Friend hates her young daughter

I would encourage her to talk to the school, my DD can have very challenging behaviours at home, she's different at school. She masks all day at school and explodes after school. She is also struggling socially with friends, and anxiety.

Ammiting to the school that i was struggling with her was one on the scariest things I've had to do. I was worried I would be blamed as a bad parent etc. However I was supported, my DD is receiving support, and is awaiting a assessment for ASD/ADHD. We still have our struggles, however I'm not alone in them, and when we are having a difficult patch we can look into her support plan.

Think this is really unfair comment, she is doing something by asking for help here. Not sure you actually helping as you are actually not bringing anything to the party. This is difficult as this is not her child.
what would you do then? as you seem so judgemental of the OP.

I also don't think there's much you can do unless you think there's a safeguarding concern with the use of alcohol or emotional abuse/ neglect in which case a safeguarding report to the school or social services would be appropriate. You could make an anonymous report to either.

I would talk openly to her about how is she coping given that it seems like its difficult and you can see how hard she's trying. I would encourage her to think of how she refills her own cup which might include counselling- sometimes people's own childhood hurts can get triggered by some children more than others and often they aren't expecting it and it can be difficult to identify that is what's happening. I would also ask if she's met with the school. I think it's possible the dd is ND and is masking at school and then emotionally exhausted by the time she gets home and then lashes out. Alternatively it's possible she's watching things happen at home that are concerning - are there any signs of control in the parents relationship? You could also suggest mum links her in with local youth work provision and they can work with her and support the family too.

In terms of where she hears the language it could be anywhere, home, school, the Internet.

Oppositional defiance disorder? She is probably learning that language at school.

How easy to type that but so unhelpful. The OP is clearly concerned about her friend who is struggling - and even more so for her daughter. She is looking for advice on an anonymous forum.

I once came to Mumsnet with similar concerns and was torn down for ‘judging’ my friend when I was genuinely worried I should be doing something to help her daughter. Turns out my concerns were justified but the Mumsnet mob made me feel terrible for getting involved.

This is the kind of place where women should feel they can talk frankly to get different perspectives and support.

Everyone is quick to diagnose ND in place of poor parenting or behavioural issues but in this case I genuinely think it sounds like the mum is a crap parent who shouldn't have had another child in her new relationship. Maybe first time around the dad was a better parent than her or she had more energy, but this little girl is being failed by poor parenting and is badly behaved. She needs to go to some parenting classes but since she doesn't think she's at fault, she won't. Social services will be zero percent interested in a child that's being looked after and having their basic needs met - you have no idea how bad it needs to get for them to step in. My honest response is you can't do anything and there's nothing to be done. I'm sorry to say that in a post where you're looking for answers.

Might be worth having a chat with NSPCC OP to discuss how to help, as you have concerns about the little girl's wellbeing www.nspcc.org.uk/keeping-children-safe/reporting-abuse/nspcc-helpline/

If Mum is ND, she might need support with her parenting (speaking as someone with autistic parents myself).

Have you suggested parenting classes? Had she asked for advice from school? I know the DD behaves at school, but they can still help, especially if the school has a family worker (might be titled differently in different LAs)

She's not judging. She's describing.

How else is she supposed to paint the picture to get helpful responses?

Is your friend an older mum? Was the 8 year old planned?
Do you think as its probably her last child she spoilt her and now its backfired.
And your friends just to burnt out to deal with it properly. So let's alot of things slide so that now the lack of boundaries and consequences at home have led to her dd doing whatever she likes.

Judging, judging, OP. You haven't been in her position. Stop judging. Start helping. Calling SS isn't helping. You're taking agency and choice away from her.

So her child is friendless, swears at her parents and theyve given up so her answer is to drink bottles of wine?
No wonder this child is struggling! She needs to seek help from social services.

What is the matter with some children these days, using such awful bad language at 8 years old! I'd never even heard that word at that age. In light of her dreadful behaviour, I suggest she needs some kind of psychiatric counselling.

I'm autistic and I was basically a horror when I came home from school. I was working so hard to mask that I just exploded when I came home. My mother and father didn't like me very much when I was a child.

The fact that your friend is on the waiting list for an autism assessment suggests that there is some level of ND for this girl too. Autism is genetic and runs in families. The school are probably not going to pick up on this as quiet children are not problematic. It was me who realised that my extremely anxious 15 year old daughter was autistic, her school just saw a quiet girl and she had (nerdy not neurotypical) friends so they didn't see any issues. Your friend's daughter is clearly unhappy when she's home and she's unlikely to be happy at school if she's not liked by her peers there either. I cannot see this getting better without help, bluntly, spealing from personal experience, undiagnosed miserable autistic girls are at high risk for a CAMHS referral (which is disastrously underfunded and woefully inadequate).

I would empathise with your friend, she's clearly struggling and it must be awful to be routinely called a stupid bitch. But this girl needs help. The parents should be discussing the girls behaviour at home with the school and the GP.

Sounds like the family need early help. Contact local Barnardos Family Hub to see what they can offer.

I have had help from the Early Support team and found them extremely helpful.

It does sound to me as if the girl is desperately seeking attention for her mum, if she is only getting attention when she is naughty that is what she will keep doing.

If the older two are well behaved and they have different fathers to the youngest, I would be thinking maybe the youngest has SEN or ADHD.

Having said that, some kids are harder in general and need a firm NO. If she doesn’t have any SEN then your friend is going to need to be a lot stricter with her.

Some kids are twice the work of other kids. Mine are both ND and parenting is bloody hard work. Its relentless. If either of mine said shut up you bitch to me they would be properly punished. As in I would be using shock tactics, taking every gadget immediately, they would be going in their rooms and being told very firmly that it is not acceptable and they are very very wrong and not to talk to me until they come up with a proper apology.
If tour friend is just letting all of this happen it sounds like she has lost the will to parent and probably needs some support like parenting classes. There is absolutely no way an 8 year old should be saying shut up you bitch to their mum and it being let slide.
Also some therapy for the child sounds like it could be good, all behaviour is a communication. There is obviously an issue.
Family therapy could also be an option.

Well if you won't have L on your own - even for half an hour - how do you expect someone else to be able to live with her day and day our, and still be perfectly amicable?
Poor woman, I'd say she wishes she could runaway from L and her behaviour.