Black people don’t really matter but the loss of Charlie Kirk is a tragedy.

Please provide a link to this news story. I’ve googled that name and can’t find a thing.

I recently saw this. It was appalling. She was minding her own business, sat in front of a man who stabbed her. She sat scared and bleeding and no one helped her. She fell over and died. The black man walked off the train. He had committed numerous crimes and was very dangerous but allowed to walk free. She was white, a young woman. No mass threads for her!

Oh so everyone celebrating on blue-sky are bots 🤣🤣🤣
Since your not posting in good faith I won't be engaging further

Erm... yes context is key. Because I know next to nothing about CK but from less than 5 minutes of Googling 'what did Charlie Kirk say about black people', even I know that he wasn't saying he didn't trust black pilots. He was saying he hated DEI initiatives.

Edited to say - but as I said earlier he was definitely canny and probably phrased it that way because he knew it'd rile people up and get him clicks.

Unless I've missed it (which is possible?) I've not seen one thread on the poor young white girl in America who was stabbed senselessly and so violently by a black stranger and was left to die , looking terrified, and clutched herself in a ball until she collapsed and died in a pool of blood on the floor. All her fellow passengers (all black ) did nothing.

Now: we can pretend not to notice things or characteristics. Or we can start having very painful conversations. If the shoe was on the other foot and that was a black refugee stabbed by a white man and all the white passengers did nothing: we all know there would be anarchy.

So I don't think the divisional perpetual victim minority stance is helping cohesion is it.

We're all bloody victims of each other it seems.

Iryna Zharuvska I believe her name was.

The Blue Sky posts have been discussed a lot here. They all look like anonymous accounts or bots. Can you name any of the people posting?

The Oxford Union president is just one person. Who are all these other people you claim are celebrating?

Who here has tried to justify his murder? Name one person?

Yep, great. So context is important then right? Because it looks like you just gave us about 3 paragraphs worth.

I just saw a poster say 'Charlie Kirk said he doesn't trust black people to fly planes' and indignantly ask if there was any context needed, with CONTEXT??!?? in capitals iirc, like you'd be craaaaazzzy to want some.

Can you provide specific clips/examples of things he's said that have been racist?

In two I watched recently, he was encouraging two black students to believe they could achieve anything in life regardless of colour.

He does have an issue with DEI but, then, so do lots of people. He asked one student: Hypothetically, what would happen to the standard of the NBA if 50% of all new hires HAD to be white?
His answer: The standard of the NBA would likely go down because black players are overwhelmingly better at basketball than white people.

Is this comment racist?

No, that is a very over simplified definition of racism, that comes from the same mind set as those who believe misandry is the equal opposite of misogyny.
Hatred for a group is just the first part of the equation. To translate that into harm, the hater needs power over the object of their hatred. So while all hatred of a group based solely on their membership of that group is equally wrong, the impact of that hatred is not equal.
If you disagree, I'd be interested in your examples of the harm being caused to white people as a group, by the racism you believe they experience from POC. And I don't mean an anecdote about a white person treated badly by a black employer, I mean at a societal level.

That's racist
Racism is the hatred of a group of people because of their skin colour, nationality or culture.
So yes people can and regularly are racist against white people and get away with it because of the nonsense that you and others spout.
White fragility is a made up term to dismiss the push back against anti white racism.
Shame on you for spreading such devicive racist bs

Cool racism.

Also factually inaccurate. As this has happened before when a black woman was killed by a crazy white man on public transport.

Not a riot in site.

www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/mar/10/nia-wilson-murder-oakland-bart-john-lee-cowell

Exactly. Black people would be rioting if Iryna had been a young black immigrant stabbed mercilessly by a white man and all the white people on the bus just ignored her while she died. It seems racism
is only wrong when it’s not effecting white people.

What about George Floyd - a good for nothing career criminal. I'd bet good money you wouldn't dare voice that you couldn't care less that he's dead.

Exactly. Black people would be rioting if Iryna had been a young black immigrant stabbed mercilessly by a white man and all the white people on the bus just ignored her while she died. It seems racism
is only wrong when it’s not effecting white people.

Have you been on blue-sky?
Maybe you haven't seen the news recently or heard about the uk councillor who had to quit the council for celebrating his murder, or the Oxford union president elects comments that even his own union have disavowed or the bob vylon (sp) concert chearing his murder to name but a few.
As for why I keep saying noone should be killed for words, if people didn't keep trying to justify or minimise the murder of a man for exactly that i wouldn't need to.
Oh ill comment on any evidence of Charlie kirks racism when I get to it I'm still on page 1 of this thread and there's none yet

Some questions for you:

• why don’t you acknowledge or discuss the examples of CK’s racism provided in the thread?
• why don’t you name the many people you claim are celebrating?
• why do you keep saying that ‘no one should be killed for words that you or I may disagree with’, when literally no one on this thread has said they should?

Unless I've missed it (which is possible?) I've not seen one thread on the poor young white girl in America who was stabbed senselessly and so violently by a black stranger and was left to die , looking terrified, and clutched herself in a ball until she collapsed and died in a pool of blood on the floor. All her fellow passengers (all black ) did nothing.

Now: we can pretend not to notice things or characteristics. Or we can start having very painful conversations. If the shoe was on the other foot and that was a black refugee stabbed by a white man and all the white passengers did nothing: we all know there would be anarchy.

So I don't think the divisional perpetual victim minority stance is helping cohesion is it.

We're all bloody victims of each other it seems.

Iryna Zharuvska I believe her name was.

Unless I've missed it (which is possible?) I've not seen one thread on the poor young white girl in America who was stabbed senselessly and so violently by a black stranger and was left to die , looking terrified, and clutched herself in a ball until she collapsed and died in a pool of blood on the floor. All her fellow passengers (all black ) did nothing.

Now: we can pretend not to notice things or characteristics. Or we can start having very painful conversations. If the shoe was on the other foot and that was a black refugee stabbed by a white man and all the white passengers did nothing: we all know there would be anarchy.

So I don't think the divisional perpetual victim minority stance is helping cohesion is it.

We're all bloody victims of each other it seems.

Iryna Zharuvska I believe her name was.

There's no such thing as racism against white people. White people are not a minority in our society, and hold the power.

I would suggest doing some reading into white fragility, because there are posts here that are pretty much textbook demonstrations of it.

Wow your misogyny is shining through with this post with your save our women bs
Mumsnet is not defending Charlie kirks opinions.
What you have is people saying noone should be killed for words that you or I may disagree with.
Yes we are asking for evidence of what he actually said and in what context as we are used to certain sections of society misrepresenting what people they disagree with actually said, (it happens all the time just look at jk_rowling, so now we ask for evidence which rarely appears) much like you have with his comments about positive discrimination vs meritocracy which in the context of the USA is a valid talking point and the racism at the heart of critical race theory, its main tenant is all white people are racist (what other group could be smeared in such a way and not be shut down?).
Then theres also discussions about how certain parts of the left have celebrated the murder of a man because they dont like what he said. Let that sink in people are celebrating the murder of a man and justifying it because of words. If you don't find that horrifying then you need to give your head a wobble.
The extreme left have created this problem by labelling everyone who disagrees with them on anything as racist, homophobic and/or transphobic. Oh yeah we're all far right and funded by the American Christian movement too apparently 🙄. This overuse of these words has robbed them of their meaning and power so now when they are used people assume it's more hyperbole from the left especially when they are being used to excuse murder.
Then we get posts and threads like this one where the op smears all posters on the fwr board as racist and claims we must all be white, whilst you are smearing all of mumsnet in the same way. All it dose is drive a bigger wedge between different groups instead of allowing us to find common ground and makes a right wing reform government more likely.

Back to Charlie Kirk. He also talked about a “moronic” black woman who served him on a till and wondered if she was there because of DEI. Like there are no moronic white checkout operators anywhere. It’s seriously disturbing that so many are denying his racism and that the appetite for this kind of politics is growing.

What has that murder got to do with this thread? Men brutally murder women every day all over the world (black men, white men, black wonen, white women…motivated by racial or religious hatred sometimes, by hatred for women always ) . It is always horrific and frightening.

THIS is a thread about women on Mumsnet defending a PUBLIC figure who was most very definitely a racist.

Shame on you for bringing your ‘save our women’ nonsense here.

Apologies if I spelt her name incorrectly. My mistake. Thanks for the correction.

I really think people need to all take a look at that video. It's shocking and opens up lots of questions. That poor poor girl.

I see that you're twisting it to all fit the "nicest" version of what the truth could be.

Now, if this was reversed : black refugee victim, white perpetrator, all white fellow passengers: do you honestly and truthfully believe the answers would be similar to yours on a post about it?

Try and answer that honestly.