To think school should’ve let me keep ds4 back a year?

Stop giving in to him. He won't hate school because you've potty trained him, OP, come on. I'd speak to the school, keep him home for a weekend + say 3 days and concentrate on him and on potty training him. Also send dummy away "by post" and get Dummy Fairy to bring him a chocolate coin as a reward. Worked a treat with my DS who adored his dummy and found it hard to let go - but we did, at 2yo. Your other half needs to take on looking after the other boys and bring some extra help for a few days to allow you to actually focus on your son who needs you. You need to catch up where you have failed to help him, don't delay it because it's hard for you. He needs to learn, he's more stressed out now than he will be when he goes to school actually equipped.

You are letting him down badly by NOT pushing him and not being consistent. So what if he screams and cries at you? Your job isn’t to make his life sunshine and rainbows it’s to adequately prepare him for the world. You are a parent not a children’s entertainer. You have successfully taught him that if he screams and cries, you will give in to give yourself an easier time of it because fundamentally you have too many children for your level of resolve.

Parenting a sensitive child doesn’t mean you don’t push them, it means you have to expand their comfort zone further by gently and consistently putting them in situations that make them uncomfortable with lots of kindness and reassurance. Kindness doesn’t mean making everything better for them, it means supporting them to do hard things. ‘He can do the hard things’ needs to be your mantra with this kid from now on - he’s not going to break, you are making his life infinitely harder and less comfortable by not supporting him correctly.

Yes I seem to remember that when I started primary school in the late 70,s there' were at least two if not three intakes, I started in the September as I have a November birthday I think some kids stated after Xmas, and others might have Been after easter.

Just get pants. Pull ups, potty training pants are confusing. Just get pants. And stick him in them on Friday when he comes home from school. He’s four and a half. Over that. Come on.

And ditch the dummies tonight. If he’s tired and grumpy he’s tired and grumpy. He will sleep better then won’t he.

I do not understand why you’re so passive. It’s your literal job to get him ready for school and you’ve failed. Time for you to put on YOUR big girl pants and parent!!

Chew toys can be brilliant and undoubtedly have a place for children that need them, but they are in no way a substitute for a dummy. Chew toys and dummies provide completely different sensations and meet completely different sensory needs.

It’s also worth saying that even if some SEN is present, it is not a given that they have to be late to toilet train. Plenty of children with neurodiversity or mild learning delays or difficulties are capable of being toilet trained before 4 years old. Their physical development is not automatically affected, even if they need more time and teaching than other children.

He won’t hate school or have broken confidence, he will be just fine. And it is a battle you can and will win, you just have to be totally consistent and persist.

He isn't the youngest, he is roughly the middle.
DD1 is September born,DD2 June, so is towards the youngest. I definitely notice a difference between them in terms of independence, but this narrows as they move through school.

DD2 only toilet trained at nearly 4, due to digestive issues (now diagnosed coeliac but we didn't know this then), and also has some brain damage from birth. Reception was tough for her, but her school put in lots of extra support, she has just started year 2 and there is no difference between her and her peers. She is in the highest group for reading and maths, class monitor, got awards at end of year 1 for kindness and responsibility. Sometimes it just takes time and the right support from school, and they catch up. And sometimes as the youngest they can get used to being 'babied' by their siblings and they need space to develop independence.

Are children in Scotland typically still in nappies and using dummies at 4.5 years old? I don't think so.

Hardly any of them will be 5 yet. Unless they had a birthday last week they are all 4.

One of mine was not great with getting to the toilet for poos in reception, partly laziness, partly stubborn etc.

With him we made no fuss or attention but he had to get out his clean pants and he had to put his dirty pants into the utility room sink. We’d help with cleaning up if he really had smeared, but otherwise we gently directed. He soon realised that making the effort to go to the toilet was less effort than not.

Id be very much making it no option to go back to pull-ups during the day and going over to the pyjamas pants at night to make it very clear they are only for nights.

Act very bored and disinterested about accidents and get him to get the clean pants and put the dirty ones in the wash. He’s more than old enough to change his own pants and wash his hands etc.

it can be hard with the youngest for many reasons, but he’s going to be just fine with some strength from you and absolute resolve to get it done.

It actually makes a bit more sense now you say he has a younger brother - he probably wants the same attention you give to the baby.

Very often children cry while Mum's there and then as soon as she's gone they are fine. The trick is not to prolong saying goodbye.

Have you spoken to the teacher about your concerns?

When did you start potty training? Pull ups for extended use just encourages laziness he doesn't see why he should bother. He should be self dressing most can do the trousers/pants on/off before 3 .....do you feel he has a sen or have you actively supported independence? Often if you treat as a baby they continue as a baby. I'm querying it as you say just turned 4....he's nearer to 5 at 4 and 7 months I've never heard a parent say just turned after a month or two, when It's 4, 4 and a half or nearing 5.
Night time wetting is hormone controlled and isn't related, often not happening until 5 or older.
He will ask for a dummy until you remove it.

No wonder no has any resilience anymore 🤦🏻‍♀️

My son was late potty training at 3 and his pre school gave me some great tips at the time - we cracked it in a week. I'd get rid of the pull ups for day time immediately. Have night time 'pants' like the ninja pj pants but don't get the same brand/type as you used to use in day time.

Take him to your local shop and get him to choose his big boy going to school pants with his favourite design and then wear them consistently day in day out. Take him to the toilet every 20/30 minutes to get him used to using it. If he has an accident then not an issue, mop it up and carry on.

It'll click and the message needs to be big grown up boy, no pull ups in reserve for just in case.

Re the drop off. Kids pick up on parent feelings. So be bright and breezy all cbeebies smiles and really big up school over the weekend and Monday morning. Then at drop off just give off really positive vibes. If necessary he can help the teacher with a special job if you can get them involved.

All the best but you should have done the above months ago.

People are being unnecessarily horrible in these comments.

Up until a few months ago my four year old (May born) was very similar. He was wee trained but stool withholding to a degree that was becoming quite dangerous. We’d tried everything, were under paediatrics and had various different things to try from the doctors.

People fail to realise that a lot of children unfortunately don’t follow the ‘patterns’ that we all take for granted and hope for when we have children. I would talk to the school. Maybe discuss a phased entry if possible. If my child had continued to cry on entry etc I probably would have considered homeschooling or taking a hybrid approach.

Your concern for your child is not misplaced. We start children at school very young in the UK. I don’t think you’re wrong for feeling that it may be too soon for him. We don’t all follow a linear pattern.

I hope you find a plan that helps you as a family.

It was a far better system when they have jan intake for the younger July /aug born

where deferring for a year means will be the oldest in the class v some being really young and over a years diff

You ARE making excuses. My march born 4 year old had a dummy until his 4th birthday and wasn’t reliably potty trained until just after he turned 4 (weeks though, not months) so I’m not unsympathetic to having a stubborn toddler, he was very stubborn. But we found strategies because we knew how important it was to prepare him for school. It’s literally your main job as a parent and you have failed him.

Dummy: ‘you are a big boy now so can’t have your dummy at night time anymore, but let’s make it a special home so you can see it and say hi to it whenever you want to’ - £2.99 for a wooden box from The Works, he decorated it and his dummy now lives inside it on the windowsill where it’s ‘safe’. He is comforted knowing it’s there, but He’s not looked at it once.

Potty training: pants on, no pull ups from now on. Let him go to ASDA and pick a few packs of cool pants. Then, One chocolate button for a wee in the potty, 2 for a poo. No punishment if he has accidents, but no chocolate either. No chocolate or sweet treats at any other time. Then once he’s cracked it, pivot to one chocolate button at the end of the day if all wees and poos are on the potty. Leave overnight potty training until he’s consistently waking up with a completely dry pull up. Once you start, DO NOT put him back in a pull up during the day. He puts his pants on as soon as he gets dressed. Going backwards and forwards with it is incredibly confusing for him. you will have extra washing to do, so be it. By leaving it until school
you've made this extra hard for yourself so you will need to make yourself available to go into school during the day to change your child when he has accidents. Teachers are not nursery nurses.

Re: the potty training. I'd suggest swapping the pull ups for potty training pants, you still get a little bit of absorbency but they can't comfortably wet themselves like they can in pull ups. Worked a treat with my ASD son, still took a couple of months but letting him have nappies wasn't moving him forward at all.

Re: the dummy. Does he have it at all in the day time? I would be very very concerned about his teeth, do you take him to the dentist regularly? Would he respond to a "chew buddy" or similar? It might still give him the oral comfort but without being something you keep in your mouth for long periods.

I would certainly ask to speak to your schools Special Educational Needs Co-ordinator as this doesn't sound like neuro-typical behaviour and the school may be able to put some things in place to help him settle.

I have a lotof sympathy for you, I've been in a similar position seeing my son go into school crying everyday and it's heart breaking. We've finally got him going into school happily now he's in YR2 but my God it took so much work, meeting with the school, endles paperwork, trail and error before finding what he responded well to. It can be over whelming to even consider where to start, but help is out there for you and your son, you might just have to fight for it a bit first.

Literally not too young for all that is to be expected.

Children in other countries don't get potty trained and dummies removed aged 5 because they're starting school aged 6. They'll have been in an educational setting long before starting formal school.

OP - be honest - are you babying if he's your youngest? @BulletinGuru

As many people have already said, most children in other countries will still be in an educational setting at 4, and will still be expected to be toilet trained etc.

It does take boys longer to be dry at night. It’s a biological thing. I’ve a girl and boy. My daughter just decided she was done with nappies one day and that was that for night and day, my son was the same for during the day but him and his male friends all still had occasional night accidents until 7-9ish. So don’t worry too much about that. We swapped to reusable night time pants rather than pull ups, they are a bit more discreet.

Just give him time to settle in. My DC had occasional accidents when they started school, wasn't an issue (I just packed them spare pants/uniform to take with them just in case). They'd cry and be clingy at drop off time in the early days. It just takes time for them to settle in to a new place and new routine. My DS was the eldest in the year (birthday end of Sept), whilst my DD was the youngest (end of August). Both had gone to nursery pretty much FT before starting school, and both did fine with settling in after some short weeks and all was ok. Keep speaking to teachers and they'll know what to do with helping the Yr R kids to settle in and get used to things.