Page 6 | Confused by call from school

Stowawaysue · 02/09/2025 19:19

CaptainMyCaptain · 02/09/2025 19:10

I didn't do that and I was a teacher. My daughter read books because she liked reading but that was it.

You know those INSET days parents hate? One of the things teachers do is look at all the assessments, data, target setting and decide what needs to be done to improve results. They wouldn't have done that by the end of last term, that's why it's happening now.

Show quote history

How long ago?

Elisheva · 02/09/2025 19:16

I would definitely ask if the group is being taught by a qualified teacher and if not then I would (and did) ask for my child to be in the main class.
Yes, some TAs have teaching qualifications, yes some of them are brilliant and better than the actual teacher, but most of the time they are not.
The study that a pp referred to was the DISS Study (2009) which found that children who received support from a TA actually made less progress than those who didn’t.

Franpie · 02/09/2025 19:15

Fetaface · 02/09/2025 18:58

This has then resulted in there being year 4 kids in your DD’s class that due to their age are much quicker at maths. Teaching a subject like maths where the teacher tends to work at the pace of the slowest children is now causing an issue in the mixed class for the year 4’s.

This isn't what happens. They are all taught at the same pace. New learning for Y4 is the same pace as new learning for Y3. They don't work at the pace of the slowest children.

But if they are pulling out 10 of the children from a mixed class then that sounds like it would be most of the year 3 kids in that class.

CaptainMyCaptain · 02/09/2025 19:12

Fetaface · 02/09/2025 18:01

All primary school work in core subjects is differentiated by ability.

Nope it is not as that limits what children can achieve. If the kids who were working below expected standard always only ever got work that was below expected standard how could they ever get to expected? The curriculum is set that all children have the same work and it get progressively harder. Each question is slightly more challenging than the previous one.

Work is differentiated only for those who are working significantly below.

Typically, the teacher teaches to the middle group of kids. The higher end get given extra/harder work and expected to teach themselves with a bit of extra help from the teacher if they need it.

This is not so. Teachers teach to all children at the same time. It is a ping pong method of teach a little, do a little, teach a little, do a little. The teacher circulates and works with different groups. The higher children do not get extra or harder work. They all get the same unless significantly below.

Those who take longer to grasp something often get a 'pre teach' they get 10-15 minutes before the lesson going over the concept so they have some understanding before the lesson begins.

Edited

Things have changed drastically in the 10 years since I retired then. We had to differentiate all our planning 3 ways.

CaptainMyCaptain · 02/09/2025 19:10

Stowawaysue · 02/09/2025 18:15

Op you did nothing with her over the last 6 weeks

Many parents of a 7 yr old over the summer break would have done something over the past 6 weeks. I was no tiger mum but at this age… over the long summer break, yes we regularly did maths and reading.

My point is… it’s not surprising if she’s done nothing for 6 weeks that she may have been quite obviously below the pace that 2/3s of the class have demonstrated early on

I didn't do that and I was a teacher. My daughter read books because she liked reading but that was it.

You know those INSET days parents hate? One of the things teachers do is look at all the assessments, data, target setting and decide what needs to be done to improve results. They wouldn't have done that by the end of last term, that's why it's happening now.

SockFluffInTheBath · 02/09/2025 19:08

Sounds like you’d have been on the case if they’d told you in July OP, but a lot of parents wouldn’t, so it’s pointless as a catch up exercise. Better to let them come back to a new term and scoop them together. I’m sure your DD will soon be flying.

AhBiscuits · 02/09/2025 19:07

They did this with my son last year with reading. It was hugely beneficial and he's keeping up now.

Franpie · 02/09/2025 19:05

scorpiogirly · 02/09/2025 18:56

The mixed classes that seem to be a thing in this school though and I'm not sure why they do it. For instance, in year one, half of her class was mixed with Yr 2. Year 2. Her class was mixed with year 1. And now 2 year 3 classes are mixed with year 4.

Show quote history

Those mixes are normal for schools that mix classes.

Typically reception doesn’t mix if they can help it. Years 1 and 2 mix as they are Key Stage 1. Then years 3 and 4 mix as they are key stage 2. You wouldn’t mix year 2 and year 3 as they are in different key stages.

Carnation25 · 02/09/2025 19:04

Honestly I would tey and see the positives in this. Year 3 seems to be a key transition period between infants amd juniors and the pace of work does ratchet up. From personal experiwnce, my DD grasped new mathematical concepts at a slower pace than my DS, however once mastered she was very able at maths. Being part of a slower paced group at times worked very well for her. Ultimately they both achieved the same high grade for maths at GCSE.

Leedssdeel · 02/09/2025 19:01

scorpiogirly · 02/09/2025 15:28

So my daughter who is 7 just went back today in year 3.

I get a call half an hour before I'm due to collect her to ask me if it is okay if the teacher who helps out takes my dd in the mornings in a group of about 10 to do maths. Apparently not that she's going to be taught anything different, just taught slower. What the hell does this mean? It's her first day back and they have never said anything like this before and she has always seemed fine with maths.

They also always tend to have mixed classes. When I questioned it, apparently it is nothing to do with ability. But strangely, they have split two year 3 classes and 2 year 4 classes and mixed them together. Whats the point of that?

It’s an intervention group - it could be a few things . If her past reports show that she is not at the expected level , or is only just at it, that may be why . You would have been told the level she is working at during parents evenings and in her report.

If she is at expected , then it is highly likely that she is easily distracted and may need a smaller group so that she can work - this could be that she’s quiet and it’s a chatty class , that there are characters in the class who are distracting others and your daughter is one who is affected by this.

It could even be that your daughter is doing very well and showing promise and they believe with a bit of quiet and a little more targeted intervention she could do even better , maybe to go into exceeding.

Either way, the school are doing their job and adapting the teaching / environment so that your daughter can reach her potential. Absolutely no reason to be angry about this - be angry if they don’t support her when she needs it.

Fetaface · 02/09/2025 18:58

This has then resulted in there being year 4 kids in your DD’s class that due to their age are much quicker at maths. Teaching a subject like maths where the teacher tends to work at the pace of the slowest children is now causing an issue in the mixed class for the year 4’s.

This isn't what happens. They are all taught at the same pace. New learning for Y4 is the same pace as new learning for Y3. They don't work at the pace of the slowest children.

Original poster

scorpiogirly · 02/09/2025 18:56

Franpie · 02/09/2025 18:52

So I would assume the mixed classes is because they have say 45 children in year 3 and 45 children in year 4. So they have mixed the classes in order to have maximum children to teacher ratio.

This has then resulted in there being year 4 kids in your DD’s class that due to their age are much quicker at maths. Teaching a subject like maths where the teacher tends to work at the pace of the slowest children is now causing an issue in the mixed class for the year 4’s.

The fix has been to take the year 3 kids out and teach them at a pace that suits them. This would also explain why your DD’s maths ability has never been raised with you before. Because, for her age, her maths is fine.

Show quote history

The mixed classes that seem to be a thing in this school though and I'm not sure why they do it. For instance, in year one, half of her class was mixed with Yr 2. Year 2. Her class was mixed with year 1. And now 2 year 3 classes are mixed with year 4.

OP posts:

Original poster

scorpiogirly · 02/09/2025 18:54

InMyShowgirlEra · 02/09/2025 17:06

I'd have to see the details of this study.

Typically, the teacher teaches to the middle group of kids. The higher end get given extra/harder work and expected to teach themselves with a bit of extra help from the teacher if they need it. The lower group work separately with the TA because they need adult support to access it.

The group with the TA are already making slower progress which is why they need the TA. Unless this has been accounted for the study results are obvious.

OP- Has she been meeting ARE all through school? It is strange that she would suddenly be put in this group for extra support if she's met expectations in maths previously.

If not, you may have misunderstood previous reports. When I was a new teacher I had a few occasions sitting in front of a parent and talking about their child and the support in place for them only for the parent to suddenly ask why their child needed support. I'd incorrectly assumed that the parent was aware that their child was miles behind and needing significant support in class, when actually, they'd read "Working towards expected levels" as "About average" and had no idea.

Show quote history

Nothing has been mentioned about ARE. In fact, I have never heard them mention this. Every report or interaction has been that she's doing great. Nothing to report. This is why I'm a little concerned.

OP posts:

Franpie · 02/09/2025 18:52

scorpiogirly · 02/09/2025 15:28

So my daughter who is 7 just went back today in year 3.

I get a call half an hour before I'm due to collect her to ask me if it is okay if the teacher who helps out takes my dd in the mornings in a group of about 10 to do maths. Apparently not that she's going to be taught anything different, just taught slower. What the hell does this mean? It's her first day back and they have never said anything like this before and she has always seemed fine with maths.

They also always tend to have mixed classes. When I questioned it, apparently it is nothing to do with ability. But strangely, they have split two year 3 classes and 2 year 4 classes and mixed them together. Whats the point of that?

So I would assume the mixed classes is because they have say 45 children in year 3 and 45 children in year 4. So they have mixed the classes in order to have maximum children to teacher ratio.

This has then resulted in there being year 4 kids in your DD’s class that due to their age are much quicker at maths. Teaching a subject like maths where the teacher tends to work at the pace of the slowest children is now causing an issue in the mixed class for the year 4’s.

The fix has been to take the year 3 kids out and teach them at a pace that suits them. This would also explain why your DD’s maths ability has never been raised with you before. Because, for her age, her maths is fine.

Stowawaysue · 02/09/2025 18:51

Crazybigtoe · 02/09/2025 18:43

Haha hahahaha that's batshit advice.

Show quote history

Where is the “advice” ?

im explaining a possible reason why not mentioned 6 weeks ago 🤷‍♀️

Crazybigtoe · 02/09/2025 18:43

Stowawaysue · 02/09/2025 18:15

Op you did nothing with her over the last 6 weeks

Many parents of a 7 yr old over the summer break would have done something over the past 6 weeks. I was no tiger mum but at this age… over the long summer break, yes we regularly did maths and reading.

My point is… it’s not surprising if she’s done nothing for 6 weeks that she may have been quite obviously below the pace that 2/3s of the class have demonstrated early on

Haha hahahaha that's batshit advice.

Sunshineismyfavourite · 02/09/2025 18:42

Remember that there will always be a 'first time' parents hear this type of thing. It's not really helpful to be annoyed about why you haven't heard it before.

There will have been grouping, assessing and planning over the holidays and clearly, they have noticed that your DD could do with some extra help. There is a BIG divide often between Y2 and Y3 - what is acceptable at end of Y2 is often a big jump away from Y3 standard. I would have some faith that the Y3 team know what they are doing. Be thankful that they have picked something up and are able to address it to support your DD.

SomeOfTheTrouble · 02/09/2025 18:37

Stowawaysue · 02/09/2025 18:15

Op you did nothing with her over the last 6 weeks

Many parents of a 7 yr old over the summer break would have done something over the past 6 weeks. I was no tiger mum but at this age… over the long summer break, yes we regularly did maths and reading.

My point is… it’s not surprising if she’s done nothing for 6 weeks that she may have been quite obviously below the pace that 2/3s of the class have demonstrated early on

Really? I’ve never done any formal work with my primary aged children over the holidays. Both got Greater Depth across the board in KS2 SATs. Holidays were for playing/chilling.

OneMintWasp · 02/09/2025 18:33

My daughter had this once in Y4 as she was slipping from greater depth to meeting expectation and they wanted to keep her in the higher level.
Edited to say presume she had sats at the end of Y2 so perhaps just at the lower end of her grade so they want to focus on it

TaupeMember · 02/09/2025 18:21

Haha, the amount of conflicting info and advice on this thread 😂

Speak to the teacher op, and ask for more info

Stowawaysue · 02/09/2025 18:15

Op you did nothing with her over the last 6 weeks

Many parents of a 7 yr old over the summer break would have done something over the past 6 weeks. I was no tiger mum but at this age… over the long summer break, yes we regularly did maths and reading.

My point is… it’s not surprising if she’s done nothing for 6 weeks that she may have been quite obviously below the pace that 2/3s of the class have demonstrated early on

Manxexile · 02/09/2025 18:14

@scorpiogirly - "... If I had known we could have worked on it over the holidays."

She's only just started year 3.

Perhaps the school thought it would be better for her to enjoy the summer holiday rather than be coached in maths?

mindutopia · 02/09/2025 18:12

It’s weird they’ve asked and on day 1, but it’s normal. My Y3 is in one for reading. It’s just a smaller group with more support. No one ever asked permission though, just informed us at parents evening.

Redburnett · 02/09/2025 18:08

This is just one anecdote from a long time ago but when my DS was in primary school it was suddenly suggested that he should have extra maths help in school, in addition to the regular lessons. Maths had never been raised as an issue before. I asked what he would be missing, the answer was art. I said no, I didn't want him to miss art, which he enjoyed, to do extra maths. He got an A at GCSE several years later (A being the second to highest grade at that time).

Goldengirl123 · 02/09/2025 18:05

That’s good for your daughter to get extra help