Have you ever been a bully? Why?

An incident from adult life has just come to mind. Years ago I trained as a Forest School leader and (after a year of study and practice )our assessment week was a residential, week-long event at an isolated outdoor centre. There were 6 of us being assessed by 2 tough, loud, no-nonsense women trainers.

I was pretty intimidated by them but I decided to just get on with it. But another lovely woman on the course was clearly a timid, gentle, sensitive character. Basically, they bullied her into the ground, which, considering that FS is all about build self-esteem and personal confidence, is somewhat ironic. Did I look at this person and think ‘God, she’s a pathetic specimen - I’m going to put the boot in!’ NO I BLOODY WELL DID NOT. I tried to support her but sadly there was a knock on my bedroom door on the 4th night (4 am) and she was there, all packed to go and in floods of tears. She was in pieces because of their constant mockery and belittling. I only made the mildest attempt to dissuade her from going because I knew it wouldn’t have ended well.

It’s not acceptable in any context to bullying someone because they’re weak, sensitive or timid and there’s never any excuse. I hate it when anyone tries to excuse bullying. Only 2 of the 7 adults present at that event came out as bullies - you can choose to do the right thing. They were just plain nasty women.

My best friend left her dream job as an air hostess because the workplace bullying was so bad.
Very bitchy industry.

People like are the not haunted. When you are that wrong in the head, you cannot change.

Yep. I've been a bully. I was really, really horrible too and I didn't even have some bullshit heartfelt excuse like mean parents or my rabbit had died. I was quite simply a horrible little bitch. You'll be pleased to hear I got my comeuppance though.

Why did I do it?
(Buckle in mumsnetters, this will sound awful, but it's the truth.)
It was never really about the person. I'm not saying that to be nice or make anyone feel better, it just genuinely wasn't. Some people just stood out as targets. They had weird glasses or a bad haircut or talked funny or smelt or anything little superficial thing insignificant thing that made them a target but a lot of the time, there wasn't even anything at all, you could just tell they weren't the type of person that was going to fight back. They were therefore below you in the pecking order and fair game.
We (yes, I was in a group of other nasty bitches) would just target people because it was a laugh and it bonded us all closer together, being bitches together, challenging each other to see who could push that bit further, trying to impress each other by being worse than each other, trying to fit in, to be the coolest, to assert dominance - not over the person we were bullying, that was already a given - but over each other. Who could be the meanest bitch and therefore the leader of the group? Who could make others laugh the most? who as the best? That person, who's life we could have easily ruined, was just a tool to us, just a form of entertainment.
I was the worst, I'm afraid, so was what you would probably call "the ringleader".

One girl's parents complained to the school, we all had to have a meeting in the deputy head's office with our mums there, where the DP lectured us about bullying and kindness etc. The girl's mum was going absolutely mental in the DP's office shouting and saying that this better get sorted out and she better not hear of me touching her daughter again or she would take matters into her own hands. My mum just sat there and didn't say anything and then shouted at me a bit when we got home and I wasn't allowed out that night I think, or some other low level punishment.

This whole episode was, to us, quite frankly hilarious. We fucking pissed ourselves laughing over this girl's mum freaking out and did lots of impressions of it in front of everyone. Most people laughed along with us and after that we behaved much worse towards the girl. She became our primary target and one night me and another girl followed her home. We didn't hit her but we did corner her and get right in her face and threaten her and tell her if she ever told any one ever again we'd beat the shit out of her. I remember her legs were shaking and the next day I told everyone about how I could see her legs shaking, and everyone laughed right in front of her.

Feeling like I'm the biggest bitch on the planet right now? well, you'll enjoy this next bit.

Turns out this girl has family or close family friends who were travellers I think, and notorious in the town and they were a fucking hard bunch of bastards. Like really, do not mess with us, been to prison several times, fight each other just for fun type. The girl's mum went and told them and asked for help and one night just before Christmas I was walking home late when two much older boys, probably about 17 or 18 (I was in year 9, so about 13 or 14) just came up behind me and grabbed by arms and held them behind my back. They started shouting all this stuff about how they were going to rape me and kill me and I was absolutely terrified, I was screaming my head off, I had no idea they were there for the girl, I thought I was just being attacked. They then shoved me face down into the mud of the track we were on, I can still taste the dirt in the mouth, and one of them got right up close to my ear and said "now you know how Sally* feels, you fucking little cunt, if you ever touch her again we will cut your throat, yours and your useless sket of a mother's" I remember the words clearly, because I'd never heard the word "sket" before. Then they emptied my school bag over me, took my school shoes, and ran off. I found the shoes on the way home, hanging on a bush by the laces.

I didn't tell anyone what happened but I went home that night and I sat on my bed and I cried and cried and cried.

I'd been bullying anyone I thought I could since year 6, I'd always got away with it, it was nothing but fun to me. And for some reason, I'd had simply never thought about the fact that my actions really hurt people, that these people had real feelings, not even when I saw the girls legs shaking. I literally saw them shaking and thought "omg I can't wait to tell people about that"

But it took me being terrified for my life by someone else for something to just click in my brain, like someone had flicked a switch. What I was doing was evil. Actually really fucking evil and I actually couldn't believe I hadn't given that fact a single thought before.
I can remember the actual moment like "omg, my actions have an effect on real people, and they are real people, not my toys, they have family and lives and people that care about them, not just crazy shouting mums" horrible, right? but I guess up until that moment, my empathy just wasn't there. It just hadn't developed in me, until someone came along and pretty much kicked it into me. You say violence isn't the answer? it fucking was for me.

I know it's going to sound unbelievable, like some sort of teenage drama perfect ending but I can honestly say I never bullied another person again. I faked a cold for a few days and didn't go back until after the Christmas Holidays. I didn't enjoy Christmas that year, and it wasn't just because I had been attacked, which was traumatic in itself, it was the horrible realisation, that should have been obvious to anyone else, that I was just an unbelievably shit person.

I went back and distanced myself from the other girls and the group fell apart. I made new friends and I don't think I ever spoke to the girl again. I was too ashamed and embarrassed. She never acted smug, as she had every right to, she just quietly ignored me and got on with her life.

Am I ashamed? Yes. Of course. But I have moved past it now and realised that yes, I was fucking horrendous, but I grew, I developed, and I'm not that person any more. It's a short chapter in my life I have firmly closed. I don't live in the area any more although my mum still does and I visit her occasionally, so I never bump into anyone and I haven't kept in touch with any old school friends. In fact, I never really made any proper close friends again.

I'm pregnant now with my first child, and nope, she won't be a bully and no, I won't let her be bullied.

So there you have it - the honest, ugly truth.

That last line is so important. Adults need to make sure their kids know how wrong it is.

I am not a strict parent at all really, but my kids both know full well that if I hear of them bullying anyone, even low level shit, even just being a bystander, they will wish they had never been born. I absolutely will not tolerate it.
Even little comments are nipped in the bud here. DS once commented with a little laugh that a bloke in a theme park looked like Hitler and was firmly told never ever to make negative comments about someone's appearance ever again.

Well done to your mum!

You’re assuming that people are incapable of growth or change though, and that is so far from the truth! Especially when we’re talking about teenagers.

If somebody bullies other aged 45, I’m more inclined to agree with you. The chances of a leopard changing their spots at that age are slim. But at 13,14,15… they’re not even close to fully mature! I’m sure you don’t still think or behave the way you did when you were that age, in fact if you do I’d be worried!
How young are you willing to go, for the bullying label to stick? Are eight year olds bullies for life? What about six year olds?We have to give children some grace and space to grow.

Not sure I agree. I think behaviours like bullying tends to repeat itself. These things aren’t left at the school gate.

Anyone weak enough to have bullied is likely to feel weak again and resort to the same tactics again in later life, especially in the workplace and social groups.

So yes, some people can and should be defined by their bullying.

Some parents are shockers. One of the boys in my class would stand near the fence of the playground jeering and calling insults to the adults with learning difficulties who were being escorted to the community centre next door. When I spoke to him about it he told me his parents always did it. He was genuinely surprised to hear it wasn’t the way most people behaved.

I remember a teacher on mumsnet saying sometimes kids bully who have a bully parent. They pick on kids who behave or a look a certain way that would lead to their parent bullying them if they behaved or looked that way.

She does. But sorry to say a bad home life is an explanation. Same for people who commit crime - some of the stories of prisoners are horrific. Not everyone with a bad home life hurts others but some do. It’s a fact. Doesn’t mean they aren’t nasty etc but many probably wouldn’t have acted that way if they had a happy life.

@NormasArse I imagine what you did to that poor boy will haunt you. It’s made me feel very sad.

I once sent my friend an invitation to a Halloween party which said Fancy Dress Only on the bottom. I only put it on his. He came dressed as a mummy, clutching a six pack of monster munch. We were about 14. I still regret that. Everyone laughed at him, and he’d made so much effort with his costume ☹️.

I find it hard to understand both the bully and the people who went along with it because I didn't.

There was one boy in my class at secondary school. He was smelly, fat and a bit weird but nothing crazy. The whole class were horrible to him. They wouldn't go near him. If he brushed against someone or accidently touched someone people would shout "eeew. Disgusting". They would then go around the class touching other people shouting "hahah you have Henry(made up name) germs now". They then devised the Henry lock were you linked your fingers together and that meant someone couldn't pass Henry germs onto you.

I never joined in even when people tried to pull me into it. I actually would actively go and stand with him. Or not continue the chain when it started. And I remember being tempted to go along with it for an easy life but I didn't. Despite taunts of "omg do you fancy him" and so on.

Edited to say this went in for I'd say atleast 2 full school years.

So I find it hard to understand how someone bullies and how someone goes along with it.