can, (just) within our means (entire net salary + now additional £6k vat which is now putting us in real difficulty as I am sure many of you will be happy to hear)

When my dc were primary age I stumbled across the Winchester College website and thought 'fuck me, this is the education I want for my children' but didn't have 70K p.a. for 5 years (it's more now), so had to sigh and move on. They're girls anyway. Now they are adults I can see that many elements of this school wouldn't have suited them anyway. It was the education I would have loved for myself, rather than Hard Knocks Comp. My girls went to a terrific state school which served them very well, so no regrets. It's only this thread that's reminded me. Rambling, but I guess I'm saying there's more than one path to a good education.

That suggests you are equating success with high salaries.

Time and time again posters have smugly declared their university results despite many private school parents saying they do not measure success with high salaries.

Its implying high salaries equal success. On this thread the very idea that parents of private school kids don’t agree with this seems to cause a great deal of angst amongst some posters. People are using it as a stick to berate PS parents. It’s a fundamental difference between PS and state school parents.

@pinkandgreenflower ,

But how selective is your private?

Most of my Cambridge friends are successful, some extraordinarily so.

If I compare that to CCAT, as was, Cambridge must have taught extraordinarily well.

But every single student (bar a couple of contextual offers, which were very rare back then, started with all top grades at A level, and a couple of S levels (you have to be quite old to remember those!) thrown in.

I suspect the main driver of success was basic IQ and parental background, rather than Cambridge itself.

Surely that undermines the perceived value of having a qualified teacher then!

And with regard too “Jayden with the half shaved head” (!!), my son and some of his friends have (in my outdated opinion) utterly ridiculous haircuts. I’m not sure that their hair impacts on their learning though. Plus they all have nice middle class names, so does that make them in some way less disruptive than ‘Jayden’?!

@Newbutoldfather - but then again, in London (where I am) you might see a wider gulf. You asked earlier about the truth of choice between private and a failing school.

I'm not sure I'd describe our local state secondary as a 'sink school' - however, compare this year's GCSEs results with those at my DCs private school. At the state school the average grade was a 5, at my DC's independent school 96percent of results were 7-9s (and 85 percent 8-9s).

The local state school also, sadly, has issues with gang violence, dilapidated buildings and not enough teachers for certain subjects. The music and sport provision is pretty woeful, bluntly.

We had some savings and chose to use these sending our kids private. God knows our retirement will be way less comfortable than it could have been, had we not have spent all this money on fees. We would be far less stressed about money, we could go on lots of holidays and spend money on ourselves. Other than making a choice to move house/areas (and I sometimes wish we had tbh), we had to make that choice between the two schools. I don't regret it.

At a statistical level*

@BananaPeels ,

I don’t disagree with anything in your above post.

Wealthy people are, on a statistical level, brighter than poorer ones.

I am not sure whether that breaks down above a certain level, because a lot of top doctors, engineers etc earn a lot less than even average investment bankers or consultants.

If you read my first post, I said that parental wealth and education will always be the primary determinant of success on a statistical level.

Yes I know - but I mean defensiveness when criticising other people’s choices! It’s bewildering.

education is connected with wealth to an extent but I think that is only a very small part of it.

yes there is inherited generational wealth but a high amount of accumulated wealth is earned. That is the point of working. You work hard at school, statistically you are going to amass more wealth over your lifetime. Not everyone but an average.

educated people tend to pass on the knowledge, experience and work ethic to their children. Not all, but on average.

therefore the good education of children is often hugely correlated to good education of parents (and their likely genetic predisposition to be more academically able on average since academic ability is often inherited) and the wealth is secondary.

it why you see generation after generation of doctors for instance.

The concerning thing is that education is so highly correlated with wealth.

@Newbutoldfather what do you think is the solution?

No, it's chronic under investment in education budgets in NE . The most deprived areas in London have better state schools than many OK areas in NE.
Phillipson scrapped the Eton Star academy in NE which could have been instrumental in improving aspiration in some of these deprived NE areas.

Children from NE are less likely to go to university (and especially RG or elite universities) than nearly anywhere else in England.

Well that’s fine. If you have kids send them whatever you like. Parents who use private schools don’t care what other people do. Each to their own.

The hypocrisy is outstanding on this thread.
Grammar, tutors, moving for better catchments are all fine seemingly.

The word equality is used as a stick to beat "others" with. It also drags everything down to the lowest common denominator instead of raising standards upwards.
In any case, it's a load of bullshit. Life isn't equal and never will be. Children who come from a household with 2 parents working are at an immediate advantage no matter what school they go to. So shall we ban that?

@twistyizzy ,

‘Are you aware of huge regional discrepancies across UK eg NE has yet again come bottom of table for GCSE + A Level results. London again has come out top.’

Isn’t that just a wealth map?

The concerning thing is that education is so highly correlated with wealth.

Because people judge parents who use independent schools. They don't only judge us, they feel entitled to call us and our children vile names. Purely based on the type of school we choose
So yeh we get defensive!

Just like to point out that TA taught my DS for a while and was every bit as capable as a teacher.

There were a post upthread commenting on how the 'rich' parents in an area had got involved in a low achieving school and it was now one of the highest achieving. I can't find it to quote.

So while everyone is busy bashing wealth inequality and unfair schooling maybe also think about why those people are rich and how they are improving the school. It's not luck, they work hard, instil good values, absolutely support the behaviour code of conduct in schools and support the teachers. That's what happens in private schools.

There seems to be a feeling that those parents who care and make a difference should be used to improve standards for those who don't. A bit like sitting the nice quiet kid in between 2 really badly behaved ones in school as happened to me. Yes the behaviour of the two badly behaved ones improves, but the quiet one is disadvantaged. That's not equality.

Me!
Choice of state secondary = 20% of Yr 11s come out with 5 x GCSEs grade 5+ OR independent school

Are you aware of huge regional discrepancies across UK eg NE has yet again come bottom of table for GCSE + A Level results. London again has come out top.

How many people actually have the choice of private or a sink schools, though?

This is a trope perpetuated on these threads.

The vast majority of those who send their children private live in nice houses in nice areas with…..nice state schools.

And in most state schools, the top sets have few behavioural issues.

Of course there are outliers, but they are few and far between.

We have a serious issue with education in this country but the upper middle classes mainly duck it either via private or decent state.

There was a thread on here yesterday about a 17 year old shoplifting and so many said he was being ‘daft’ and suggesting a calm chat. It really is no wonder that adolescents don’t respect school as a source of authority.