To think school should’ve let me keep ds4 back a year?

Dummies are for babies that haven’t grown teeth yet. Bin them tonight. Yes, he will niggle for a few nights but it really does have to go. He needs to start adapting to the world.

I think your first step is to talk to his teachers about what he is actually like at school. He is just older than average for the year so him being young won't be a problem, because he isn't. However he does sound like he is having some difficulties other children may not be. I would talk to his teachers and see what he is really like in school though. Are they actually finding his childlike behaviour difficult to manage? The chances are that, if they've not contacted you yet, he isn't that behind others! Also does he come out with loads of packs of wet clothes, because if he doesn't, and they haven't said anything, then obviously toileting in school is no issue!

Aside - is he wearing pull-ups all the time? If so, this is likely what's holding him back. They feel like a nappy, so the kids presume they should pee in them!

“he’s really stubborn and anxious and as soon as i push too much he just shuts down, same with the dummy”

Gently, OP, I’m afraid you have taught him that if he’s stubborn, then he’ll get his own way. At four and a half, he shouldn’t have a dummy - it’s not good for his teeth. I got rid of my Dd’s dummy by buying something she wanted (in her case, a doll) and putting it on the shelf in her room and saying, “This is for a big girl who doesn’t have a dummy.” Of course, she wanted it, so I said she would have to throw her dummy away - herself - in the bin, and then she could have it. Of course there were a few tears at bedtime! But I pointed out that she had her dolly now to take to bed, and it only took a couple of nights for it to be fine. So maybe there’s some truck or something that your DS would like, that you can “swap” the dummy for. He needs to throw it away, though, so you can remind him that he chose to do it and that now he’s a big boy who has (whatever the new toy is) instead.

This.

You're not talking about any SEN symptoms.

He may be a sensitive boy and I sympathise, I understand first hand what it's like, but it's not that unusual and you can't back away because of that and not teach him the basics.

Is he your youngest? How did you deal with your older children?

Is anything stressing him out at home?

Both my two had dummies at night through reception - after nights lying awake worrying id never get them off them, in the end i bribed them which worked. Think a lego person or hot wheels csr for every night without, then after a whole week something bigger they wanted.

My youngest was potty trained when started school, but regressed a few months in and wet himself everyday- as teacher didn't regular remind/make them go to the loo and he was too busy to go. Again bribed him, for every dry day, along with teacher asking him to go every break time etc - which worked!!

Same here, end of August and started school a week later. None of the kids will be 5 yet!

How on earth is 4 too young to expect a child to be out of nappies and not sucking on a dummy?

First and foremost if there is no SEN you need to take steps to get rid of dummy and toilet train.

He won't be the youngest. My eldest is a end of August baby. It was hard but eventually the age makes no difference.

I had my eldest do mornings only till October, then morning and lunch till December.

You could try and stagger?

The problem with not preparing a child for school is that while it may be stressful doing potty training (certainly was for my two) it gets much much more stressful once they are at school and it becomes apparent they are not ready.

you now have a stressed child and you aren’t in a position to remove the stress. Which is a much more difficult situation to be in.

dummy isn’t great but the potty training is the more important thing.

if your child “needs” the dummy at school or at bedtime you could consider using something like this instead - chewelry which is used for children with autism. It’s less obviously babyish.

https://www.chewelry.co.uk/

I would also seriously consider speaking to your GP or health visitor because if you have worked on potty training for bit and are having issues they may be able to help.

Mmm he is only a school aged child in England. Literally no where else in the world has a school starting age at 4 years old. In Scotland it is 5 and some children are nearly 6 due to the new deferring rules that have not been that long introduced. Some parents opt to send their 4.5 years children early, usually for their own reasons and not to benefit the child. 4 is Literally too young for all that is expected.

I have autistic twins, and my DS is nearly 16 years old and still in pull-ups, day and night. So I’m always on the lookout for an indication of SEN on posts like this.

However, from what you’ve said that doesn’t seem to obviously be the case.

If I’ve understood correctly, you’ve not made a concerted effort to potty-train, just tried “a bit”. Kindly OP, that’s not really on. It’s not fair to send a child to school without even trying to potty train them.

You’re also talking about him as if he’s much younger than his peers. None will be 5 already, unless their birthday is in the first week of September. All the children will turn 5 between September and the following August, so if anything, he’s turning 5 quite earlyish.

Do you think you tend to baby him, rather than encouraging him to develop independence?

Presumably he was OK at nursery but is now crying and clingy at school - why? Is it just the change of setting? Or have you potentially said anything to unsettle him “Mummy will miss you so much now you’re at big school” type of thing?

Nursery often don’t identify SEN so the fact he is “sensitive”, doesn’t like writing, still uses a dummy, and isn’t potty trained COULD all be potential indicators that something isn’t quite right. In isolation none are of particular concern but when put together it MIGHT indicate something more.

However, when you have a SEN child, it’s a process of elimination. We have to take positive steps to prove it’s not our parenting before SEN is considered. You need to get him toilet-trained as an urgent starting point, as well as figuring out why he’s suddenly clingy. Does he settle quickly? Does he cry when he sees you at pickup? Is he fretting about going back in the next day? All are important questions to consider if you think there’s a possible delay or SEN. But you really have to consider your parenting too and whether you’ve done what you should to get him to where he needs to be.

If you’re comfortable there’s no SEN, then you need to proactively help him to become independent and adopt a brisk approach to dropping him off, not “extra cuddles” which make separation harder.

It’s very, very early - Reception kids are still very young and it can take a while to settle.

If all else fails and it’s just not working, you can opt to home educate for a while. That would give you the extra year at home and you can put him back in school next year. However you’d have to put in the work to help him develop the necessary skills because otherwise by the time he rejoins school he’ll be even further behind in terms of his social development.

Why can’t you just bin the dummies tonight?

Every single one of reception start when they’re 4

Is he your youngest?

I think sometimes things have to get worse before they get better. Not all kids happily potty train at a point when they feel ready, they more likely have to be made to do it in a firm but kind way. Agree with the PP, I wouldn't worry about night nappies, there'll be others in his class that still use them at night.

I'm really confused that you appear so unclear of thing but have 4 other older boys?

It sounds a little like you've babied him as he's your last child and he knows if he puts up a bit of a fight you will back down?

even tried the little toilet seats and everything but he just refuses sometimes, will scream and cry and sometimes just wee in his pull up anyway.

if a pull up is an option, he will take it. Put him in pants.

First thing I’d do would be find every dummy in the house and bin them. Tell him the dummy fairy has taken them if you want to do that but get rid of the dummies tonight.

Then next weekend, toilet training. I’d just tell him he’s a big boy at school now and he has to go to the toilet. Get rid of the pull ups and put him in pants and a top. And if he wets his pants he will not like it coz it’ll be wet and cold.

You are doing him no favours babying him - and it’s not his fault you have 4 other children and your DH works. He needs you to parent him effectively.

"he barely slept and ended up grumpy and clingy at nursery."

.....let him be tired and grumpy for a few nights.

What you're describing doesn't sound like sensitivity to me. You're either babying him, or there is SEN at play, or both. What did nursery have to say about the potty training? If he's your 5th child you really should be a dab hand at potty training by now, or able to identify if something is amiss. I don't quite get why you've done nothing.

You need to stop with the mindset of “oh, I know it’s not idea but he’s only 4 and a half…” because before you know it he will be 5 and a half, still in nappies and sucking on a dummy because you don’t want to see him “stressed”.

Sometimes children have to do what they don’t want to do, and as parents the best thing you can do is guide them through that process not give in to it. Instead of giving in when he was “stressed” about going to the toilet, you should have persevered because now you’ve got another situation on your hands that he doesn’t like. He’s expecting you to give in, just like you always have, but this time you can’t so it’s probably confusing him and making it worse.

Honestly OP this is crazy and you should contact you health visitor, maybe some parenting classes or targeted support could be available. Lots of children are starting to be potty trained at 18 months, and would also be weaned off a dummy in the daytime at that age too.

without sounding awful this is entirely on you, it’s not a new thing they go to school at sept after 4, you’ve had plenty of time to get him ready. All children are differently and develop at different stages but you need to be doing more.

also the delaying a year is through the local authority not the school so you’ve been given incorrect advise from the wrong people.

being dry overnight isn’t an issue so don’t even have that on your radar. My just turned 4 year old (literally 2 weeks ago) also isn’t dry at night.

alot of children struggle with change, this has to be your focus, hope things improve

I might be wrong, but I was under the impression that kids could wait until age 5 to start school in the UK.

Maybe focus on getting rid of the dummy this weekend. We just went cold turkey and threw it straight in the bin. There will be tears, but he will also get over it pretty quickly.

Could you not send him to school for a week or 2 to sort out the potty training?

It’s hard when they don’t seem ready for school. My youngest (just turned 5) is incredibly babyish. Still talks in a baby voice, cries over everything, screams her head off when I leave. It’s hard, but there isn’t another option so she kind of has to get used to it.

I know it’s hard to see them upset etc though x