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To think promiscuous men should be shamed more?

417 replies

TheJoyOfWriting · 08/09/2025 22:28

This, really. The whole body count discourse is the latest version of slut-shaming, as it's mostly aimed at women. Promiscuous men are still given status by other men and by women, too often.

The body count arguments that people use against women can be used against men just as easily. Promiscuous men are more likely to cheat. They are more likely to have STDs. They are more likely to have contributed to an 'oops' baby- it takes 2 to make one, and more likely to walk away after w no consequences.

Promiscuous men often dump women after pretending to be interested to get sex, esp on datjng apps, which fuel this kind of behaviour. Women tend to find ONSs less satisfying, often partly bc these kind of men often don't care about giving pleasure, just taking it.

The idea that a man's worth is measured by how many women he has sex with is very bad. It encourages men to treat women badly, and it fuels the incel culture by making men feel insecure & unmanly if they're not sexually successful.

Thoughts? I don't mean we should call Promiscuous men horrible names or talk about them like 'run through' or 'high mileage cars' the way some men do about promiscuous women. But I think they should be shamed more, by both men and women.

I don't think casual sex is bad per se, but I think the culture of it has got out of control, and Promiscuous men share a lot of the blame.

OP posts:
TheJoyOfWriting · 09/09/2025 01:36

Ladyzfactor · 09/09/2025 01:15

Not going to lie, it's pretty obvious that you're really young. I have a feeling that when you grow up more and experience more life and meet more people that you will probably cringe at this post.

🤣 Actually a lot of this is from various articles often by older women who argue that the only way to get men to behave better is for casual sex to be less accepted. They often speak as if they wish it could be different, but experience & observing the current situation means that they think that's the only solution

I think it's too pessimistic myself, and there's obvs other factors. Seems sad to think that men can't control their behaviour better.. And while there were complaints about hookup culture back in the 90s & 2000s, I think a lot of the issues are caused by other things like porn, only fans, to some extent dating apps efc

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TheJoyOfWriting · 09/09/2025 01:32

Oh I know, I love the feminism boards. Have mostly read GC stuff on there, I will seek out older stuff on this. People are probs wondering why I'm on Mumsnet at my age 🤣 I came bc I was looking at GC stuff (which obvs is harder to discuss in my age group) & that happily led me to FWR.

I know that condoms can break etc But from what I've read, this is much more likely if various mistakes are made (out of date, bad storage, and most common, apparently, incorrect usage) - eg. Below.

https://www.google.com/search?q=how+likely+are+condoms+to+fail&oq=how+lilely+are+condk&gs_lcrp=EgZjaHJvbWUqCQgCEAAYDRiABDIGCAAQRRg5MgkIARAAGA0YgAQyCQgCEAAYDRiABDIJCAMQABgNGIAEMggIBBAAGA0YHjIICAUQABgWGB4yCAgGEAAYFhgeMggIBxAAGBYYHjIICAgQABgWGB4yCggJEAAYCBgNGB4yCggKEAAYCBgNGB4yDAgLEAAYCBgKGA0YHjIKCAwQABgIGA0YHjIKCA0QABgIGA0YHjIHCA4QIRiPAtIBCDY0OTVqMGo0qAIBsAIB&client=ms-android-samsung-ss&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8

I can definitely see the impact of the Pill on women's freedom. Ofc there were other options than becoming a nun, but that's why you had spinsters partly : they might be women who wanted to be independent, an forgoing sex/relationships was the only way to be assured of that.

Another thought, tho not directly thread-relevant...what about contraceptive implants? Were they around then? Or only allowed for married women? I think I read something like that...

Google Search

https://www.google.com/search?client=ms-android-samsung-ss&gs_lcrp=EgZjaHJvbWUqCQgCEAAYDRiABDIGCAAQRRg5MgkIARAAGA0YgAQyCQgCEAAYDRiABDIJCAMQABgNGIAEMggIBBAAGA0YHjIICAUQABgWGB4yCAgGEAAYFhgeMggIBxAAGBYYHjIICAgQABgWGB4yCggJEAAYCBgNGB4yCggKEAAYCBgNGB4yDAgLEAAYCBgKGA0YHjIKCAwQABgIGA0YHjIKCA0QABgIGA0YHjIHCA4QIRiPAtIBCDY0OTVqMGo0qAIBsAIB&ie=UTF-8&oq=how+lilely+are+condk&q=how+likely+are+condoms+to+fail&sourceid=chrome-mobile

OP posts:
Ladyzfactor · 09/09/2025 01:15

TheJoyOfWriting · 09/09/2025 00:24

I'm 19.

BTW, are you sure condoms are THAT unreliable? Maybe they were more so in the 1950s. But this medical source says they are 98% effective if used perfectly, and that's what I always thought. Anyway, not an issue for me atm certainly, but it is definitely important to be aware ofc.👍

www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=my.clevelandclinic.org/health/treatments/9404-condoms%23:~:text%3DWhen%2520used%2520perfectly%252C%2520condoms%2520are,87%2525%2520effective%2520at%2520preventing%2520pregnancy.&ved=2ahUKEwjvjMKVp8qPAxXkhf0HHUbQL4UQFnoECBQQBQ&usg=AOvVaw3FqMZGn6pP2FppJeAXSBpQ

Not going to lie, it's pretty obvious that you're really young. I have a feeling that when you grow up more and experience more life and meet more people that you will probably cringe at this post.

SweetBoraeline · 09/09/2025 00:50

I think perhaps it might be better if we all stopped shaming anyone for this, men or women.

Ladyzfactor · 09/09/2025 00:43

I've had some awesome ONS. I knew I was there for sex, they knew and we had a lot of fun. I've had a lot of sexual partners, both men and women. Honestly the only people who have ever slut shamed me in person have been women. The only time a man has its been online, by some self described incels type. In reality most people don't care.

InterIgnis · 09/09/2025 00:43

What consenting adults choose to do is not my business, or something I care to make my business.

If I ever felt the need to shame someone for their sex life, then I’d take that as a sign that I needed to get a hobby in order to do something even remotely productive with my time.

Cherryicecreamx · 09/09/2025 00:42

I don't think a man's worth is measured by how many he has sex with. I wouldn't want to know! And I think it's actually quite distasteful for it to be brought up or asked. Personally I don't like the thought of my partner with other people - we all have a past but I don't need to know about the ins & outs!
And if anything, if they go around collecting women like trophies that would make my estimation of them go down. I would like to feel they are more selective or do something better with their time 😅🙈 and yes I would worry I'd be "another notch on their headboard"!

Northernlights19 · 09/09/2025 00:41

I actually have a libido that's higher than what women usually have. How do you know that?

Also, very weird that you keep referring to being gen z like it's you're whole identity.

May I ask, why don't you "agree with" casual sex, rather than it just not being something which is right for you personally?

GarlicPint · 09/09/2025 00:39

Great that you're going to investigate more 🙂

Condoms are rarely used 'ideally'. The article you linked goes right on to say "Typical use averages about 87% effective at preventing pregnancy. In any given year, approximately 15 out of every 100 people who rely on condoms as their only birth control get pregnant. Condoms can tear, leak or slip off."

That's only 85% effective - a big enough risk of pregnancy that women felt it wise to "bargain" for marriage, as their best hope of security if they got pregnant.

The Pill was the most significant liberator of women imaginable. For a very long time, women's primary avenue for liberation was the convent!

Head on over to the feminism board if you like, there are a lot of in-depth discussions about this.

TheJoyOfWriting · 09/09/2025 00:25

GarlicPint · 09/09/2025 00:13

Erm, the UK has a healthy (ideal) sex ratio of 51/49.

And in the microcosm of OLD, men far outnumber women so, by this rather weak theory, they should all be treating the women with supreme respect!

To continue your education on the matter: Countries which had a recent tradition of female infanticide, such as India and China, now suffer a chronic shortage of young women. Young men have responded by forming rape gangs, importing trafficked and enslaved 'wives' from even poorer countries, and massively swelling the numbers of brothels.

I don't know Marcia Guttentag but she sounds like a bit of a dipstick.

This is a v good point re India & China. Terrible for the women.

I remember reading an article called A Surplus Of Men, A Deficit Of Peace. This would ofc contradict Guttentag's argument. Will read up on this...

OP posts:
TheJoyOfWriting · 09/09/2025 00:24

GarlicPint · 09/09/2025 00:14

Condoms are unreliable.

Just how young are you? I'm quite worried by the amount you don't know.

I'm 19.

BTW, are you sure condoms are THAT unreliable? Maybe they were more so in the 1950s. But this medical source says they are 98% effective if used perfectly, and that's what I always thought. Anyway, not an issue for me atm certainly, but it is definitely important to be aware ofc.👍

www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=my.clevelandclinic.org/health/treatments/9404-condoms%23:~:text%3DWhen%2520used%2520perfectly%252C%2520condoms%2520are,87%2525%2520effective%2520at%2520preventing%2520pregnancy.&ved=2ahUKEwjvjMKVp8qPAxXkhf0HHUbQL4UQFnoECBQQBQ&usg=AOvVaw3FqMZGn6pP2FppJeAXSBpQ

OP posts:
TheJoyOfWriting · 09/09/2025 00:20

GarlicPint · 09/09/2025 00:13

Erm, the UK has a healthy (ideal) sex ratio of 51/49.

And in the microcosm of OLD, men far outnumber women so, by this rather weak theory, they should all be treating the women with supreme respect!

To continue your education on the matter: Countries which had a recent tradition of female infanticide, such as India and China, now suffer a chronic shortage of young women. Young men have responded by forming rape gangs, importing trafficked and enslaved 'wives' from even poorer countries, and massively swelling the numbers of brothels.

I don't know Marcia Guttentag but she sounds like a bit of a dipstick.

Tbf she sadly died before she could revise the book. And she was writing in 1970s US, where apparently sex ratio was a bigger issue. Need to check that though!

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GarlicPint · 09/09/2025 00:16

the question is whether biology is still influencing our behaviours

Biology makes us want to have sex. There's no biological bargaining chip.

GarlicPint · 09/09/2025 00:14

TheJoyOfWriting · 09/09/2025 00:08

That's great...the question is whether biology is still influencing our behaviours since we haven't had much time to evolve since the Pill..And BTW, couldn't people just use condoms before? What was the big deal : were they hard to get, or unreliable?

I agree sex shouldn't be a bargaining chip, I don't want to believe these theories...

Condoms are unreliable.

Just how young are you? I'm quite worried by the amount you don't know.

GarlicPint · 09/09/2025 00:13

Erm, the UK has a healthy (ideal) sex ratio of 51/49.

And in the microcosm of OLD, men far outnumber women so, by this rather weak theory, they should all be treating the women with supreme respect!

To continue your education on the matter: Countries which had a recent tradition of female infanticide, such as India and China, now suffer a chronic shortage of young women. Young men have responded by forming rape gangs, importing trafficked and enslaved 'wives' from even poorer countries, and massively swelling the numbers of brothels.

I don't know Marcia Guttentag but she sounds like a bit of a dipstick.

TheJoyOfWriting · 09/09/2025 00:08

GarlicPint · 09/09/2025 00:04

That's bullshit. Sex isn't a bargaining chip. These attitudes stem from before we had hormonal contraception - they've been irrelevant for 60 years!

Many of us began long-term relationships with an immediate shag 😊

That's great...the question is whether biology is still influencing our behaviours since we haven't had much time to evolve since the Pill..And BTW, couldn't people just use condoms before? What was the big deal : were they hard to get, or unreliable?

I agree sex shouldn't be a bargaining chip, I don't want to believe these theories...

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Luceeeee · 09/09/2025 00:08

Nobody should be shamed. Shame is a killer.

TheJoyOfWriting · 09/09/2025 00:05

TheJoyOfWriting · 09/09/2025 00:00

I agree porn is a big part of it. But I've also read arguments that boys/men treat girls & women less well when they don't have to work hard to have sex. Don't really want to believe that, seems harsh opinion to have of boys, but I'm wondering.

So dating apps would also be an issue as they make casual sex & lying etc much easier.

There may be other factors. The underrated feminist social psychologist Marcia Guttentag argued that in societies w a lot more women than men, men didn't have to work hard to have sex so treated women worse. Sad conclusion if true... This would tie in w the dating app point. I'm not sure what sex ratios are at the moment.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marcia_Guttentag

OP posts:
GarlicPint · 09/09/2025 00:04

TheJoyOfWriting · 09/09/2025 00:00

I agree porn is a big part of it. But I've also read arguments that boys/men treat girls & women less well when they don't have to work hard to have sex. Don't really want to believe that, seems harsh opinion to have of boys, but I'm wondering.

That's bullshit. Sex isn't a bargaining chip. These attitudes stem from before we had hormonal contraception - they've been irrelevant for 60 years!

Many of us began long-term relationships with an immediate shag 😊

TheJoyOfWriting · 09/09/2025 00:02

blackpooolrock · 09/09/2025 00:01

promiscous men sleep with woman. If men are sleeping with woman then woman are sleeping with men? so one is as bad as the other?

Yes but women get shamed a lot more.

OP posts:
GarlicPint · 09/09/2025 00:01

ArseInTheCoOpWindow · 08/09/2025 23:54

I found the opposite about sex. It made me angst ridden. I didn’t want to be a notch on a bedpost.

Well, okay. Nobody forced you to, did they? (if they did, that's a whole other thing.)

I didn't give a shit what a man 'thought of me', as long as we were on the same page regarding a happy, mutually enjoyable sexual encounter. They weren't worried about whether I'd respect them afterwards!

On the rare occasions when it turned out I'd chosen badly and a guy wasn't behaving well or was acting out a porn scene instead of being 'with' me, I just left. My prerogative, just as it was yours not to go there at all.

blackpooolrock · 09/09/2025 00:01

promiscous men sleep with woman. If men are sleeping with woman then woman are sleeping with men? so one is as bad as the other?

TheJoyOfWriting · 09/09/2025 00:00

GarlicPint · 08/09/2025 23:54

pornsick boys thinking choking & anal is what most women want, women getting played and dumped on apps when they're looking for something lasting, misogynistic attitudes fuelled by online

This isn't a problem with promiscuity, @TheJoyOfWriting. It's a problem with porn culture.

I agree porn is a big part of it. But I've also read arguments that boys/men treat girls & women less well when they don't have to work hard to have sex. Don't really want to believe that, seems harsh opinion to have of boys, but I'm wondering.

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Ladamesansmerci · 08/09/2025 23:58

Why does anyone need shaming? As long as you are practising safe sex and everyone is consenting, it does not matter if you've slept with 1 person or 100.

I don't really get the what there is to agree or disagree with unless it's related to your religious beliefs.

Shaming anyone for casual sex punishes both men and women.

TheJoyOfWriting · 08/09/2025 23:58

PennySweeet · 08/09/2025 23:51

But why do you feel that men and women should be shamed for enjoying a promiscuous sex life if that's what they want?

You still haven't answered this?

You said you think promiscuous men should be shamed and that you're not 'sure' if women should be shamed.

What other perfectly legal things do you think men and women should be shamed for, that you think is 'out of control'?

Having children outside of marriage?

Getting divorced?

Having children with more than one partner?

Or should only their sex choices bring shame upon them?

I think it's best to have children with the same person. Divorce too, better if it doesn't happen. It's best to have children in a committed relationship.

But obvs there's many reasons why these things happen. I'm the daughter of a single mother by choice & have no issues w that. She had a lot of support from my gran tho, who we lived with, so maybe not a single mother per se as she effectively had a second parent.

I don't think shame is appropriate as a blanket response for those things. If people are getting divorced & having children willy-nilly, that's bad, but life us obvs more complex than that.

OP posts: